RobPaulson wrote:imo, only people who complain about GS are the ones who have a low one LOL

gearscore is a great way to gauge someones experience, if you've run 25m 20 times, you should have a few 264 pieces and be damn familiar with the fights from going so many times. this makes you more valuable of a player to the raid due to your experience, which is loosely quantified by your gearscore.

no offense, but i would never invite someone with less than a 5200GS to an ICC25, simply because if you are that low, you may have done a few 10mans, but you dont know the fights in and out. i want pros who can run through the first wing in 2 hours, i dont feel like carrying kids in 10m gear.

not to mention, my 5777GS rogue pulls 8-11kDPS single target in 25mans, i've been in 25mans where i'm doing 30% of the raids damage... that frustrates the hell out of me. pull your weight, or go back a tier and grind through 10mans more, just like everyone else did to get to 5600-6000GS.

PTR Patch Notes wrote:
World of Warcraft PTR Patch 3.3.3

The latest test realm patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com....html

The latest patch notes can always be found at http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/

General

* Copied Test Realm characters are not copied with their achievement history in order to better facilitate the character copy process.

PvP

* The amount of Honor awarded for an Honorable Kill has been increased by 100% for characters of all levels. This change will effectively double the amount of Honor received from Honorable Kills, or for completing Battleground and Wintergrasp objectives; however, the amount of experience gained from completing Battleground objectives and the amount of Honor rewarded for completing each Wintergrasp quest remain unchanged. * Battlegrounds o The Random Battleground system has been added! Similar to the Random Dungeon system in the Dungeon Finder, players can now queue for a random Battleground. + The Random Battleground option can be found in the Battleground tab of the PvP frame and is only available for level 80 characters at this time. + If this option is selected, players may not queue for specific Battlegrounds and a random Battleground simultaneously. + Similar to the Random Dungeon system, players will not know for which Battleground they are chosen when selected from the queue until they zone into the Battleground. + The Random Battleground option will only allow a group size of 5 players to queue together. + Bonus rewards will be offered for choosing the Random Battleground option. # Winning a Battleground using the Random Battleground option for the first time in a day will award players with 30 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency and 25 Arena points. # Winning additional Battlegrounds using the Random Battleground option after the first random win will award players with 15 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency. # Losing a Battleground using the Random Battleground option will award players with 5 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency. o Daily Battleground quests have been removed in place of the Random Battleground option. o Battlegrounds will no longer award Marks of Honor. + Players with existing Marks of Honor can still turn them in to their respective faction's quest givers, including individual marks for those who may have more marks for one Battleground than another. + Items which previously required Marks of Honor will have their costs adjusted to remove these requirements. o Whenever a Battleground has the holiday bonus active, it will now be referred to as "Call to Arms" in the Battleground tab and Calendar. In addition, Call to Arms Battleground Honor rewards have been changed. + Choosing a specific Battleground with the Call to Arms bonus active will yield the exact same rewards as when choosing the Random Battleground option. # Winning a Call to Arms Battleground for the first time in a day will award players with 30 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency and 25 Arena points. # Additional Call to Arms Battleground victories after the first win for a player that day will award them with 15 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency. # Losing a Call to Arms Battleground will award players with 5 Honorable Kills worth of additional Honor currency. + When using the Random Battleground option, players will not receive additional rewards if the Battleground chosen under the Call to Arms bonuses. In addition, the rewards for the first victory of the day cannot be earned more than once, regardless of whether or not it is obtained from the Random Battleground system or the Call to Arms Battleground. * Wintergrasp o The internal balance system now only changes when a faction achieves 2 consecutive defenses after an initial capture of Wintergrasp, up from 1. More details can be found on our PvP Discussion forum.

Dungeons & Raids

* Culling of Stratholme o Players may now skip the initial introduction dialog to this dungeon once they have completed it at least once. * Icecrown Citadel o Blood-Queen Lana'thel: Pact of the Darkfallen now applies damage twice as often, but for half the damage. This change will make the removal of the spell a bit more responsive. o Hellscream's Warsong and Strength of Wrynn now provide their bonuses to player pet health and damage, as well as the absorption amounts of Power Word: Shield and Sacred Shield. * World Event Bosses o Holiday bosses (such as Ahune for the Fire Festival) will now be accessible through the Dungeon Finder. + Players must use the Dungeon Finder or speak to special holiday NPCs in the world to queue up and access these bosses. + Upon accepting a queue for any holiday boss, the party will be ported directly to the necessary area for confronting that boss. + The previous summoning criteria for these bosses have been removed. Players can queue up for and fight each World Event boss as many times as they want for any standard loot that they may drop. + All rare holiday items (such as The Horseman's Reins) will have a chance of being found in holiday-themed loot troves which will drop once for each player in the party no more than once per day, in the same manner that doing the Random Dungeon daily quest will provide a specific reward the first time it is completed in a day.

Classes: General

* Several raid buffs have had their ranges increased to 100 yards, up from 45 yards, to prevent select buffs from repeatedly getting applied and removed during highly mobile encounters. Some buffs, such as paladin auras, totems, shouts and Blood Pact are intentionally meant to have shorter ranges and remain unchanged.

Death Knights

* Icy Touch: This ability now causes a very high amount of threat while the death knight is in Frost Presence. * Chains of Ice: The ability now innately applies Frost Fever to a target. * Rune of Razorice: Now stacks 5 stacks of 2% Frost Vulnerability instead of 10 stacks of 1% Frost Vulnerability. Proc chance changed to 100%. * Talents o Blood + Abomination's Might: This effect is now passive instead of being a proc on certain strikes. Rank 1 is 5% attack power and Rank 2 is 10% attack power. The self strength buff remains unchanged. + Will of the Necropolis: There is no longer a cooldown on the frequency at which this talent can be activated. In addition, this ability can now also be triggered by damage which deals less than 5% of your health. o Frost + Endless Winter: No longer causes Frost Fever to be applied by Chains of Ice, but instead grants 2/4% strength. + Icy Talons: The personal haste benefit provided by this talent is no longer exclusive with other sources of melee haste. This will allow death knights to always swing 4/8/12/16/20% faster when Frost Fever is applied. Windfury Totem and the party/raid component of Improved Icy Talons still do not stack. + Improved Icy Talons: This effect is now passive instead of being a proc. The self haste buff remains unchanged. + Nerves of Cold Steel: Now increases off-hand damage by 8/16/25%, up from 5/10/15%. + Unbreakable Armor: The amount of strength granted is now 20%, up from 10%. o Unholy + Scourge Strike: Now deals 70% weapon damage, plus 12% of physical damage done as shadow damage for each of the death knight's diseases on the target. The net result should be larger strikes with no diseases present, while maximum damage with all diseases applied to the target should stay the same. + Unholy Blight: In addition to its previous effects, this talent now also prevents diseases from being dispelled from victims afflicted by Unholy Blight.

Druids

* Nature's Grasp: Now has 3 charges, up from 1. * Talents o Balance + Starfall: The damage done by this spell has been significantly increased. + Typhoon: Mana cost reduced to 25%, down from 32%. o Feral Combat + Mangle: The debuff from this talent now lasts 60 seconds, up from 12 seconds.

Hunters

* Talents o Beast Mastery + Ferocious Inspiration: This ability is now an aura and provides 1/2/3% damage to all party or raid members within 100 yards and boosts the damage of Steady Shot by 3/6/9%. o Pet Talents + Heart of the Phoenix: Cooldown reduced to 8 minutes, down from 10 minutes.

Mages

* Frostbolt: Spell power scaling on this spell has been increased by approximately 5%. * Talents o Arcane + Arcane Empowerment: This effect is now passive instead of being a proc off of critical strikes. The self damage buff remains unchanged. + Incanter's Absorption: This talent now only grants additional spell power when damage is absorbed by Mana Shield, Frost Ward, Fire Ward, or Ice Barrier. The limit of 5% of the mage's health on the spell power buff has been removed. o Fire + Burning Soul: Threat reduction is now 10/20%, up from 5/10%. + Combustion: The cooldown on this spell is now 2 minutes, down from 3 minutes. + Empowered Fire: This talent now also applies to Pyroblast damage. + Torment the Weak: This talent now also applies to Pyroblast damage. o Frost + Brain Freeze: This talent now allows your next Fireball or Frostfire Bolt to be instant and cost no mana. There is a small internal cooldown to keep the Frostfire Bolt from immediately triggering Brain Freeze again.

Priests

* Talents o Discipline + Renewed Hope: now has a 60-second duration, up from 20 seconds, but a 20-second cooldown.

Rogues

* Rupture: The damage-over-time component of this ability can now produce critical strikes. * Talents o Subtlety + Filthy Tricks: Now Reduces the cooldown by 5/10 seconds and energy cost by 5/10 of Tricks of the Trade, Distract and Shadowstep abilities, and reduces the cooldown of Preparation by 1.5/3 minutes. + Ghostly Strike: If the rogue has a dagger equipped, this ability now deals 180% weapon damage instead of 125%. + Hemorrhage: If the rogue has a dagger equipped, this ability now deals 160% weapon damage instead of 110%. + Serrated Blades: This talent now allows the rogue to ignore up to 3/6/9% of the target's armor, rather than a fixed amount of armor ignored per level of the rogue. + Slaughter from the Shadows: Now adds 1/2/3/4/5% damage to all attacks and reduces the energy cost of Backstab and Ambush by 4/8/12/16/20, up from 3/6/9/12/15. + Waylay: The debuff from this talent can now be caused by Backstab in addition to Ambush and can be triggered by all hits from these abilities rather than just critical strikes, but the snare component is now 50%, down from 70%.

Shaman

* Flame Shock: The damage-over-time component of this ability can now produce critical strikes and is affected by spell haste. * Talents o Elemental Combat + Elemental Oath: This ability is now always on as a passive aura. o Enhancement + Unleashed Rage: This ability is now always on as a passive aura.

Warlocks

* Immolate: The damage-over-time component of this spell can now produce critical strikes. * Life Tap: This spell no longer scales with spirit, and instead scales with spell power. * Talents o Affliction + Dark Pact: This ability no longer requires line-of-sight with the summoned demon, and the range has been increased from 30 yards to 100 yards. o Demonology + Demonic Pact: This effect now has a 45-second duration, up from 12 seconds, and a 20-second internal cooldown.

Warriors

* Revenge: Damage done by this ability (base and scaling) increased by 50%. * Thunderclap: This ability now counts as a ranged attack, granting it double damage on critical strikes instead of 150% and ranged miss chance, and still cannot be dodged or parried. * Talents o Arms + Bladestorm: Warriors can now be Disarmed while under the effects of this ability. + Trauma: The debuff from this talent now lasts 60 seconds, up from 15 seconds. o Fury + Rampage: This effect is now passive instead of being a proc from critical strikes. o Protection + Improved Revenge: This talent can no longer trigger a stun, and instead causes Revenge to strike an additional target for 50/100% of Revenge's damage. + Vitality: Now boosts Stamina by 3/6/9%, up from 2/4/6%. Strength and expertise benefits have not changed.

Items

* Frozo the Renowned has moved into the Dalaran Magus Commerce Exchange and will be trading your Frozen Orbs for various other trade goods. * Glyphs o Death Knights + Glyph of Disease: When this glyph causes Frost Fever to be refreshed, it will now also trigger a refresh of Icy Talons. + Glyph of Icebound Fortitude: Now always grants at least 40% damage reduction. o Druids + Glyph of Focus: Now increases the damage done by Starfall by 10%, down from 20%. + Glyph of Mangle: This glyph now provides 10% increased damage done by Mangle instead of increasing the duration of the debuff. o Mages + Glyph of Fireball: No longer increases critical strike chance of Fireball. Instead, it now reduces the cast time of Fireball by 0.15 seconds. o Priests + Glyph of Scourge Imprisonment: Now reduces the cast time of Shackle Undead by 1 second, up from 0.5 seconds. o Rogues + Glyph of Deadly Throw: Now increases the slowing effect on Deadly Throw by 20%, up from 10%. + Glyph of Expose Armor: Now increases the duration of Expose Armor by 12 seconds, up from 10 seconds. + Glyph of Feint: Now reduces the energy cost of Feint by 20, up from 10. * Mechanostriders: Summoning any of these mounts is now perfectly mechanical-sounding! * Priest Tier-10 4-Piece Healing Set Bonus: Redesigned. This bonus now increases the effectiveness of the caster's Power Word: Shield by 5% and Circle of Healing by 10%. * Shaman Tier-10 4-Piece Elemental set Bonus: This bonus has been slightly adjusted to account for the fact that haste now modifies Flame Shock's periodic damage ticks. The bonus now makes the shaman's Lava Burst cause Flame Shock to tick at least two additional times before expiring.

Professions

* Runed Orbs: Recipes which require this item have had their material requirements significantly reduced. * Engineering o The Pet Bombling and Lil' Smoky non-combat pets are no longer Bind-on-Pickup. * Fishing o The "Monsterbelly Appetite" daily fishing quest has changed so it now takes place outside the Violet Hold in Dalaran. The quest still requires a Severed Arm and has been renamed to "Disarmed!" * Inscription o Most recipes that required 2 inks now only require 1. * Mining o Titansteel Bar: Creating this item no longer results in a cooldown. * Tailoring o Glacial Bag: Creating this item now invokes a 7-day cooldown. o The cooldown and location requirements have been removed from creating Moonshroud, Spellweave and Ebonweave.

Quests

* Many quests which require vehicles have had their vehicle mechanics updated and improved in the interest of fun.

User Interface

* All Alert pop-ups now have new and fresh Alert icons. * Auction House o If the Auction House on a realm is unavailable for any reason, an alert will pop up informing players who attempt to access it. o Players can now Right-Click to place an item in the Auction frame. o Entire stacks of a specific item type can be placed in the Auction frame and several options have been added for choosing how to list auctions. + Stack Size: If a stack of items has been added to the Auction frame, players can select the size of the stack they wish to sell. If an invalid stack size is entered (i.e. a stack of 21 Saronite Ore), the Create Auction button will be grayed out. + Number of Stacks: In addition to selecting the size of a stack, players can select how many stacks of an item they wish to sell (i.e. if a player has a total of 43 Saronite Ore in the Auction frame, they can choose to list 2 stacks of 20, 4 stacks of 10, 8 stacks of 5, 43 stacks of 1, etc. If the number and amount of stacks listed results in a remainder, the left-over items will be placed back in the player's bags automatically). + Stack Size and Number of Stacks are linked mathematically so that altering the variables of one may automatically calculate the amount of the other (i.e. if a player puts 20 in the Stack Size field and 43 Saronite Ore are in the Auction frame, the Number of Stacks field will change to 2 by default. If a player only wishes to sell one stack of 20 Saronite Ore, the Number of Stacks field can be manually changed to 1). + Price: Players can now choose to input the price of an item Per Stack or Per Item by selecting either option from a pull-down. If Per Item is selected and a player is selling a stack of that item, the Auction House will multiply the selected Per Item price by the amount of that item in the stack. If Per Stack is selected, the player can enter the total price he or she wishes to charge for each stack of that item being listed. + Auction Post Completion Bar: If multiple items or stacks of items are being listed at once by a player, a Posting completion bar will appear showing the total progress of each individual auction being listed once the Create Auction button is selected. The greater the number of individual listings being made in a single press of the Create Auction button, the longer this process will take. Players can still browse the Auction House while the Posting completion bar is in progress, but moving around will interrupt the progress, similar to moving while attempting to create multiple bandages with First Aid. Just as with creating bandages, auctions that were completed prior to the character moving or otherwise canceling the action will successfully be listed. * Dungeon Finder o The Deserter debuff given to players who leave a dungeon prematurely when queuing via the Random Dungeon option has been increased to 30 minutes, up from 15 minutes. The cooldown for using the Random Dungeon option remains 15 minutes. o The Random Dungeon cooldown is no longer displayed as a debuff. Instead, players will see the cooldown time remaining displayed in the Dungeon Finder window when Random Dungeon or Random Heroic Dungeon is selected from the pull-down. o If a player in your party has the Deserter debuff, or is on cooldown from the Random Dungeon option, his or her character name will be displayed in the Dungeon Finder window listed as "On Cooldown," preventing the group from queuing. o Anyone in a dungeon party can now re-queue their group for a dungeon, as players will still be prompted whether or not to accept their chosen role. o Players who use the Vote Kick option will now be prompted to provide a reason for kicking a party member. This reason will be presented to everyone in the party except for the person voted to be kicked. o When joining as a group, more generous level requirements will be used instead of Random Dungeon level requirements so that players of different levels joining together will be eligible for a greater number of dungeons. o Parties randomly created via the Dungeon Finder will always be arranged in the party interface from top to bottom in the following order: tank, healer, damage, damage, damage. o If a random party is created via the Dungeon Finder and a player cannot roll Need on an item, a reason will now be provided. * Authenticator Frame: If a player has a Battle.net Authenticator attached to his or her account and selects Remember Account Name at the login screen, the next time that player logs into World of Warcraft, a field to input the Authenticator code will be displayed below the password field. * The World Map will now provide an option to display different levels of a multi-layered dungeon, zone, or city (i.e. players can view the map of the Dalaran Sewers without having to be in that location). * Quest Tracking Feature o The Quest Tracking Objectives Frame can now be widened via the Interface Options menu. o The short description for a tracked quest is now displayed on the Map in the quest pane. o Quest items in a player's inventory which begin quests now each have an exclamation point overlaid on their icons to make them more easily identifiable. o If a players selects Track Low Level Quests, the quest objectives will no longer appear dim on the Map, nor will the exclamation points appear dim over NPC heads or on the Mini-Map. o Objectives Frame + The Objectives Frame will now list the number of quests displayed at the top. In addition, players can now click on the word "Objectives" at the top of the Objectives Frame for a list of sorting and filtering options which will determine how quests are ordered. Any quests or achievements filtered or sorted out of the Objectives Frame are still being tracked and are simply hidden in this frame. # Sorting * Sort by most difficult quests. * Sort by least difficult quests. * Sort by quests closest in proximity to the player (this will automatically update as players travel around). * Manual sorting: This allows players to Right-Click on each quest name in the Objectives Frame and determine in what order they should be placed. # Filtering * Toggle achievement tracking. * Toggle completed quest tracking. * Toggle tracking quest objectives in other zones. + Players can now Shift + Click on a quest objective or check the Track Quest box on the Map to track a quest in the Objectives Frame. * For additional notes on Lua and XML changes please visit the UI & Macros forum.

Technical

* Frame Rate: A maximum capacity of 200 frames per second has been added. To disable the frame rate limit, the following line should be added to the Config.wtf file: SET maxFPS "0".

Bug Fixes

* When speaking to an NPC for which a player has 2 or more quests and not all of them are complete, the incomplete quests will now correctly show as a gray question marks in the dialog box. In addition, repeatable quests will be properly colored as blue exclamation points or question marks in the dialog box for NPCs with multiple quests available, or for which the player has multiple quests in progress or completed.

Hijacker wrote:
I don't see the problem with someone with a sub-5200 GS running lower spire. Lower spire really is designed to get kids upgraded somewhat to have them geared for everything else in ICC. I agree that someone just mathematically will not be able to pull their weight on say Festergut if they roll in with a GS below 5200, but to completely bone someone from the dungeon completely due to their luck in getting into runs is a bit ridiculous.

OriginalWheelman wrote:I pug ICC every week, with 2-3 toons, 10 and 25m. There are a lot of puggers on our server. It's not uncommon to see a 5600 GS guy with no guild. A lot of people just dont care to conform to a schedule.

USsil80 wrote:i don't know about this new not being able to NEED thing... there was a pair of cloth feet that dropped that where better then the leather ones i had on by 50SP(i am a resto druid) and i could need them so i lost the greed roll and they got DE'ed.... no good

OriginalWheelman wrote:
I had the same problem with my druid. Fortunately I had a priest with me to roll on stuff a lot of the time. The reason is simple. If you could roll on lower armor level gear a paladin could need roll every item in the game.

I ran an ICC10 today with my druid. The Shard(sliver?) of pure Ice (w/e its called off Marrowgar10) dropped but I lost it to the other healer. I already have the staff off Saurfang10, and the chest off Deathwisper25 so there isnt a lot left for me in the first wing. I could inflate my gear score by getting a 245 badge trink to replace my Jez"Te Bell but I refuse to downgrade my stats for gear score. I'll get the trink off Mar10 and the Abacus off Gunship25 and I'll be set for a while. As it is my heals are huge. I was called in by a guildy to heal a ToC25 and when we pushed Anub into phase 3 i was rollin hots and I was asked to "Ease off on the heals" even though i was just dropping rejuvenate in a cycle and wild growth on every cd.

USsil80 wrote:
what is your toons name? yea i just got back into it... haven't even been into a raid yet... just farming those heroics