Without removing rail, how do ensure proper injector alignment?

[s13_240_rb20]

As the title says, I am wondering how I can be absolutely sure my injectors are spraying at their proper angle. I was just reading a topic about a car not starting and "injector spray angle is very important" was listed....so....Since my car also won't start anymore (gradual problem).....

Do I use my injector wire-plugs to line straight up and down?

--TJ

[240z4u]

I think spray angle is refering to the angle at which the injector is pointing into the intake manifold. Not the way the injector is "clocked" in its hole. The spray pattern of most injectors is a cone. Its not blade shaped or anything like that.

Your problem sounds more like a dying fuel pump or fuel filter.

Evan

[DeclareYrWar]

more than likely, if your injectors were sitting incorrectly you would have fuel leaks around the seals. as long as your fuel rail isnt bent or anything they should be fine. it is more likely to be something else causing your no-start problem.

what exactly is the car doing?

[s13_240_rb20]

Here is a summary of my setup:

Car: 1990 240sx hatchMotor: 1993 R32 GTS-T Skyline RB20DET w/trans & ecuFuel Pump: Bosch 040Extras: Nismo FPR, Glowshift Fuel Pressure Gauge & A/F Ratio Gauge

Problem:

Car will turn over but won't attempt to start!! There never seems to be even an attempt to start..just turns over. My FP gauge holds steady at 38psi even while cranking (so FP is good, right?). A/F Ratio Gauge bounces in the "Optimal" range when turning over (so good, right?) I have checked several times, and the ecu is throwing NOOO codes.

Overall, I am at a loss. It's been over a year since I drove this car on the street. When I did, it would hit around 145 EASY (I can only guess since the 240 dash only shows 1.5 inches past 115mph). I have heard several things to check (most of which I don't know how to). I already have the FSM for this motor.

My Consult cable and Datascan 1.3 from eBay are on the way, but I can't expect it to help me diagnose a car that won't even start and idle. In the past, it has started a couple of times and would bog out around 15mph (NOOOO....it is not the ECU safe-mode. I've experienced that before and this is different. This is a bog/choke and not a "limiter" kicking in).

And as I have searched, I've run across some of the following suggestions:

ECCS Relay: Haven't looked up how to check yet.Crankshaft sensor on transmission: Can't find in the FSM. Is this the plug that is 8" from the speed sensor.fuel pump: That's not it (according to FP gauge and 3 different brand pumps)Bad Battery: I rotate 2 brand new batteries between my cars to keep it charged.Timing: I am too scared to ask what this task entails...some (major to me) disassembly??Distributor adjustment: Can't find "Distributor" in the FSM..does mine even have one, since I have coilpacks and such??Knock sensor??etc, etc, etc...

So....can anyone tell me anything to check and HOW to check it (details??) I am a "backyard mechanic" so my experience is limited.

Someone please help me get my Nissan running again. Although my JDM H22A Prelude is fun in the 0-60, it will never compare to my 3 months of driving this Nissan (acceleration OR topend)!!!!!

Thanks,

--TJ

[Shocker]

ohh dear.. distributer?! this is no small block chevy. It uses a CAS (Crank Angle Sensor) Its that sensor thats on your exhaust cam shaft..

did you pull any plugs to see if they are wet?

After that remove a plug attack it to its coil and see if it sparks off the block when the engine is turned over.

[DriftingisLame]

"Nismo FPR, Glowshift Fuel Pressure Gauge & A/F Ratio Gauge"

An A/F gauge on your stock narrowband is incredibly inaccurate, and wont help you whatsoever... Dont look at it at all, better yet, remove it, and install it in the trash can.

"Car will turn over but won't attempt to start!! There never seems to be even an attempt to start..just turns over. My FP gauge holds steady at 38psi even while cranking (so FP is good, right?). "

This would mean your entire fuel system before the injectors is working properly, at least properly enough to start the car. If you didnt have fuel pressure, your pump would not be working, or your fuel filter would have to be really damn clogged. Since your fuel pressure is at 38psi, that means your FPR is working properly, as that sounds like a good fuel pressure when cranking. When you do get it running, pull the vacuum line off the FPR, and set it to 44 psi.

"It's been over a year since I drove this car on the street. When I did, it would hit around 145 EASY (I can only guess since the 240 dash only shows 1.5 inches past 115mph). "

Most likely you either hit 121 (speed limiter), and thought since the speedo doesnt read anymore, it must be really really fast. Another possibility, although VERY unlikely, is that your motorset came with a chipped ECU. My roommates RB20 came with a chipped ECU and it had NO power until around 5 grand, and rev limiter hit at 8,000, with no speed limiter. This is likely not the case with yours. A stockish RB20 would take a LONG time to hit 145mph, and if I remember correctly you would be close to redline (6800/7000rpm) in fifth gear.

"My Consult cable and Datascan 1.3 from eBay are on the way, but I can't expect it to help me diagnose a car that won't even start and idle. In the past, it has started a couple of times and would bog out around 15mph (NOOOO....it is not the ECU safe-mode. I've experienced that before and this is different. This is a bog/choke and not a "limiter" kicking in)."

Never used consult, but I hope you bought the right one, you need an OBD 1 specific consult. Dont d!ck around with this untill you get your car running.

And as I have searched, I've run across some of the following suggestions:

"ECCS Relay: Haven't looked up how to check yet."

I've never had a relay go bad on my RB or any of my cars for that matter, I doubt this is the problem, but check it anyway. Google how to test a relay, I dont want to explain it.

"Crankshaft sensor on transmission: Can't find in the FSM. Is this the plug that is 8" from the speed sensor."

Its because we dont have a crankshaft sensor, its a cam angle sensor, if there is a crank sensor, well then I dont know where the hell it is.. If your crank sensor was bad, your check engine light would come on, and stay on while cranking.

"fuel pump: That's not it (according to FP gauge and 3 different brand pumps)"

Rule out the fuel pump. I'm not saying its good, I'm just saying its good enough to start the car.

"Bad Battery: I rotate 2 brand new batteries between my cars to keep it charged."

Man, cars can act pretty damn weird when they dont have a properly charged battery, Get a new battery, and if its dying while your trying to diagnose, Jump it, or charge it... You wont get anywhere without a good working battery.

"Timing: I am too scared to ask what this task entails...some (major to me) disassembly??"

Dont worry about this yet, its likely set properly or close enough to get the car running, provided you didnt mess with it at all.

"Distributor adjustment: Can't find "Distributor" in the FSM..does mine even have one, since I have coilpacks and such??Knock sensor??etc, etc, etc..."

Theres no distributor, only a cam angle sensor. Its located on the front of your engine on the exhaust side, theres a little mitsubisi emblem in the very center of it. Dont mess with this. You'll need to use it to set ignition timing in the future. "knock sensor would throw a code, and the car would still run but with retarded ignition timing"

"So..Someone please help me get my Nissan running again. Although my JDM H22A Prelude is fun in the 0-60, it will never compare to my 3 months of driving this Nissan (acceleration OR topend)!!!!!"

Your damn right it doesnt compare.

What took me so long to figure out my RB was 3 bad coil packs and my o2 sensor heater was not wired in. It will take forever to start a car, but will eventually start without this. Start with ignition.

NGK BCPR-6ES's

After you get these, pull your coil packs out and have someone turn over the car, make sure you have spark everywhere.

Everyone needs a little help when starting off, thats why I wrote this up for you. Expect a little critizism from the other members, and maybe a locked thread or 2, because you posted about the new skyline which has absolutely NO relevance. Use the search button before you make 2 posts, lots of people dont take kindly to stupid questions on here, especially in the form of a new thread.

My money's on a combination of coils, plugs, and maybe your o2 sensor heater, if I'm right you owe me a pizza.

[USMCgetsome]

good advice but to get the ball rolling check these items.

Fuel injector power on the injector harness. Ecu pulse signal at the injectors. After u verify pull the CAS and spin it slowly clockwise and listen to each injector fire!

Coil packs! same check for 12vdc and ground and ecu pulse signal. There is a ground at the begining of the coil pack harness. Terminal lug right by the igniter chip. Ensure it is screwed in to the block.

AIR FLOW METER! This is most likely your issue! CHeck the fsm for powers and grounds.

ECCS relay. Very easy. If the key is forward power should be on all 4 pins.

If u need more assistance call me MARIO 210 837 1670.

[Bluefire]

All you need is 4 things to start a motor fuel, spark, compression and timing... Pull the plugs and crank the motor to see if your getting fuel into the cylinders. Check to see if your getting spark on all 6 cylinders. Do a compression check. And finally pull the upper cover and make sure the timing belt is lined up to all the marks at tdc. The cam angle sensor only goes in one way, so as long the timing belt is lined up your timing should be witihin range. You don't any other sensor on the motor to be hooked up for the motor to fire. No maf, tps, engine temp, aac, 02, etc... Those are only needed to have the car run properly, but not needed for the motor to fire up.

-Bluefire

[s13_240_rb20]

Thanks for all the help guys, I just got off work at 7am so I'm going to try to work on it this afternoon.

Most likely you either hit 121 (speed limiter), and thought since the speedo doesnt read anymore, it must be really really fast. Another possibility, although VERY unlikely, is that your motorset came with a chipped ECU. My roommates RB20 came with a chipped ECU and it had NO power until around 5 grand, and rev limiter hit at 8,000, with no speed limiter. This is likely not the case with yours. A stockish RB20 would take a LONG time to hit 145mph, and if I remember correctly you would be close to redline (6800/7000rpm) in fifth gear.

I am pretty sure that my ecu is not the stock one. It has a big label on it that looks "aftermarket-ish"..lol Atleast I always assumed that "Access. Super Complete Computer. Blitz." didn't sound like the label I'd find on a stock one That and I think I remember cutting or grounding the speed limiter wire (wire 50-ish). Also, my clip came with a HKS Turbo Timer (not stock, I assume??)

Anyways, thanks for the help!!! I'll probably start by checking ALL of my coilpacks instead of just one. My plugs keep fouling in gas (black and wet). When I tested a single coilpack for spark the other day, I put the coilpack in without a plug (unbolted, also) and turned the engine: coilpack popped out from compression, so I have "some" compression atleast.

I'll get back to ya after I test more...

--TJ