Z32 Brakes - Master Cylinder Conversion Re. Elwesso's 94 Q

[JohnPa]

I checked the old posts on this subject, but couldn't find an answer to Wes's problem with his conversion - what is the best MC to use?

Thanks...............John

[elwesso]

There was a recent discussion in Jeff's thread... the Q45 MC is the best to stick with..

[squeefoo]

After going through the Wagner master parts guide the only MC I was able to find was a 300ZX from the earliest '90's w/ a 17/16 bore like the Q. (as seen below) Everything else has a 1" bore... I tried to find something from a Nissan/Infiniti/Tokico product that had a larger bore (even all the trucks)... No luck. The stealership replaced mine w a 1" bore in April of '93 But I did find this which might be helpful to someone (or grist for the mill ):Quote »Checking the Nissan parts books, the Z32 300ZX shares the 240SX's master cylinder design, but comes in 1-inch and even 1 1/16-inch sizes. Wanting a big change in pedal feel, we went for the bigger cylinder (part number 46010 30 p21) This would increase pedal effort by 65 percent. (The 0.99-square inch bore would make 101 psi at 100 pounds of pedal force, or need 165 pounds to make the same 167 psi the stock cylinder made at 100 pounds.) Since the bigger cylinder pumps 65 percent more fluid for the same stroke, it would also significantly reduce pedal slop.

Nissan has always used two suppliers for its brake hydraulics, Nabco and Tokico. The part number we listed is for the Nabco part, but be sure you're clear about what you want or the dealer may substitute the Tokico part. Though the parts are functionally identical, they aren't exactly the same. The 1 1/16 master cylinder only came on cars with ABS, and those cars only needed two brake lines from the master cylinder--one for the front wheels and one for the rears.

Non-ABS cars had three lines, one for each front wheel, and one for both rears (it was split into two at the rear of the car). ABS cars had the extra front brake line port plugged, but here's the difference. On the Nabco cylinders, a simple hex-key plug is used, so an Allen wrench can be used to remove it. After that, the 240SX brake line goes right in. The Tokico cylinder, though, uses a five-sided plug. We were only able to remove the plug after hammering an oversized TORX socket into the five-sided hole.

That's when we discovered the second problem. The hole is machined for a Volkswagen-style bubble-flare brake line, not the standard Nissan reverse-flare. In other words, if you get the Tokico cylinder, be prepared to fabricate some brake lines.[/quote]http://www.sportcompactcarweb....ilvia/According to the Wagner book this has the desirable 17/16 bore:Quote »Tokico Brake Master Cylinder Nissan 300ZX Turbo Coupe Brake Master Cylinder

Fits: 07/1989 - 01/1991 Nissan 300ZX Turbo Coupe, transmission: N/AImportant Fit Details: Vehicles made from 07/1989 to 01/1991. Transmission Type: N/A Brand: Tokico [/quote]

[RobertsnewQ]

The best is the Q45 17/16 IF YOU CAN FIND ONE.

It's got better proportioning valving than the 300zx one (for us anyway).

[JohnPa]

There was a recent discussion in Jeff's thread... the Q45 MC is the best to stick with..

Thanks, Wes. Did the 'mushieness' ever go away after all of that brake line bleeding or did you just get used to the different brake feel. I value your input because I'm trying to decide between two courses of action:

1) Follow your lead and convert all the way (BTW, I have the 6OU11 master cylinder), or

2) Rebuild the front calipers, upgrade to Brembo rotors, and replace the rear setup with the rotors and calipers off a wrecked 2000 Q I found with only 32,000 miles on the odometer.

Just for background, this car is my daily driver. I probably don't drive as hard as you do and I've got grandkids, but I would like a little better braking!

Thanks for your time..............John

[JohnPa]

The best is the Q45 17/16 IF YOU CAN FIND ONE.

It's got better proportioning valving than the 300zx one (for us anyway).

My master cylinder number is 6OU11. Is that the 17/16 one you refer to?

Thanks................John

[squeefoo]

Quote »My master cylinder number is 6OU11. Is that the 17/16 one you refer to?[/quote]60U11 is the 1" bore. 60U10 is 17/16" or 1 & 1/16"

[elwesso]

Thanks, Wes. Did the 'mushieness' ever go away after all of that brake line bleeding or did you just get used to the different brake feel. I value your input because I'm trying to decide between two courses of action:

1) Follow your lead and convert all the way (BTW, I have the 6OU11 master cylinder), or

2) Rebuild the front calipers, upgrade to Brembo rotors, and replace the rear setup with the rotors and calipers off a wrecked 2000 Q I found with only 32,000 miles on the odometer.

Just for background, this car is my daily driver. I probably don't drive as hard as you do and I've got grandkids, but I would like a little better braking!

Thanks for your time..............John

John, i dont know if i posted this, but i bled the brake wrong the frist time, which is why i had mushy pedal.... IM embarassed to admit how i bled the brakes the first time, so i will spare myself the embarassment....

If you already have the 60U00 MC your in much better shape than me, however i dont really think that 1/16" is going to make a HUGE difference.. maybe it will, but i decided not ot bother based on that theory!

It doesnt matter how hard you drive, all you need is once for the car to stop 10 feet shorter to save a life (or lives)..

I gotta tell you man, these brakes BITE like crazy... Just the other day (2 weeks ago), i went and did some power stops (about 75-5, didnt want to completely stop as i was on a main road), and dang dude, these things STILL surprise me.. PLUS, i have yet to upgrade to my hawk pads, which i am really looking foreward to. The pads I have on now are likely abysmal at best. NIssan OEM pads and all highline pads have something engraved in the back, and these had nothing. They are likely autozone specials..

The intial bite that the stock brakes had is lost... but the braking is more linear.. The brakes arent nearly sa touchy...

The second time I did the Z32s on Ross's Q we did it right the first time and they were great (better than mine are currently).. He's just using the pads that came on the calipers (nissan OEM) and some used rotors...

[JohnPa]

Wes, thanks man. I'm off with my shopping list to the wrecking yard tomorrow!

John

[ceningolmo]

Mine, even with stock tires/wheels and barely operational active suspension seems to want to stop FAST.

The first 10-12 days after Wes did the upgrade for me I had all sorts of fun doing power stops. It will bring the car to hault with enough force to make the seatbelt dig in to your shoulder and all the blood rush to the front of your head/face.

However, I am pretty sure I put about a years worth of braking on the pads in the first couple weeks after the upgrade. So, mine feel a little mushy now... but, that is because I am pretty sure I have already killed the pads that came with the calipers. I will probably do a Hawk upgrade like Wes at some point this summer/fall.