(1st post) 350Z twin turbo Kit on an M35?

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(1st post) 350Z twin turbo Kit on an M35?

Postby wingFeather » Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:28 am

Hello everyone!

I've just been seduced by the new M

I almost signed for one last night, but I had too many unanswered questions before writing the check

Has anyone in the Nissan/Infiniti community installed the 350Z twin turbo Kit on an M35? Z, G and M - They utilize the same motor, right? So why not the same turbo kit?

Also, what gas mileage have other owners seen? I believe R&T (or C&D ) observed 15MPG?!

Please forgive me if its a sin to mod an M. The stock performance was great but could be better

WF


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Postby PalmerWMD » Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:50 am

No one has done it yet, BUT tons of folks have done it with this engine..on 350Z/G35C

-Same VQ35de w/ RWD orientation-nearly same ECU due to similiar emissions standards for 06 and powerlevel consistent with 350Z/G35-very similiar engine mounting, with if anything, a bit more room with M35 vs G35/350Z-G35 Sedan, another FM Chassis Sedan, like M35, has been supercharged, single turboed and twinturboed.-A reflash of M35 ecu isnt available (yet) which would be nice for extra safety but many many folks have had lots of reliable forced induction miles w/o ECU reflash...-Even 06 ECU issues arent all that, cuz you can use standard piggy backs if no reflash available.

While like I said,... no one has done it before,..yet..but I dont see any reason at all ,why there should be any diffciulty of siginificance.Also the G35C and 350Z TT kits have different intercooler arrangements due to different airflow in front valence.. I would think one of them would likely fit without too much pipe bending (if any)

Somebody has to be first.

Fred..

PS: Welcome to Nico!!..

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Re: (1st post) 350Z twin turbo Kit on an M35? (wingFeather)

Postby maxnix » Thu Jul 21, 2005 10:58 am

I have to say if you are not happy with M35, get the M45.

Performance with ease.

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Postby PalmerWMD » Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:06 am

If you want performance with ease, yes the M45 is the better choice.

BUT if you want REAL high performance, the plethora of aftermarket for the VQ35de as in G35/350Z, is SO large the sky is the limit.

I predict many many perforamnce parts will fully transfer over.

The VK45de out of the M45 has no forced induction kits available on the market right now at all..

the Vq35de in the M35 can be gotten to 400-450 hp w/o internal upgrades...

This would make it a significantly faster car than the M45.

And if you are willing to upgrade internals A greddy TT kit on a VQ with fortified internals will yield an easy 500-600 hp.

So in a way if you crave a LOT of performance the M35 is more straightforward IMO (of course these mods would make the price advantage over the M45 evaporate)

Fred..

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Re: (PalmerWMD)

Postby wingFeather » Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:52 am

Thanks for the welcome

PalmerWMD: Interesting observations about the engines... I appreciate it as I am still a Nissan newb! I wasn't even aware that Gs had been turbo/ supercharged.

BTW, I was NOT happy with the M45. The 45 I drove was $10K more & felt the same. From what I read afterwards, the V8 is only 1 second quicker in the quarter mile. Contrast that to the possibilities of an M35 + a $10K turbo kit (perhaps).

WF

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby szh » Thu Jul 21, 2005 12:43 pm

wingFeather wrote:Thanks for the welcome

PalmerWMD: Interesting observations about the engines... I appreciate it as I am still a Nissan newb! I wasn't even aware that Gs had been turbo/ supercharged.

BTW, I was NOT happy with the M45. The 45 I drove was $10K more & felt the same. From what I read afterwards, the V8 is only 1 second quicker in the quarter mile. Contrast that to the possibilities of an M35 + a $10K turbo kit (perhaps).
Welcome to NICO!

Yes, each approach has their pros and cons. Between a stock M35 and a stock M45, I would definitely go with the M45. Particularly since I do not really modify my cars! Although I am disappointed that the Keuylian Supercharger is not available anymore for the 2003 M45 I have!

However, if I was into making real changes and improvements, then I would indeed consider the M35 as the base to start from. But, I guess my final thought is that if I was going for the ultimate in performance and tweaks, etc., I would start with a 350Z and upgrade it rather than a M35. Like Fred (palmerwmd) has done - check out his sig for more info!

Z

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby TXSJaybird » Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:34 pm

wingFeather wrote:Thanks for the welcome

PalmerWMD: Interesting observations about the engines... I appreciate it as I am still a Nissan newb! I wasn't even aware that Gs had been turbo/ supercharged.

BTW, I was NOT happy with the M45. The 45 I drove was $10K more & felt the same. From what I read afterwards, the V8 is only 1 second quicker in the quarter mile. Contrast that to the possibilities of an M35 + a $10K turbo kit (perhaps).

WF
The M45 felt the same??? I highly have to disagree.

I test drove them both and they were night and day difference.

Someone already desribed it best....the M35 rallyed and whined to get up to speed, the M45 got there quicker and effortlessly.

No comparison my man. Perhaps you should retest them. Trust me, I WANTED to like the M35 better for my pocketbook, but after driving the M45.....game over!

Jay

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Re: (TXSJaybird)

Postby elwesso » Thu Jul 21, 2005 3:44 pm

If your the type of person that likes to mod cars, i would go with the M35 with the VQ.. So much aftermarket and I dont see why all of it wouldnt transfer over it.. I forsee people doing manual tranny swaps in the M as well...

Whatever you decide let us konw.....

However, id still prefer to see more people buying the M45...

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Re: (TXSJaybird)

Postby wingFeather » Fri Jul 22, 2005 6:04 am

TXSJaybird wrote: Perhaps you should retest them.
I'd need to find another dealer to go to. This one was high pressure... no brochure, kept saying that if I was serious I'd just sign for the car already. They didn't even give back my keys after they checked out my trade Is this usual?

Also: I did the drives on different days. You're probably correct in back-to-back testing.

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby elwesso » Fri Jul 22, 2005 6:07 am

Wow thats odd to hear, id find another dealer.....! Infiniti dealerships are notoroiuosly good...

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby szh » Fri Jul 22, 2005 7:17 am

wingFeather wrote:I'd need to find another dealer to go to. This one was high pressure... no brochure, kept saying that if I was serious I'd just sign for the car already. They didn't even give back my keys after they checked out my trade Is this usual?
Like Wes said, that is very strange for an Infiniti dealer! They are usually never that aggressive in their sales methods.

Plus, consider never talking about a trade till you are done dealing with the purchase - if asked, just say that you are not trading it in. After the purchase price is settled, then, and only then, should you bring it up and negotiate separately to get a good price for it.

Or consider selling it yourself - you will always get a lot more for it, since the dealer cannot buy it at a good market value (he cannot sell it for that later!). For example, two years ago, when I sold my 1995 Q45, the dealer was only willing to give me about $3.5k for it in trade (although I did not bother to negotiate since I knew I wanted to sell it myself.) I sold it instead for $7.5k in a private sale. Big difference!

Z

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Re: (szhosain)

Postby TXSJaybird » Fri Jul 22, 2005 12:54 pm

szhosain wrote:
Like Wes said, that is very strange for an Infiniti dealer! They are usually never that aggressive in their sales methods.

Plus, consider never talking about a trade till you are done dealing with the purchase - if asked, just say that you are not trading it in. After the purchase price is settled, then, and only then, should you bring it up and negotiate separately to get a good price for it.

Or consider selling it yourself - you will always get a lot more for it, since the dealer cannot buy it at a good market value (he cannot sell it for that later!). For example, two years ago, when I sold my 1995 Q45, the dealer was only willing to give me about $3.5k for it in trade (although I did not bother to negotiate since I knew I wanted to sell it myself.) I sold it instead for $7.5k in a private sale. Big difference!

Z
Good advice Z. Right on the money. NEVER talk trade in with the dealer until the price has been established for their car. Its one of the oldest tricks in the book.

Auto dealers make their money on the majority of the people who DONT do any research, and just believe them when they say its a good deal. I find this particularly incomprehensable, but so many people are afraid of dealers.

Go test drive one again, and if the salesdork starts with the pressure, kindly ask him to talk to his manager and get another one. Even the BEST dealerships have bad apples.

BTW, Im closing in on my M45. Working a few dealers around town....hopefully i'll get a good deal on the 31st! (since the car is new, they are not budging much, hoping to get some add ons thrown in)

Jay

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Re: (TXSJaybird)

Postby szh » Fri Jul 22, 2005 2:17 pm

TXSJaybird wrote:BTW, Im closing in on my M45. Working a few dealers around town....hopefully i'll get a good deal on the 31st! (since the car is new, they are not budging much, hoping to get some add ons thrown in)
Good Stuff™!

If possible, find one who has a bunch on the lot ... then they are eager to sell since they probably have more coming in. The pressure should be on them to sell, not on you to buy! If you can wait, or simply brush aside all the concerns that they think you have, you will do better in the negotiation!

Z

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Postby 350zQ45a » Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:40 pm

Lots of people don't like the Z because of the engine, the drone it makes, and the effort it puts out at higher rpms. Of course here you constantly get the well you can mod it that means its better!

Yea 400-450 hp with upgraded internals. Fred says that is if its jsut something simple. You are looking at 10,000 + labor. You are looking at eventually probably saying goodbye to your engine.

They have supercharged the VK using twin screw type in the old F50. They were making 450 hp on stock ecu and exhaust. No internal work or anything.

The Vq cant touch it. Vq is a fine engine, but VK is better.

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Postby 350zQ45a » Sat Jul 23, 2005 2:44 pm

The reason the VK has no aftermarket is because of the cars it is in.

If nissan would put this engine in the Z it would be in instant development for everything. It's not like the VQ is some miracle engine, its simply in the Z and by default it gets the development.

It's still basically a maxed out engine from the factory with supercharging. Again fred will mention the SP Z running 12s, of course its trap speed is 106 which is barely what a stock supra can run. They also spent a fortune on that car.

There is basically a 300 hp floor on the VQ. If you look at all the NA mods and added them up it would be more like 325-350 hp, but the mods are not cumulative, they tend to run out at 300 hp. You wont get 5 hp and 10 hp here and there you might get 20 hp total, and you will spend a fortune.

Plenty of people spending 10,000 on NA mods and they still have eseentially the same perf as they did stock.

Just buy a M45

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Re: (350zQ45a)

Postby PalmerWMD » Mon Jul 25, 2005 3:20 am

350zQ45a wrote:
1)Lots of people don't like the Z because of the engine, the drone it makes, and the effort it puts out at higher rpms. Of course here you constantly get the well you can mod it that means its better!

Yea 400-450 hp with upgraded internals. Fred says that is if its jsut something simple. 2)You are looking at 10,000 + labor. 3)You are looking at eventually probably saying goodbye to your engine.

4)They have supercharged the VK using twin screw type in the old F50. They were making 450 hp on stock ecu and exhaust. No internal work or anything.

The Vq cant touch it. Vq is a fine engine, but VK is better.
1) Who are these "lots of people"?2)Not true, as an extreme example, a club member, a tech, has offered to do an internals buildup for my VQ35de for $1000 Labor !

To be sure thats a rare find, but 10k simple isnt the cost3)Not true4) But not out for the M45 yet.

Fred..

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Re: (350zQ45a)

Postby szh » Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:20 am

350zQ45a wrote:Lots of people don't like the Z because of the engine, the drone it makes, and the effort it puts out at higher rpms.
Hmmm. I believe that this is a relative comparison issue. In comparison to the M45's V-8, yes, it does sound a bit strained at higher rpm's. But, on its own, that V-6 engine is one of the best around! Smooth power and torque for most driving conditions a driver is likely to encounter, combined with a lighter car, this is a winning combination for the market it is aimed at.

The 350Z certainly appears like it is going to be the most successful of the Z incarnations! I have owned a 1985 300ZX TT, test-driven extensively the 1990 300ZX, and also spent some time behind the wheel of a new 350Z. And, I'd be happy owning a new 350Z!

The point is that it is designed for a different set of driver needs. So, if people do not buy the 350Z, it is not because of the engine, but because of other factors. Indeed, I almost bought one a couple of years ago - the final decision came down in favor of a rear seat and four doors (preferred,) so we went to get a G35 Coupe or Sedan - of course, I ended up getting the M45 after I drove it.

Quote »You are looking at eventually probably saying goodbye to your engine.[/quote]Why? The engine certainly appears strong enough to withstand the higher power and upgraded internals. And Nissan may also offer a supercharger or turbo in the future, like they have done in the past on other Z's.

Z

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Postby szh » Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:23 am

In any case, I am also guilty of hijacking this thread too. Let's bring it back on point for future posts - this is a thread discussing options for available performance modifications to an M35 - the 350Z has its own forum for further posts on it and its engine.

Thanks!

Z

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Postby wingFeather » Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:02 am

I chose the M35. I haven't stopped smiling since I drove off the lot!

The performance on the V6 test car was great. After my 1500 mile break in period (according to the owners manual) I'll be able to push mine to its limits and possibly begin the mods. First up will be a K&N or a CAI

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby szh » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:18 am

wingFeather wrote:I chose the M35. I haven't stopped smiling since I drove off the lot!

The performance on the V6 test car was great. After my 1500 mile break in period (according to the owners manual) I'll be able to push mine to its limits and possibly begin the mods. First up will be a K&N or a CAI
Congratulations!!!

Looking forward to pictures, your driving experiences, etc. Please do keep up the info flow here as to what you do with your car inre mods!

Z

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Postby PalmerWMD » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:20 am

Yes we need pics!!!

Congrats!!..

Use our free Nico host for your M35 pics lots space and we allow hyperlinking..:

http://nissaninfiniticlub.net/photopost/

Fred..

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby maxnix » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:50 am

wingFeather wrote: First up will be a K&N or a CAI
Would skip the K&N based on previous experience by members on this board. No power available with it, but a lot of extra dirt and oil film.

Study the stock CAI first. I assure you Nissan spent tens of thousands of dollars on it.

Might look at this thread then try a search on K&N:

zerothread?id=105156
Modified by maxnix at 7:52 AM 7/27/2005

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Re: (wingFeather)

Postby maxhopper » Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:50 am

Congrats on the new purchase. The combination of the M styling with the durability of the VQ engine is golden.

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Postby rydwhite » Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:37 am

Congrats on the new M. Great car. I would be interested to see the engine bay of the M. Would you mind taking a couple of pics and posting up. If you are looking at CAI, a cheaper alternative that has very similar results in terms of hp gain is to swap out the intake tube for an intake tube from the 350Z and then drop the stock box and replace with the Pop-Charger. Very easy to do and much cheaper than going with the CAI. This is what I have done with the G and I have been very pleased so far. I would assume that you could do the exact same thing with the M. The stock intake tube for the G had some baffles in it that limited airflow slightly, mainly to reduce some of the noise. The tube out of the 350Z has no such baffles and allows a much clearer path for the air.

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Re: (rydwhite)

Postby elwesso » Tue Jul 26, 2005 1:22 pm

Congrats.. Like the others have said, post up some pictures... What kind of options did you get and things like that....?

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Re: (elwesso)

Postby jEzTeR » Tue Jul 26, 2005 5:13 pm

The New M is so sexy!I got to see one tonight in person for the first time and I also fell in love.

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Postby AZhitman » Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:35 pm

Welcome welcome!!!

Would love to see an "article" with your impressions thus far!!!


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