1996 Q45t Under Plenum Job - Need Advice

[d.bright]

Hey All,

So I got my Q45t a few weeks ago, and I drove it down the road, found out it had a major oil leak from the right-side valve cover gasket, so I immediately pulled it into the garage and began dis-assembly of the upper intake/lower intake and removed the valve covers. Everything is now apart, I just got the parts back from a local engine shop who cleaned them very well (they all look shiny and new) and I finished cleaning about 16 years worth of oil buildup and crud from the valley of the engine. Most of the hoses were either all the way deteriorated or almost there when I pulled everything apart. I took pictures because there were simply so many hoses to remove (I've worked on all sorts of cars, and this car has the most hands-down) and I needed to make sure I can see how they all go back together. This is where I need some advice, as I'm putting everything back together, I'll separate out the questions below:

1. I have purchased a few feet of heater hose, fuel line hose and vacuum hose from Advance Auto Parts (AAP from here on out ), and I have also purchased the direct-fit replacement upper and lower radiators hoses from AAP. I have noticed a plethora of custom-bent hoses on this car, so my question to anyone who has done this before is this: Are there any hoses that are absolutely necessary to buy from the dealer when putting this thing back together? Or can I just use standard hoses and put everything back together that way? Or is it a mixture of AAP hoses and dealer hoses? I'm especially curious about the hoses that connect to the heater-core.

2. I have already purchased valve cover gaskets, I need to know if the grommets need to be replaced or not, and if the lower/upper intake gaskets need to be replaced as well. Also, I need to replace the fuel injector o-rings and the little black rubber pieces that they sit in as well, where is the best place to get those online?

3. I figure I'll go ahead and replace the knock sensors while I'm here, do I need to go with Nissan sensors or can I use the AAP ones?

4. Are there any gotchas that people have experienced when doing this job? Such as missed vacuum hoses, breaking things when going back together with them, etc...


Thanks in advance for any and all help!

[htbyrico]

seem you need a lil bit on advice.. this is a big job i would know did it like 3 times i have 3 q45 2 94s and a 96.. first tip make sure you check timing chains for no play.. might need some new tensioners

as far as dealer parts it totally up to you.. you can get real good deals on line for aftermarket and OEM items.. i have the links just ask .. remember OEM is the way to go for everyday driving.. and long lasting.. reman has lasted as long also.. mostly just fuel injectors and other parts the dont have to do with this job..

as long as you follow these guide lines..

1. if you replacing fuel lines make sure its fuel line hoses of any kind is at least 100pis or more..
2. if its water hoses your changing must be water hoses of any kind.. heater,intake,anything that coolant flows.. 60pis or more
3. same for vacum hoses must be vacum base and for oil hoses coming from your intake to valecovers must be oil base hoses
4. vale cover gaskets must have new grommets if not get some small lock washers to get a good seal and no backing on nuts..
5. change all fuel injectors o-rings this is on e-bay.. or dealership might have them in stock.. after 150k mile cold start fuel smell from injector o-rings.. make sure you use good brand new hose clamps for all water and fuel lines that cant be tighten without taking the intake off.. any clamps will do just make sure they are real tight with out over tightening may slip hoses in the future..
6. make sure you change spark plugs, knock sensors and any thing you feel will need changing soon due to maintenance so you wont need to take the intake off again.. well for at least 100k..
7. intake ring/gasket can be reused just at your own risk inspect well before reusing.. they have them aftermarket as well..

most of these parts you can find at your auto-parts store have them walk you to the back find the best matching hoses for the right application.. they sell straight hoses for you other needs fuel, oil, coolant and vacum..

if there's anything at all you need or want to ask please feel free to e-mail me direct [email protected]
im here for ya man good job by the way !! i been a auto technician for 20 years know everything there is to know about nissans.. i also have ondemand5 to help out with specks and other related issues.. have a good one..

[d.bright]

Hey htbyrico, Thanks for the response this is what I'm planning on doing, let me know if you think any of these are good or bad:

1. Fuel lines are from AAP, they are rated at 150psi and I'll be using some hi-temp braid sleeves on them as well.
2. Water hoses are also from AAP, I'm pretty much using standard heater-hose and walking to the back with the AAP guy and picking things that look close enough to what I need, I have bought an assortment of new hose clamps that should be just fine. I'll re-use some of the better hose clamps but I"ll make sure I use them on the TOP of the plenum (easy to get to ).
3. I can go to AAP and they have a ton of grommets I can pick from, I found one that matches pretty much identically to the ones on there now, and they are about .50 cents a piece so I think I'll go with those unless someone pipes up who has had bad experience with them. If this isn't a good idea and I need to use OEM valve cover grommets (seal washers or whatever they're called) can someone please give me a link to the best priced ones?
4. I've already got the spark plugs and I'll put them in, I got NGK Iridium Ix Spark Plugs for what it's worth. As for knock sensors, I found this on Amazon: http://amzn.com/B002Q4617O are these what you were talking about?

5. I also need the rubber grommets (I know know they are "Fuel Injector Cushion Rings") that the fuel injectors rest on that are on the lower intake manifold - hehe NM I just found them here: http://www.autopartswarehouse.com/sku/I ... est+Seller

Thanks again!

[d.bright]

The only valve cover washer-seals I can find online are priced at $5.00 a piece or higher, and there's 36 of them! Any ideas?

Example:
http://www.autopartsfair.com/infiniti-e ... utochannel

[qship96]

of the dozens of owners who have resealed their q valve covers over the years here.....I can think of only 1 who thought it was necessary to replace these as part of the job. I reused mine when doing the job over 4 years and 85,000 miles ago and still no leaks or other consequences from reusing the original washers.......

[htbyrico]

sound like a winner.. everything is in order.. yes on the fuel line.. yes on the sensors.. yes on the clamps glad you putting to good ones on the bottom ..nice.. and the ngk plugs are prefect.. i went with ngk Iridium..as far as the washers you will be fine but do it at your own risk not everybody's washers are the same i reused mine and looks like im not the only one.. but buy some small lock washers so you get a nice tight seal and no backing off on nuts with the old washers.. here a link were i get most my stuff... this is for the vale covers its a kit.. ill show you a pic in a sec.. my 94 i reused my 96 is all new..

http://www.partsgeek.com/mmparts/valve_ ... i/q45.html
this is my 94 dairy driver..


see the lock washer.. so far you good to go bro .. by the way you can call me Rico !!

[d.bright]

I did check the timing chain for play and there is play on the passenger-side inside chain, can I get away with just replacing the guides and tensioners or do I need to replace everything? I figure since I've gotten this far already, I might as well take care of the timing chain too.

And thanks for the pictures and advice Rico, they've been a great help!

Thanks!

[OwnerCS]

How many miles does it have? The timing chain guides issue occurs on the 90-93 models as metal backed guides were used from 94-96.

When the engine is running and the tensioiner has full oil pressure, it will remove the slack shown in the following pictures.

A non-functioning tensioner will cause chain slack to slap the back of the head mounted guide in the picture below. The chain slap against the head guide will sound like a failing HLA. A few months ago, I mistook that slapping sound as an HLA problem when it turned out to be a tensioner's oil passage that was blocked by a piece of RTV silicone.

[htbyrico]

sorry im late.. been working hard over here .. had to rebuild a dana 80 trac lok rear end on a f-550 man that blows.. anyway.. i had seen this happen a lot what i do first is but new tensioners.. the top is e-z the bottom is a lil tricky !!.. now if you want to do the timming its all on you bro.. very long job.. oil pan must come out.. go ahead and change the top guides and tensioners.. you'll be fine.. make sure you clean the holes out.. blow them with compressed air or some carb cleaner.. you going to have to take of the fan belts and fan shrout to give you some room to work.. just like OWNERCS says that what happens a lot.. im going to shower and hit the bed good night bro ttu soon ill be on sometime tom night.. if you need my phone number let me know in a e-mail... just in case you need help on the spot.. theses post take a got bit to get to me..

[d.bright]

OwnerCS, my chain is tight across the top of the gears, it's only on the side with the tensioners that its loose, and I'm pretty sure they are working the way they should b/c when it was running I had no rattle or noise at all coming from the timing chain area.

Rico, are the tensioners on the outside of the front engine cover or do I need to remove it to change them? I haven't even looked closely yet. if they are on the inside, I think I'll skip changing them at this point since it's not making any noise, if they are on the front of the cover I might as well take care of them now since I'm in the area . Thanks!

[OwnerCS]

OwnerCS, my chain is tight across the top of the gears, it's only on the side with the tensioners that its loose, and I'm pretty sure they are working the way they should b/c when it was running I had no rattle or noise at all coming from the timing chain area.

As the engine is turned over "slowly" the slack follows the chain around the chain sprockets. The amount of slack you see in the picture is removed by the tensioner after the engine starts running. With a 94-96 model at that mileage, I will bet on you NOT having any chain issues.

Rico, are the tensioners on the outside of the front engine cover or do I need to remove it to change them? I haven't even looked closely yet. if they are on the inside, I think I'll skip changing them at this point since it's not making any noise, if they are on the front of the cover I might as well take care of them now since I'm in the area . Thanks!

The driver side tensioner is accessible without removing the timing chain cover. It is just under the word "mating" in the following picture. The passenger side tensioner is to the right of the alternator. The tensioners connect to the curved guides.

[d.bright]

Awesome! Thanks for the response. So I feel pretty good with just replacing the tensioners at this point then, it looks like the only thing I have to remove is the alternator to get to the one on the passenger side, no big deal really.

My camera is currently broken, but I'll take some pictures with my phone later today or tomorrow and show you guys where I'm at. I'm still waiting on the various gaskets/seals to come in the mail to begin the process of putting everything back together, but they should be here soon...

Thanks again!

[OwnerCS]

NO NEED TO REMOVE THE ALTERNATOR! I did not need to remove mine. The alternator is a real pain. Trust me!

Only the tensioner cover will need to be removed to get to the passenger side tensioner.

Unless I had a real good reason to replace the tensioners, I would wait till later on as we have seen some 96 models with over 250,000 miles without any timing chain problems.

[qship96]

I am one of them, currently coming up on 286K.....chains,guides,tensioners,and timing cover have never been touched since they were installed on the assembly line 16 years ago.Having used only true, 100% synthetic oil changed frequently since brand new probably helped?

[Q451990]

My advice would be to skip the timing chain work, and use OEM factory parts on everything else you mentioned. www.everythinginfiniti.com or www.orderinfinitiparts.com are some good sources.

I can't imagine replacing all of the hoses under the plenum with aftermarket ones without kinking them, unless you add brass elbows and bends, etc...

Heath

[d.bright]

OK yeah, I've been to the first site, I can't really figure out what hoses I need from their diagrams since they look like they're off a Commodore 64, I found an "Under Plenum Hose Kit" that is $900 or so bucks and I am not gonna drop that kinda money on a bunch of rubber. Most of the hoses can be cut from bulk hosing such as the fuel rail fuel line and straight coolant hose sections. I'm not worried about the vacuum lines as I can just run a little more line in the case of a tight curve to avoid kinking.

If there is a list out there of all the part #'s for the under plenum job please let me know. I tried going to the orderinfinitparts.com website and it doesn't load for me.

Thanks.

[d.bright]

qship96,

I agree, I think synthetic can work wonders, my mom's '97 Grand Marquis has used synthetic since new and she's now approaching 275K without a single oil leak or chain rattle. I'm sure this car has just had conventional oil used before, however that will change when I get it running again. After this is all back together, it's time to figure out what's wrong with the transmission Most of the time it won't go in drive unless it's thoroughly warmed up, but it will go in drive if I put it in 1 or 2 directly... weird... Anyways, that's for another thread AFTER I get this thing back together and perform a trans fluid drain/fill with filter change....

[qship96]

sadly, the complete under plenum hose kit IS about $1000 from infiniti, but it does include the knock sensors and harness- if I recall {I did the plenum job in 2007}, the kit had about 30 or so hoses in it, many small specially molded/shaped just for this application. A huge investment, no doubt, but it should last another 8-10 years if installed correctly.

[d.bright]

Eh.. I bought the car for $600, it has a huge dent on the passenger side, I'm looking to get it running good, and perhaps drive it for a year or so. I'm sure you can see my reasoning in not wanted to dump $1000 dollars into a rubber hose kit ... That being said, I'm not going to do a half-assed job either, whomever I sell this to I want to be able to tell them what has been done to the car, and what needs to be done to the car without feeling like I'm lying or cheating them. So if I find that a hose kinks when I install it and there is no other way around it, I'll probably just head out to the closest Infiniti dealer with the hose in hand and get them to match it up...

[OwnerCS]

My advice would be to skip the timing chain work, and use OEM factory parts on everything else you mentioned. http://www.everythinginfiniti.com or http://www.orderinfinitiparts.com are some good sources.
Heath

Note that TradeMotion, the company behind the scenes that hosts most Nissan parts internet sites must be offline this weekend as neither site will work. Maybe TradeMotion will be back online tomorrow.

[htbyrico]

OwnerCS, my chain is tight across the top of the gears, it's only on the side with the tensioners that its loose, and I'm pretty sure they are working the way they should b/c when it was running I had no rattle or noise at all coming from the timing chain area.

Rico, are the tensioners on the outside of the front engine cover or do I need to remove it to change them? I haven't even looked closely yet. if they are on the inside, I think I'll skip changing them at this point since it's not making any noise, if they are on the front of the cover I might as well take care of them now since I'm in the area . Thanks!

one on the top is out side 2 10mm nuts.. on the bottom is tricky.. take off all your belts and fan + shout.. its a lil small cap with 2 10mm screws ..take it off and youll see it.. gong back on seal it with rtv high temp silicone.. as far as the hoses on the top you can find hoses that are already have bends on them like i told you.. got to say some people just don't read before posting.. you'll find everything you need at your local auto part store..you can take my advice or blow joe advice.. doesn't matter fallow my steps and you'll be fine.. if you want ill shot a video.. i have a other q45 need the same work done.. going to be doing it next weekend.. ill send it to you personally.. i want want you to do it right like a pro..

like i told you .. if you need pro advice ill walk you through it .. just remember not EVERYBODY'S ENGINE IS THE SAME.. if you bought the car brand new then you know what you need to change.. timming chain last the life of the car as long you do all your maintenance like you post to.. any neglect and you'll be at the dealership or mechanic shop were i work.. get advice from someone that does it for a living.. ticks me off you post for help and i see no one step up first.. now you have all kinds of advice going on.. you might just get all kinds of confusion ..
wish you luck bro im here if you need me.. peace

[OwnerCS]

OwnerCS, my chain is tight across the top of the gears, it's only on the side with the tensioners that its loose, and I'm pretty sure they are working the way they should b/c when it was running I had no rattle or noise at all coming from the timing chain area.

Rico, are the tensioners on the outside of the front engine cover or do I need to remove it to change them? I haven't even looked closely yet. if they are on the inside, I think I'll skip changing them at this point since it's not making any noise, if they are on the front of the cover I might as well take care of them now since I'm in the area . Thanks!

one on the top is out side 2 10mm nuts.. on the bottom is tricky.. take off all your belts and fan + shout.. its a lil small cap with 2 10mm screws ..take it off and youll see it.. gong back on seal it with rtv high temp silicone.. as far as the hoses on the top you can find hoses that are already have bends on them like i told you.. got to say some people just don't read before posting.. you'll find everything you need at your local auto part store..you can take my advice or blow joe advice.. doesn't matter fallow my steps and you'll be fine.. if you want ill shot a video.. i have a other q45 need the same work done.. going to be doing it next weekend.. ill send it to you personally.. i want want you to do it right like a pro..

like i told you .. if you need pro advice ill walk you through it .. just remember not EVERYBODY'S ENGINE IS THE SAME.. if you bought the car brand new then you know what you need to change.. timming chain last the life of the car as long you do all your maintenance like you post to.. any neglect and you'll be at the dealership or mechanic shop were i work.. get advice from someone that does it for a living.. ticks me off you post for help and i see no one step up first.. now you have all kinds of advice going on.. you might just get all kinds of confusion ..
wish you luck bro im here if you need me.. peace

I would take Rico up on his offer to talk to you on the phone. It is handy to have a coach to call when you have a question.

[htbyrico]

i apologize to any one that might feel offended by my comments.. but i just want d.bright to make his own decision and if he need help someone should be there in case he needs it.. to the dam job already!!! if anything then goes wrong hit us back we here for you d.bright.. everyone have a good day.. im at work.. ill be checking in from time to time..

[d.bright]

Again, thanks for all of the advice, I was a mechanic at a dealer for over 5 years and have been working on cars all my life (heavy line work to transmission rebuilds) so I know a bit about cars already and this job doesn't intimidate me in any way really, I'm at a point where I don't have to rush to get it done and I'm taking my time, that's the only reason I'm asking so many questions b/c I don't want to have to redo anything . I have all my gaskets and seals in the mail now, so I'll start putting it all back together when I get them... I'll post more when I start going back together with everything, and I will try to document what I do with pictures as well. And Rico, thanks man! I appreciate your willingness to help, the world needs more people like you

[htbyrico]

doing a nissan president conversion check me out !! here's the link.. post6276255.html#p6276255
also doing engine work also !!
hope all went well with your job bro !! im here for ya if you need me !!
well good night bro got to work in the morning !!

[d.bright]

Thanks for the link, I just checked it out and wow, great job man, keep up the good work. I myself am a bit stalled on my job, my first job is an IT Systems Engineer and it keeps me very busy, that plus the fact that I am still waiting on the correct parts from Advance Auto Parts for over 2 weeks now has kept me out of the garage.. I'll keep everyone posted when I get back to it.. I think I'm going to need some help figuring out where all the hoses match up to now that I've forgotten

[OwnerCS]

There's a few of us IT folks around here.. Where are you located?

[d.bright]

I'm in Lilburn, GA, I work in Atlanta... u?

[OwnerCS]

Little Rock, AR

[htbyrico]

Thanks for the link, I just checked it out and wow, great job man, keep up the good work. I myself am a bit stalled on my job, my first job is an IT Systems Engineer and it keeps me very busy, that plus the fact that I am still waiting on the correct parts from Advance Auto Parts for over 2 weeks now has kept me out of the garage.. I'll keep everyone posted when I get back to it.. I think I'm going to need some help figuring out where all the hoses match up to now that I've forgotten

i got your back bro.. hit me up if you need me..!!