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Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

  Ajax’s intake manifold


So I decided to try out the Xcessive manifold for the KA engine to go with my built engine.
There’s a lot of back-story with this engine, but the current state is a 2.6L stroked KA built by AMS with an AMS race-prepped head, 10.5:1 compression, BC V3 cams, header, exhaust, tuned with JWT ECU and piggyback AFC NEO (soon to be retuned), flywheel, driveshaft- pretty much way more money than I really needed to spend.
Anyway some of you know my car, some don’t, but I wanted to share some pics and progress.
Here’s the manifold runners and plenum straight from the box.

There are some casting imperfections in the plenum.


So I’m thinking- I can cover that up by painting it. That’ll be fun, but let’s make it pretty by the details. Mmm, embossed lettering…

So I pull out the masking tape.

FAIL!!!

Don’t know why I thought masking tape was going to mask this adequately with the rough cast surface of the runners. But since the paint stripper I had used to prep the surfaces seemed to do well, I thought, why not give it a try. A few hours with stripper and q-tips…
Win!

So I didn’t want another masking tape fiasco for the (X) design on the plenum, plus that’s time consuming. What could I use to temporarily mask that design with minimal effort?

Well, the glue kinda worked. Since it was a curved surface, it was tough to make dry within the stamped design. Also, while it did keep paint off when I sprayed, it tended to peel up some of the paint with it. If you’re careful with an X-acto knife, this method can work. I ended up masking with tape again, respraying, using a fine blade and peeling tape and wha-la!


I should have this manifold installed on Sunday. It won't be out of storage officially until a little later this month (MN spring is too unpredictable, and I gave away my snow tires) It won’t be really tested thoroughly until I have it retuned by AMS- I’m hoping this will really open up the top-end, but I don’t want to gun it for fear of running lean with all the extra air (maybe I’m being overly conscious, but you would too, with this much money spent).

Modified by Ajax at 8:16 AM 4/19/2009

Modified by Ajax at 8:17 AM 4/19/2009



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koukicody



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2873 posts
93 Mazda Miata
Fountain Valley Ca
12-2-2005

 « Re: Ajax’s intake manifold (Ajax)


looks good man 10.5 cr? you going n/a?



vous etes des animaux
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


You are correct sir. NA and pump gas. Dyno results should be posted by the end of the month.
Pirate_Freder



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277 posts
1993 240SX Coupe
Roswell NM
5-5-2007

 « 


ah, so great to hear from you again. you are going in a similar direction as me so I've been following your build. can't wait to see dyno results after this goes on. I want justification to spend all that money on the stroker kit lol. Iunno about those V3's though...aren't they pretty rough in terms of cold starts and idle etc.? I also wonder if they are a little to big for n/a on this engine. I just put some V2's in.



Check out my build: http://forums.nicoclub.com/zerothread/402620


liquid_cool



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1403 posts
1990 240sx ka24de swap
Las Vegas nevada
7-5-2008

 « Re: Ajax’s intake manifold (Ajax)


does this manifold have the water outlet for the heater core?..couldent tell on the pic's....i bypassed my whole system..and was thinking of this manifold..



http://www.myspace.com/liquid_cool_ka24de

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Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I'm not sure about the heater core. The guys that were going to help me install both bailed due to circumstances beyond their control (I'm hesitant to do it myself because I'm uncomfortable with fuel rail stuff, not exactly a mechanic...). I know it should only take a few hours to install this piece, I just don't feel comfortable doing it myself.
I can tell you that there are options for 2 vaccuum hoses both top and bottom of plenum, plus the IACV vaccuum option which I included. Then there is one more 3/4" hose barb for the bottom side of the runners. Would that be it?
Worst case scenario- I'll drive it down to AMS as is, and have them install- my tuning appointment is April 23rd.
yellowcar



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97 posts

redmond wa
12-30-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Looking forward to hearing how the intake works out, thanks for being the pioneer

I am actually making some progress on my car and before too long I will need to make a choice on the intake. I'll update my thread with more pics soon.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I still want you to go with ITBs. I'm positive that would sound just badass on your dime.
liquid_cool



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1403 posts
1990 240sx ka24de swap
Las Vegas nevada
7-5-2008

 « Re: (Ajax)


do me a favor..post a pic of the water inlet from a side view please..allso..installing that is cake man..just follow the directions given from excessive and use the service manual for gasket recomendations.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I'll take a pic tomorrow night.
I'm sure I probably could handle installing myself, I'm just uneasy about the fuel stuff. 2 NICO buddies are coming over Saturday to help me out, make sure everything goes together right.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « Re: (liquid_cool)


Quote, originally posted by liquid_cool »
do me a favor..post a pic of the water inlet from a side view please.

Hope this helps, not very good quality- only have a camera phone



Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I took some pics yesterday as our own lumberjack and djSpec were helping me out to install this bad boy. My roommates camera, so I'll have to wait until she can upload the pics and send to me.
Now, this is not a quick bolt on piece. There has been some problem solving going on, some grinding to fit here and there and some things that don't make much sense. I'll try to go through these with pics later, but let it be known- you should have access to hose, grinder, and plenty of time to figure things out. As I type its 8am and we worked on the car last night for 6-7 hrs. We are almost there- need some fuel lines to reroute, need to come up with a new intake tube so I can eventually put a hood on.
I wonder if its just the new casting design which forgot a few things or if Xcessive actually neglected some things.
1st- the lower runner bolts included with the kit were too long
2nd- the runners no longer have a coolant bleed valve
3rd- the head has a little outcropping that needs to be ground down a bit for coolant temp sensor to fit (they mounted it too high)
4th- the q45 throttle cable bracket should be stronger
5th- they should either include or strongly recommend their tight radius adaptors, as coming up with new piping on the spot sucks zebra scrotum.
Still, the intake looks pretty badass mounted up, and we're almost there.
More to come.
FlatBlackIan
Lumberjack Moderator



Online

8199 posts
S13 Chuki, S13 Zenki, A34 Maxima, 1983 C10 pickup.
Creepy cabin in the woods MN
12-23-2004

 « Re: (Ajax)


Theft of thunder to comence in 3... 2.... 1......

The manifold is in, and the car runs, but as Dave mentioned, there are quite a few little things that miffed me about the design.

It seemed to me like the Q45 throttle cable bracket was an afterthought, it interferes with the fuse/relay box cover, and it is very flimsy. Snapping the throttle causes it to flex a great deal. A more permanent solution will need to be fabricated.

The coolant temp sensor. I almost have to wonder if they had a KA on hand while building the runners. A pretty good amount of metal needs to be removed from the back of the front cover just to clear the coolant temp sensor. There is no rhyme or reason to its location either, they could have easily moved it a 1/4" further out, and it would have fit perfectly.

The fuel rail mounting. I am greatly displeased with the lack of thought that went into the fuel rail mounting. It took me 5 trys to get all the injectors to seal without vacuum leaks, and I'm still not 100% satisfied. It almost seems to me like they threw it together at the last minute. I'm not impressed.

Any one of these issues would be no biggie, but put them together with the grip of other things I had to Finn rig, and you end up with a not so happy Ian. I think Xcessive could be on to something, but they need to sit down and do a little R&D. I guess I will reserve further judgements till I see the dyno results.


Enough of my whining... Pictures.

I only got pictures of the manifold installed.

Beauty and my beast.





>>S13 240SX rally car buildup<<

"If in doubt, flat out" - Colin McRae
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


So happy birthday to me, I just bought @$800 of parts to be overnighted.
300z MAF, 370cc injectors, IACvalve, hoseses, elbow for creating some more piping.
Tomorrow will be a fun-filled hell day.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


Or maybe not. Due to time constraints, I've decided to postpone the tuning session for a month. Chris at AMS only has a couple hours on Thursday before leaving town, and there simply was not going to be time to install injectors, MAF, and tune. Plus, this week was going to be pretty hellish for me anyway.
Therefore May 22nd is the new dyno date- plenty of time to get the hood to close...
a_ahmed

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875 posts
1991 240sx fastback
Oakville Ontario
5-4-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Man I really wana see some youtubed videos and dyno runs and dyno sheet ooooh yea
liquid_cool



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1403 posts
1990 240sx ka24de swap
Las Vegas nevada
7-5-2008

 « Re: (Ajax)


Quote, originally posted by Ajax »

Hope this helps, not very good quality- only have a camera phone


thats wat i was looking for...NOTE..the heater core hose outlet pipe or "hole" in this case ,Is plugable to bypass the heatercore cleanly...i allready bypassed mine using expantion type freeze plugs and a cut off wheel...thanks for the pic man..intake looks great..might be more benificial for a KA_T set up thou..as for the fitment issues..thanks again for clarifying what others have complained about..i think ill pass on the intake myself.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I've been emailing back and forth with Rich. He is now aware of the fitment issues we had and is addressing them. They have supposedly moved the coolant sensor bungs, and apparently the throttle cable bracket was a bad batch of thin ones. He should be resupplying me with a more solid one, once I confirm measurements.
Just so you know- He's a good guy and hopefully, my pains will be future customers gains.
FlatBlackIan
Lumberjack Moderator



Online

8199 posts
S13 Chuki, S13 Zenki, A34 Maxima, 1983 C10 pickup.
Creepy cabin in the woods MN
12-23-2004

 « Re: (Ajax)


Quote, originally posted by Ajax »
I've been emailing back and forth with Rich. He is now aware of the fitment issues we had and is addressing them. They have supposedly moved the coolant sensor bungs, and apparently the throttle cable bracket was a bad batch of thin ones. He should be resupplying me with a more solid one, once I confirm measurements.
Just so you know- He's a good guy and hopefully, my pains will be future customers gains.

Somebody has got to be the guinea pig right?

Have you gotten the intake tubing all put together yet? I want to hear that baby roar.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


I just got back yesterday from Nebraska- Stage Combat workshop- damn I'm sore.
I'll be working tonight to put it all together. Hopefully I'll have it out this weekend.
yellowcar



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97 posts

redmond wa
12-30-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Isn't being an early implimentor fun? Nice to be able to say you are the first though
Good to hear that they are addressing the issues, I hope they are doing something extra to make up for the pain.
The injector issue is the most concerning issue to me. Sealing issues could haunt you for a long time.
All things considered though, seems like a nice setup once you get the bugs worked out.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


So its 8:30 and I'm finally about to leave my office. Apparently 2 people can't cover for me for 2 days without there being a ton of work leftover... I may not get to everything tonight.
Thought- the z32 MAF is overkill for the hp levels I'll be looking at. But, will it be detrimental? Should I step down to an N60 Maxima MAF?
FlatBlackIan
Lumberjack Moderator



Online

8199 posts
S13 Chuki, S13 Zenki, A34 Maxima, 1983 C10 pickup.
Creepy cabin in the woods MN
12-23-2004

 « Re: (Ajax)


Quote, originally posted by Ajax »
So its 8:30 and I'm finally about to leave my office. Apparently 2 people can't cover for me for 2 days without there being a ton of work leftover... I may not get to everything tonight.
Thought- the z32 MAF is overkill for the hp levels I'll be looking at. But, will it be detrimental? Should I step down to an N60 Maxima MAF?

Yes the Z MAF is a little overkill as far as flow reading is concerned, the real benefit for you is the internal diameter. If the N62 has the same internal diameter as your intake piping, then you could easily drop down to that. Hell, I have a S14 KA MAFS that has a decent diameter, if they are the same internally, you can have it. I just dont remember the specs.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


As promised, here are some pics of the install.
First, removing the old mani. We went upper plenum first, then lower plenum (and by we- I mean pretty much Ian because he's the man- Thanks!!!)

Here's where we ran into clearance problems with coolant sensors.

And the grinding- make sure that aluminum doesn't migrate...

Install is straightforward except for the minor clearance issues.

Yup, the q45 intake is big.

Here it is installed and running. As you can see, I need to fab up a new intake pipe. I'd like to fabricate an intake that is fed through the piggy nostrils- ram-air effect anyone?

Obviously, with the q45 TB and plenum, there are some hood clearance issues.

Here's the hood to attempt it- Origin Type II. I also just ordered Xcessive motor mount tabs which should lower it just a bit more to help out.

As a bonus, changing the filter will be cake. I'll even be able to replace the knock sensor without much trouble.


So my engine bay used to be shiny red. Then the bodyshop decided flatblack would look good- "I got a way to spray it that doesn't take much time," "okay." End result- would have been better just steam cleaning it- the paint was already decent. If it ever gets painted again, the bay will be resprayed red, and there will be a major wiretuck job.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


Along with the Xcessive motor mount lowering brackets, I decided to help protect the oilpan and ordered one of their skidplates as well. My car isn't super-low, much to the chagrin of most of the 240 crowd- so it shouldn't be a major problem. Xcessive is also shipping me their thicker TB bracket- .075" vs .060". Hopefully, this will clear up the flex issue there.
yellowcar



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97 posts

redmond wa
12-30-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Looks great!

How's it run?

dtb



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11 posts
1997 240SX SE
Greenwood MO
5-4-2009

 « Re: (yellowcar)


I agree, looks great. Hope that increase in thickness is enough to fix the problem.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


Finally got all the reducers I needed for running some intake tubing (I cut up my old injen pipe- its a temporary solution) and started her up. She didn't want to start right away; I think I probably need a new distributor cap and wires, but she sputtered to life after a few tries. She's got a lopey idle and sounded almost like a Harley. I took it around the block a few times- had a really raspy quality that it hadn't had before, so I brought it back to my garage. Got out, poked my head around the hoodless engine bay... Oh yeah, I still don't have my EGR plug so there's a 3/4" hole out the #4 cylinder exhaust tube. Duh. No wonder it sounds like a Harley.
It desperately needs an alignment (replaced the tie rods with Circuit Sports units over the winter) and a way to actually close the hood, then she'll be looking forward to a new AMS tune with larger injectors and Z32 or Maxima MAF.
a_ahmed

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875 posts
1991 240sx fastback
Oakville Ontario
5-4-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Man what we need is pictures and videos :D I'm excited hehe
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


So I took the car to work today (day after first 90+ degree day for this year) so that I could take it to get an alignment. It started overheating really fast- so much so that it took about an hour to go 11 miles (stop and shut engine down to cool, start up and go again).
Hopefully the problem is simple- Ian supposed that it is probably an air bubble in the coolant.
Unfortunately, its just too much work for me to get the car working and down to AMS to retune.
Therefore, after haveing spent @$150 in overnighting fees on new parts to try to get things ready, I will have to delay until I can get this car sorted out properly.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


ian helped me out yesterday and we got some problems taken care of. Turns out the overheating problem was most likely caused by a kinked coolant hose, which probably helped create a big air pocket, thereby leading to no flow. 2 90* bends and some finagling of hoses and the coolant flows fine.
We also used Xcessive Manufacturing lowering mounts and dropped the engine almost an inch. Now the hood is close to closing- a little trimming of hood under junk and it should close properly.
GODCHSR
Slow Poke



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749 posts
1996 Nissan 240sx
Kansas City Mo
10-28-2006

 « Re: (Ajax)


Still no dyno yet?




FlatBlackIan
Lumberjack Moderator



Online

8199 posts
S13 Chuki, S13 Zenki, A34 Maxima, 1983 C10 pickup.
Creepy cabin in the woods MN
12-23-2004

 « Re: (GODCHSR)


Quote, originally posted by GODCHSR »
Still no dyno yet?

Not yet, but I did get to see the car drive for the first time in almost a year. I even got pictures to prove it.


Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « Re: (GODCHSR)


Quote, originally posted by GODCHSR »
Still no dyno yet?

AMS Tuning date is now June 29th. And now that the coolant is flowing and the car is aligned, it should just be a matter of some underhood trimming to be ready for the trip to Chicago.

DjPantsSpecR
All Balls, No Boost



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1706 posts
93 MS13 92 RMS13
BP MN
1-14-2005

 « 


Test drove it right into your garage....

I knew i shouldnt have left you two in charge of finishing up the coolant lines, you cant trust an SR boy to do anything right the first time....

pretty spiffy.... now we just need to make you a new intake pipe ASAP. Something that compliments the runner lengths, and a cold air box to put it in.

Oh yeah, i forgot to ask, did you put in those s***ty plastic velocity stacks? I dont know if i would have. First reason, those stacks werent made out of the same material as they do on motorcycles, etc, it seemed like some regular a** HDPE. Reason two, like i side before, they radiused the lip on the inlets already. so when you put the stack over that (to increase the runner length really) the seal made between the two pieces is terrible. I cant imagine how much turbulence is developed in that area.

Modified by DjPantsSpecR at 7:41 AM 6/12/2009



Now specializing in staying slow.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


It went around 2 blocks after idling for almost 10 minutes thank you very much!
You mean my hacked up Injen is too ghetto for you? I'm thinking relocate battery to trunk, short ram, and Ian thought of a brilliant/horrible idea to get an SR radiator for more room. We'll talk more about it once its tuned with the N60 and 370cc injectors.
DjPantsSpecR
All Balls, No Boost



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1706 posts
93 MS13 92 RMS13
BP MN
1-14-2005

 « Re: (Ajax)


I was thinking the same.

You know i have a toyota supra radiator sitting around, i'll go take a look at it.

EDIT: supra rad is about 3-4 inches too wide

Modified by DjPantsSpecR at 9:52 AM 6/12/2009

FlatBlackIan
Lumberjack Moderator



Online

8199 posts
S13 Chuki, S13 Zenki, A34 Maxima, 1983 C10 pickup.
Creepy cabin in the woods MN
12-23-2004

 « Re: (DjPantsSpecR)


Quote, originally posted by DjPantsSpecR »
Test drove it right into your garage....

I knew i shouldnt have left you two in charge of finishing up the coolant lines, you cant trust an SR boy to do anything right the first time....

pretty spiffy.... now we just need to make you a new intake pipe ASAP. Something that compliments the runner lengths, and a cold air box to put it in.


Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa.

Who you calling boy?

Hahahaha, those coolant fittings are in such piss poor locations, there is absolutely no good way to route the hose. I was using what we had that night. It didnt kink until he drove it.

I ended up using 2 90 degree fittings, and a piece of hose with a 90 in it, just to make it not kink.

Ideally, the upper fitting should come out at 90 degrees, pointed towards the rear, as apposed to going straight down, where it interferes with everything. If there was a 90 fitting there, then all you would need, would be a U shaped hose.

Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


Now you youngins keep it down. Old man here's tryin ta think.
Yeah, we'll get it set up properly soon enough. My schedule is just too busy right now for much of anything. It'll be tight for me to get the car ready for the weekend unless I pull an all-nighter.
Ajax



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1178 posts
1991 240sx SE
Minneapolis MN
3-12-2003

 « 


Quick update. Cut out some hood bracing- it now closes- still need to add the hood pins so I can ditch the stock hood latch.
Just got a shipment from FRSport- new CS coolant reservoir. Tonight I'll be installing and using the new spill proof funnel to hopefully get rid of any persisitent air bubbles. Also going to take some measurements for Xcessive Motorsports, since the skidplate I received didn't quite fit (not sure if its because I had HICAS, or if I got a bad plate). They'll make me a new one.
Tonight is the only free night I have before my trip, so I've got to get it done and dependable for Sunday's drive and Monday's dyno-date.
Hopefully I'll have some really good news to spread on Tuesday.
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