2008 AWD - What does the snow button do

[HondaGal]

I have searched in the manual but I can't find anything that tells me really what this option does, other than where the button is.

Does it only work at certain speeds?

[To Infiniti and Beyond]

Dealer to me it is to lock the wheels into four wheel drive rather than AWD, which puts power to the wheels that need it most apparently. However, when I used the snow button on the latest 'dusting' we had this week - I got stuck. Now - I was on my way to get new snows and rims on BTW - but you'd think a snow button would actually get you out of snow!

[ramprun]

if it locked into 4 wheels drive then the power is split 50/50, whereas if you don't have it on then the system will distribute maximum 50% to the front if it isn't slipping but if you are still slipping beyond that point then i don't really know if the system has anything up it's sleeve to recover itself.

[EXceptional]

Activating the Snow Button just reduces Wheel Spin should the Driver be too aggresive with the Gas Pedal, while trying to get out of a "Stuck" or "Icy" condition.

Good Drivers know that you don't want Wheel-Spin in the Snow. Wheel-Spin just melts the Snow and creates Ice, thus decreasing your Traction considerably. This is what we all learned in Winter Driving 101, folks.

In the 2008 EX35 Owners Manual... Section 2, on Page 40, it explains what the Snow Button does...

For driving or starting the vehicle on snowy roads or slippery areas, turn on the SNOW mode switch. The indicator light (s1) on the switch will illuminate. When the SNOW mode is activated, engine output is controlled to avoid wheel spin.

Turn off the SNOW mode for normal driving.

If you own a AWD-EX35... when you start out from a dead-stop, all 4 Wheels are turning with Power to them... and then as your Car gains speed, if the Computer is not detecting any slippage... then the Car slowly turns itself into a RWD Car.

The Front Wheels come on each and every time you start from a dead Stop and then slowly turn off. On a AWD-EX35 you have always have power to the Rear Wheels and part-time Power to the Front Wheels when starting out or when travelling, during a traction slippage condition.

If there is still some slippage, the Front Wheels will remain engaged until which time there is no slippage anymore.

If you still have the 2008 EX35 Sale Brochure, there's two Pages that helps explain the Intelligent All-Wheel-Drive system.

More than likely, why you guys are getting stuck... is because of the crappy OEM-Dunlops.

We just got a huge dump of Snow here, and our EX35 plows through Drifts like they weren't even there... all the while still running the crappy Dunlops.

I can't wait to see how this thing does in the Winter, once we get some real Tires.
Modified by EXceptional at 9:20 AM 12/14/2009

[EXceptional]

--> CLICK HERE <--

This Video explains the "Intelligent All-Wheel Drive".

Why they used a 2009 FX50 for this, while you're in the 2010 EX35 On-line Brochure, is beyond me... but anyways, the Video explains how the system works.
Modified by EXceptional at 1:11 PM 12/14/2009

[ramprun]

so in the AWD EX35, if we engaged snow mode, it will only reduced the power but not lock it into 4 wheels drive?

[EXceptional]

Correct.

Try it next time... with the Snow Button activated, mash the Gas Pedal. You'll notice that your EX35 doesn't have the get up and go it normally has, cause the overall power to the Wheels has been reduced, somewhat.

This action only takes place when starting out from a Dead Stop.

The Driver cannot select which Wheels get "locked up". The Car's Computer does that for you.


Modified by EXceptional at 10:25 AM 12/14/2009

[HondaGal]

I appreciate the response. And someone with Canadian prairie winters helps to!

[AWGD8]

How come mine doesn`t say Snow Mode on the center switch? I have

AWD?

Everytime I turn that center button, the power gets tripled! The button says "Boost Dude!"

[specialist23]

Correct.

Try it next time... with the Snow Button activated, mash the Gas Pedal. You'll notice that your EX35 doesn't have the get up and go it normally has, cause the overall power to the Wheels has been reduced, somewhat.

This action only takes place when starting out from a Dead Stop.

The Driver cannot select which Wheels get "locked up". The Car's Computer does that for you.

Modified by EXceptional at 10:25 AM 12/14/2009

see this is really weird. i've had many infiniti awd vehicles and this is the ONLY one that DOESN'T do that. i know exactly what you mean in that the power is "retarded/limited" so to not slip but in our ex, it's an 08 for what it's worth, there is no "retarding/limiting" the power at all. it just goes like other systems. i.e. bmw/audi.

[EXceptional]

Maybe yours isn't working properly ?

Excerpt taken out of the EX35 Service Manual, Section EC, Page 473

SNOW MODE SWITCHDescription INFO-ID: 0000000003133663

The snow mode is used for driving or starting the vehicle on snowy roads or slippery areas. If the snow mode is activated, the vehicle speed will not be accelerated immediately than your original pedal in due to avoid the vehicle slip.

In other words, ECM controls the rapid engine torque change by controlling the electric throttle control actuator operating speed.
Modified by EXceptional at 10:03 AM 12/15/2009

[EXceptional]

Maybe what happens... once your foot comes off the Brake Pedal and then goes over to the Gas Pedal... if you make your first, initial contact with the Gas Pedal and hold it, the Car will just gradually accelerate.

If you make you first, initial contact with the Gas Pedal and then lets say a second later, push down on it a little harder, the Snow Mode will disregard that harder, second input... and will only allow the Car to gently accelerate, using the input of your first, initial contact with the Gas Pedal.

It's all in efforts to prevent Wheel Spin.

[yutpeckc]

After driving in on of Vancouver's worst snow storm with my EX35, I learned a few tricks regarding the Snow Button.

First of all, during typical snowy roads, if your car isn't stuck, it is best to activate the Snow Mode. It will do its best to distribute power to the wheel with maximum grip, therefore preventing skidding on snow.

However, once you're stuck, DON'T USE THE SNOW MODE. As mentioned, the Snow Mode will distribute power to the wheel with maximum traction, while distributing almost NO POWER to the wheels without traction. If all four wheels don't have traction, the Snow Mode will automatically stop the car. You won't be able to accelerate because none of the wheels have traction. I've tired this before. I kept accelerating but it just seemed to stall and not move. In this case, return to regular driving mode where it will move all four wheels regardless, therefore increasing your chance of escaping.

[EXceptional]

I'm blown away by how many people think that the "Snow Button" alters how the Wheels get their power.

The "Intelligent All-Wheel-Drive System" decides which Wheels get the power... it's certainly NOT done by the Driver flipping Switches on the Console.

Obviously yutpeckc, you don't understand Infiniti's description of how the "Snow Mode Button" works. Feel free to re-read the descriptions above, from both the Owner's Manual and the Service Manual.
Modified by EXceptional at 1:01 AM 12/17/2009

[ramprun]

if your description were correct then snow mode will help you get out of snow when you are stuck. what is the point of putting power to the wheel that has no traction. after reading Exceptional's comment, i think he is right about the snow mode.

[EXceptional]

I made some changes to your post, so yutpeckc understands who you are talking about...

yutpeckc...if your description were correct, then snow mode will help you get out of snow when you are stuck. what is the point of putting power to the wheel that has no traction.

after reading Exceptional's comment, i think he is right about the snow mode.

[ramprun]

well thank you, Exceptional. i just found this on youtube and it is interesting. i don't know how our EX compare to these SUVs.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ooQRxlChvMw
Modified by ramprun at 11:48 AM 12/17/2009

[AWGD8]

I'm blown away by how many people think that the "Snow Button" alters how the Wheels get their power.

The "Intelligent All-Wheel-Drive System" decides which Wheels get the power... it's certainly NOT done by the Driver flipping Switches on the Console.

Obviously yutpeckc, you don't understand Infiniti's description of how the "Snow Mode Button" works. Feel free to re-read the descriptions above, from both the Owner's Manual and the Service Manual.

Modified by EXceptional at 1:01 AM 12/17/2009

And when stuck, turn VDC off too!

[EXceptional]

And when stuck, turn VDC off too!

Only if you need maximum power from the Engine.

Here are some notes from the Owners Manual...

VEHICLE DYNAMIC CONTROL (VDC) SYSTEM

When accelerating or driving on slippery surfaces, the tires may spin or slide.

With the Vehicle Dynamic Control (VDC) system, sensors detect these movements and control the braking and engine output to help improve vehiclestability.

When the VDC system is operating, the SLIP indicator in the instrument panelblinks.

If the SLIP indicator blinks, the road conditions are slippery. Be sure to adjust your speed and driving to these conditions. Be sure to drive carefully.

If a malfunction occurs in the system, the SLIP and VDC OFF indicator lights illuminate in the instrument panel. As long as these indicators are illuminated, the VDC system function is canceled.

The VDC system uses an Active Brake Limited Slip (ABLS) function to improve vehicle traction.

The ABLS system works when one of the driving wheels is spinning on a slippery surface.

The ABLS system brakes the spinning wheel, which distributes the driving power to the other drive wheel. If the vehicle is operated with the VDC OFF switch pushed and the VDC system turned off, all VDC systems will be turned off.

The ABLS system and ABS will still operate with the VDC system off. If the ABLS system is activated, the SLIP indicator will blink and you may hear a clunk noise and/or feel a pulsation in the brake pedal. This is normal and is not an indication of a malfunction.

[AWGD8]

Only if you need maximum power from the Engine.

Here are some notes from the Owners Manual...

VEHICLE DYNAMIC CONTROL (VDC) SYSTEM

When accelerating or driving on slippery surfaces, the tires may spin or slide.

With the Vehicle Dynamic Control (VDC) system, sensors detect these movements and control the braking and engine output to help improve vehiclestability.

When the VDC system is operating, the SLIP indicator in the instrument panelblinks.

If the SLIP indicator blinks, the road conditions are slippery. Be sure to adjust your speed and driving to these conditions. Be sure to drive carefully.

If a malfunction occurs in the system, the SLIP and VDC OFF indicator lights illuminate in the instrument panel. As long as these indicators are illuminated, the VDC system function is canceled.

The VDC system uses an Active Brake Limited Slip (ABLS) function to improve vehicle traction.

The ABLS system works when one of the driving wheels is spinning on a slippery surface.

The ABLS system brakes the spinning wheel, which distributes the driving power to the other drive wheel. If the vehicle is operated with the VDC OFF switch pushed and the VDC system turned off, all VDC systems will be turned off.

The ABLS system and ABS will still operate with the VDC system off. If the ABLS system is activated, the SLIP indicator will blink and you may hear a clunk noise and/or feel a pulsation in the brake pedal. This is normal and is not an indication of a malfunction.

The reason why most 4runner don`t have a chance when get stuck IN THE SNOW is that the old models don`t have that option to flip the switch and turn the dynamic control off... When you get stuck, and you have the VDC on, when you spin the tires, the ABS or brake will kick in and you`ll lose the momentum... You then at the mercy of 3 more tires left... then the 2nd tire spinS, ABS kicks in. Now, you have 2 tires left.. 3rd tire spins , ABS kicks in now down to one tire. The last tire spins, ABS kicks in...then You are FU..kd!. When you turn the VDC off that means the car won`t automatically applies the break(when the tires spin) and won`t loss the momentum. (That means you can do the normal rocking manuever --- forward, backward, forward, backward without losing momentum...the rocking manuever actually gives you momentum)

This has been discussed in one of the Toyota forum (When I was an active member).

Here`s the link from Canada DOT

http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/roadsa...2.htm

Pls. read traction control and stability control topic below:

http://www.caranddriver.com/fe...ature
Modified by AWGD8 at 4:20 PM 12/17/2009

[EXceptional]

I guess your example would be if you were plowing through deep Snow. You need to keep your momentum up.

If you're stuck on a Icy patch, then I could see the VDC-ABS coming in handy.

Are you saying when the ABS comes on, it STOPS the Wheel completely, it doesn't just slow it down in little pulses... all the while the system is analyzing whether it has traction or not ?

I guess the only way to try this out, is to go and get stuck.

This is very interesting dialogue.

P.S. I'm taking little breaks in between painting Rooms in the House... so when I get a chance later, I'll read those links of yours.
Modified by EXceptional at 3:32 PM 12/17/2009

[AWGD8]

This only applies when you are stuck and car is not moving at all...but you can rock the car back and forth, like the good old days! But to rock the car, you need a little bit of tire spin and this vdc hinders it. It will apply the break into the spinning tire automatically without you even knowing it. No pulsation bec. car is not moving more than 5MPH....or no momentum at all....

[EXceptional]

Gotcha...

What an educational Thread !

[ramprun]

any comment on how well EX35 AWD would do against something like subaru in the youtube clilp?

[AWGD8]

any comment on how well EX35 AWD would do against something like subaru in the youtube clilp?

I guess nothing beats an all-time AWD like the Subaru and most car with All-time AWD in snow.

Our AWD is changing every fraction of sec....depending on where the most available grip on the tires. (front or back or both). This fraction of sec. is enough to steer the car sideways and get loose a bit. If you overreact to it then might cause a problem. Try this, if there are enough snow on the road, go to an empty parking lot. TuRN VDC off, from stop, drive slowly around 5MPH then try to abruptly make a sharp turn and while half the turn floor or half press the gas pedal (as if you want the rear to break loose). You`ll see the rear will break loose as if 100% of power is on the REAR and then the front tires grip and your in control again (this happens in a fraction of sec)... this fraction of sec. our car can be 100% rear wheel drive...whereas all time AWD, they don`t get that margin of error...

Even from stop, on a snow filled road. Try to smash the throttle and the rear will break loose a bit in a fraction of sec...then the front wheel engaged afterwards.....

[ramprun]

i don't know what kind of AWD we have. Is intelligent AWD the same thing as all-time AWD. in another word, is the EX35 AWD as good as Subaru's counterpart.

[AWGD8]

Ours is not All-time AWD. Our EX35 isn`t AWD when driving on dry road, it only kicks in or engage when it senses slippage or lost of traction. Same story on snowy road...So that means we have that window of error waiting for the aggressive, overconfident driver who thinks he`s EX35 is a tank in snow! LOL!

Subaru and other All-time AWD have all the wheels turning on it`s own, no matter what the road condition is. It does vary the torque distribution on each wheels like ours though. The best way to differentiate ours vs the Subaru AWD is when driving off road.

Check the video below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...lated

When one of the subaru tire is lifted up (no contact with the ground) it still turning on it`s own. It doesn`t matter which tire it is, it will have it`s own power. I think with the EX35, when the front tire is lifted up, it will not turn on itself, but will redistribute power to the other tires that have contact with the ground....Hope this makes sense.

here is a good link:

http://www.rubicon-trail.com/4....html

Ours is basically called AUTOMATIC AWD (BASICALLY, an intelligent 2WD.


Modified by AWGD8 at 3:34 PM 12/19/2009

[zozoka1212]

Interesting thread.

Attesa awd is one of the best. Few reason why I like it. Not full time AWD and RWD biased. Lets you have some fun with tailing out and still leaves no doubt about the control over the car.

Other similar system is the BMW X drive. However the Attesa more efficient. They tested the G35X vs 335Xi vs CTS vs not sure there was 2 more. No Subi there was only entry luxury sedan. The G35X did the best snow and did the best acceleration out of all.

These tests don't do much to me tho. But the Attesa AWD system has no problem to pass it.

Most older version AWD system lacked of controll. Like Audi Torsen was the same way. Although people say the Quatro is one of the best behind Subaru.

Check this out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...lated

The newer version of Audis have no problem to pass this test.

I love the X for 1 reason it gives you the control and lets you have fun with tailing out a little. Of course VDC off in snow = even more fun.

I believe EX is the same as G. Snow mode is 50/50 AWD till 12mph (19km/h) than switches back to RWD till slipp detected.

Few sensors help to maintain the ballance. ABS sensor checking the 100 times a second each wheels. more than 5% of the rotation differences and it kicks in.

There are pros and cons with each AWD system. Inteligent AWD system gives you better gasmilage vs full time AWD safer. Choice is in everybody's hand. I believe Subaru is working on their inteligent AWD system.

You can't go wrong with any of them.

They all great.

AWD rocks.

[NJ_EX35]

We had a terrible ice/snow storm here a few years ago and my G35x was stuck. I could not get it out of the 4-6 inches of ice/snow it was sitting in. I went inside read the manual and I turned off the VDC button and Snow button and the car just popped out of the ice no problem. I assume it is the same with the EX35... so if you ever get stuck turn off the VDC to get out, just be careful you do not launch yourself into something that will damage the beautiful EX! We are getting a big storm here tonight 6-12 inches so I will be taking the EX out for a stroll tonight to Dunkin Donuts for some hot coffee!

[EXceptional]

I went inside read the manual and I turned off the VDC button and Snow button and the car just popped out of the ice no problem.

They put this switch in such a dumb spot... it's as if they don't want you to use it, very much.

It's located on the left side of the Steering Column, below the AFS Switch, way down low on the Dash.
Modified by EXceptional at 11:07 AM 12/19/2009