Who has just accepted the 2nd gen growl/vibration? And does this sound like it?

[ObsessiveDad]

I've read many posts about the "normal" vibration and growl in 2nd gen rogues at low RPM, and now wondering if I have it...or if it's something else. So for those that haven't found a culprit, how long have you driven with it? And has anyone got to the root of it?
2015 SL, 177K KM, first CVT fluid change was just shy of 100K, I've done two since at around 30K intervals. Oil changed regularly at 10K, never noticed metal in either fluid with a magnet drag through the catch container.

It's my wifes car so I rarely drive it, but she recently complained about shuddering while braking, turns out lower BJ's were gone on both sides, so I replaced the LCA's.
But something else doesn't "feel" right. I haven't driven it in a long time, but here's what stands out now that didn't before.

- Starting/cranking sounds "sharp" if that makes sense, like a higher pitched sound than before, and i'm pretty sure it's louder, but it starts fine every time, no hesitation.
- There's a general vibration at idle. Roof box rattles.
- When taking off from a dead stop, there is lurching at low speed from 20-30km/hr in the 1000-1500rpm range, IF you accelerate slowly. Over that speed or RPM it goes away, and not noticeable if you accelerate quickly, or even at a normal rate. You have to go intentionally slow off the line to make it happen, and it doesn't happen if there is any initial momemtum at all.
- When coasting slow (again 20-30km/hr range), if I tap the gas lightly, not even enough to rev the engine, there is a click. Sounds like it's coming from the TC, could just be the backlash I guess, but I've never noticed it before.
- The overall growl is definitely associated with engine load, as it goes away as soon as you let off the gas. It's not wheel bearing noise.
- I've had to replace some exhaust sections over the last year, so initially I thought there was a hole somewhere, but the more I drove the less it seemed like exhaust noise. It doesn't increase the same with heavy load that a normal exhaust break/hole noise would. And there's a noticable "rotational" quality to it at lower speeds.

No engine codes, and I drove around with CVTz50 running, and all CVT values are in spec, with no codes. I did run the idle air relearn, which seemed to smooth out the idle a little but that may just be in my head.
Also ran electrical system load tests, alternator was ok, but battery needs to be replaced.

I'm paranoid about the CVT due to all the horror stories, so am I looking for a problem here? Or does this sound like an issue (or multiple) that someone has diagnosed before?

[VStar650CL]

The TCM's in the gen2 Rogues have exactly the same tendency as the gen5 Altimas, they lock up the torque converter early and often. Consequently, when using light pedal (especially uphill) they "drum" the exhaust system and body panels because the TC remains locked while the engine lugs. It was so prevalent on early gen5's that we gave it a nickname -- the "Old Lady Noise", because people who hit the gas would rarely hear it, the complaints were all from people driving like grandma. It's less prevalent in Rogues, but still does happen. One thing which will greatly exacerbate it is worn-out exhaust hangers, that's worth checking.

[ObsessiveDad]

Thank you, I'll get it up on ramps this weekend and check. I'm still partly wondering if it's exhaust related, but it doesn't seem proportional to engine load, then I was wondering about CV's, maybe it is the wheel bearing again, etc. etc. because it seems to go away for that split second when the suspension is unloaded after going over a bump. But the noise and vibrations come and go, and change with speed/load etc....I can't put my finger on it.
I recorded it today, but I don't know how well someoene else might hear it.
The first one is highway speed, accellerating then coasting, staying around the 100km/hr mark.
The second is coming to a stop going down a hill (sometimes the engine brake will shoot the RPM up to 3000 and the noise will increase, but at higher speed than I was here), then accelerating away.
The third is a whine that accompanies the noise at low RPM, I don't know if the two are related.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/19Y3g4Y ... drive_link
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kTlRme ... drive_link
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1BNR3b7 ... drive_link

Again, there are no issues with the vehicle at the moment other than the noise and vibration, but something tells me it's a sign of issues to come.

[VStar650CL]

You need to make your Drive links public. Right click each file and tag "Sharing", then change the access to "Anyone With The Link".

[ObsessiveDad]

Ah. Done.
However, I’m now convinced it’s suspension/wheel related. Likely bearing…again.
Tried some specific scenarios yesterday after it seemed to go away for that second over a bump.
Accelerating hard from stop up a steep hill, no noise until the weight settles forward, then it comes back.
Hard left turn with some speed, no noise. Hard right turn with speed, worse.
So that would most likely be the drivers side bearing again, correct?

[ObsessiveDad]

Although as I send that post my wife started it right outside the window, and it’s the same noise on start. So could it be a bad mount? I’m trying to visualize how the motor/trans weight would be shifting under those situations, and it seems like that could also be the issue.

[VStar650CL]

Although as I send that post my wife started it right outside the window, and it’s the same noise on start. So could it be a bad mount? I’m trying to visualize how the motor/trans weight would be shifting under those situations, and it seems like that could also be the issue.

Yep. Mount or heat shield. Mounts are easy to check, have the wife increase idle speed to 900~1000 and then work the shifter D -> R -> D-> R etc. The engine should torque axially a very minimal amount, say, under 1/2", and there should be no planar rotation at all (parallel to the ground). Movement indicates one or more busted mounts. Planar movement usually implicates the transmission mount. For heat shields, jack the front and work your way around the shields, gently lifting with a screwdriver or small prybar. If you find broken or separated tack welds, that's probably your culprit. Repair them by clamping the shield with stainless worm-drive radiator clamps (actually a Nissan-approved technique).

[ObsessiveDad]

Mounts it is....and they're bad. There's a significant movement in the axial torque you mention, definitely more than 1/2". Both upper engine mounts look like they're starting to crack/seperate, I'm assuming the lower torque mount is also gone so I'm picking up a full set today to swap them out tomorrow or Wednesday. There's no visible planar movement but presumably the others being bad has placed more strain on that, so I should change it as well?. I remember it being much more of a PITA than the other three.
I changed all the mounts about a year ago chasing down another vibration, so I guess they were not good quality.

[VStar650CL]

I don't believe in fixing what ain't broke, and the transmission mount is indeed a complete PITA. The dogbone mount is the one which causes the most trouble most of the time, because it stresses everything else when it lets the engine wallow. So if you're on a budget, you can probably China-cheap out on the others, but I wouldn't do it on that one.

[ObsessiveDad]

Is that the upper torque mount? I still have the original lower torque mount (thought for sure I'd kept all of them actually, but can't find the others) so I'm considering putting that back on, as the mounts weren't the problem at the time, and the OEM are obviously higher quality than the aftermarket I purchased then.

[VStar650CL]

[ObsessiveDad]

Thanks again, changed the motor mounts about a week ago, minor improvement, so I assumed trans mount was also toast. Changed that out yesterday, it was wobbly for lack of a better word, symptoms mostly gone. Still have more of a vibration at idle than I remember, but maybe just due to age? About to hit 180K km's, no major issues (knock on wood), and I've been able to diagnose and repair all the wear parts that have failed up to now, thanks to the help of this forum (which really means Vstar... lol)

[VStar650CL]