Who do you think will win in Nov?

[stopcamping]

Just wondering how many people think Obama or Mccain will win.

Note: I'm not asking who you're going to vote for.

[Repo Man]

I think there are enough sheeple in this country that will vote for BHO for him to win.

[Cold_Zero]

Apparently, Obama is moving his acceptance address out of the Pepsi Center to Invesco Field. I am sure they are going to put on a "Rock Star" image for Obama at Invesco.

I just wish the Republicans would stop nominating Old White Guys. Nothing against Dole or McCain.

[96Qowner]

I just wish the Republicans would stop nominating Old White Guys. Nothing against Dole or McCain.

True. There are so MANY inexperienced unqualified candidates who aren't old OR white.

I think McCain will win, despite Democrats' expectations of a huge black turnout. If he doesn't, it's an amazing statement about voters - it'll be clear that they just don't think experience is necessary in a President. Amazing.

[WDRacing]

Experience or no a huge part of the population is tired of the way things are. So any percieved change be it BS or not seems like a step in the right direction. The next President will have his work cut out for him, so for me it all comes down to a personal issue, IRAQ. McCain wants to send over more troops and extend our stay. So he lost my vote...simple really. The other issues don't concern me.

Obama also has the Liberal media on his side. Which is sadly where most of America gets it's information. In this case I'm ok with that...but any other and I'd be pissed.

Obama FTW this year. War mongering is simply out of fashion these days.

WD

[rn79870]

I respect McCain, for his service and sacrifice to this country. However, I believe that Obama is the surest bet for peace in the middle east and an end to the war. America has a lot of rebuilding to do and I hope it starts in January.

[Repo Man]

You think Obama can bring peace to the Middle East? Since when has there EVER been peace in the Middle East?

In a way I feel sorry for Obama. There is no way in hell he is going to be able to deliver what the expectations of him are.

[WDRacing]

Well that's really the point Andy...there will NEVER be peace. So we need to pull out and stop dumping a metric ton of money into that cess pool.

Yeah yeah what about the terrorists. Well what about the fence we could build around the entire US with only 1 months spending in Iraq? BTW, that includes manning it with armed guards for the next 100 years.

[Repo Man]

I wasn't making a point about Iraq. The point I was making is that there are so many people that think Obamarama is the second coming of Christ and he will be able to cure all ills with the wave of his hand and a fart from his ***. I'm not saying Bob thinks that necessarily, just speaking in generalities.

[WDRacing]

Well, people will be sadly dissapointed when the next 4 years are filled with various stages of F'd up. But that will happen regardless of who's in office. It simply takes more then a few years to recover from a downward spiral like we're in.

On another note, I'm definitly not as Conservative as I thought I was. Which sucks because I'm left with no party that will ever be in office. If only an Independant could win office and we could flush party politics down the toilet where they belong. That my friend is the American Dream

WD

[Encryptshun]

Well, people will be sadly dissapointed when the next 4 years are filled with various stages of F'd up. But that will happen regardless of who's in office. It simply takes more then a few years to recover from a downward spiral like we're in.

On another note, I'm definitly not as Conservative as I thought I was. Which sucks because I'm left with no party that will ever be in office. If only an Independant could win office and we could flush party politics down the toilet where they belong. That my friend is the American Dream

Wow. It's like I wrote that myself. +1!

[96Qowner]

for me it all comes down to a personal issue, IRAQ. McCain wants to send over more troops and extend our stay. So he lost my vote...simple really. The other issues don't concern me.

McCain wanted, past tense, to increase troops levels to end the grinding stalemate we had going on under Rumsfeld's leadership. After fighting hard and ticking off a lot of Bush people, Rumsfeld resigned and troop levels were increase with much success. Here's a story from today:

http://www.star-telegram.com/190/story/747270.html

The Iraqi proposal stipulates that, once Iraqi forces have resumed security responsibility in all 18 of Iraq's provinces, U.S.-led forces would then withdraw from all cities in the country.

After that, the country's security situation would be reviewed every six months, for three to five years, to decide when U.S.-led troops would pull out entirely, al-Adeeb said.

All McCain ever wanted was to finish the job, instead of quitting, which is all Obama has ever suggested.

[rn79870]

It's a relative thing. Obama offers a hope of peace whereas McCain offers 4 to 8 more years of Bush. The Obama highway offers a far better chance of peace than that one Bush is on.

[WDRacing]

This is where the problem lies. Obama has never said quit, he's said withdraw...McCain has said stay until we're finish. So I stand by exactly what I said. There can be no victory in the middle east...ever. There will always be war and terrorists and bombing and general turmoil. What there doesn't have to be, is American soldiers getting killed. There also doesn't have be a friggin totally irresponsible hemorrhage of my damn tax dollars being pissed away for no friggin good reason.

There isn't any winning over there.

Also, I'm prior Enlisted and my wife is currently Enlisted. So all this talk about staying over there and finishing the job is great if you and your family aren't the ones actually deploying for 1 year at a time.

There aren't any WMDs and we've done all we are being allowed to do with the terrorists. So it's time to come home and heal our families and take care of the soldiers that have known nothing but war mongering since 1991.

I'll vote for anyone that gets us the hell out of Iraq the fastest.

[96Qowner]

As a vet, you're seriously ok with just walking away, no matter what?

That surprises me. I would have thought you'd want to think something was achieved by all that misery. Obama has always wanted nothing but to quit, or as you say, withdraw (not sure what the difference really is). That's all he ever had to offer. Now he's saying maybe he'll listen to the generals. Duh.

So, we'll see. Maybe we'll be able to find out whether an unqualified President is any worse than a qualified one. Personally, I'd rather stick with qualified guys.

[rn79870]

No one said quit. We've finished the job. It's time the Iraqi people stood up and accepted responsibility for their own future.

Bush went into this mess completely oblivious to the anything beyond "get Sadam" and his total lack of planning is showing. We can't give Sadam back, but we can sure as heck call it "finished" and let the Iraqi people assume the responsibility for fighting for their own country.

[rn79870]

So, we'll see. Maybe we'll be able to find out whether an unqualified President is any worse than a qualified one. Personally, I'd rather stick with qualified guys.

I'd have to disagree with the "unqualified" label you seem to want Obama to wear. I doubt anyone could be more unqualified than the current administration, nor more inept at leading.

I don't see anything in McCain's resume that qualifies him to be president. This of course, doesn't take away any of the sacrifice he has made for our country, but that alone doesn't qualify him for anything.

[96Qowner]

Heheh, yes this is the answer you always get. No one argues that Obama is actually qualified - they only try to claim that others aren't either, or that qualifications don't matter.

But the question is whether an unqualified guy can win the Presidency. I think there's a good chance of it, yes.

[Encryptshun]

Maybe we'll be able to find out whether an unqualified President is any worse than a qualified one. Personally, I'd rather stick with qualified guys.

Did you vote for George W. Bush? If so, then you already know what it's like.

George W. Bush's only direct political experience prior to become POTUS was a 5-year stint as governor of Texas.

Obama has 7 years as Illinois state Senator and 3.5 more as federal Senator.

Please tell me how our current President was an experienced candidate when he was elected president the first time and how Obama is, therefore, not.

[rn79870]

Apparently you haven't seen Obama's resume. An expert on constitutional law, for one thing, probably will result in a leader that is less inclined to go off on illegal tangents. Merely serving in the senate for 500 years does not lead to a qualified president.

[96Qowner]

This is threadjacking, I think, so I don' want to carry this very far, but yes, Obama was a college professor in Constitutional Law. Swell. Maybe he'd be a good Federal judge.

If you wish, we can take up Obama's elusive qualifications, or their necessity, in a new thread.

[rn79870]

I think you meant "Law School" not college. Big difference there.

Feel free to start a new thread on Obama.

[Repo Man]

I'd have to disagree with the "unqualified" label you seem to want Obama to wear. I doubt anyone could be more unqualified than the current administration, nor more inept at leading.

I don't see anything in McCain's resume that qualifies him to be president. This of course, doesn't take away any of the sacrifice he has made for our country, but that alone doesn't qualify him for anything.

The current administration is NOT on the damned ticket Bob. They have nothing to do with anything. We have a choice between Obama and McCain. Period. Given the choice between the two, I'll take the one that has been put to the test time and time again and just keeps coming out on top. You don't think that making the choice to do the right thing even though it may cost you your life counts as a qualification to be president? It demonstrates to me the character of a man that I want to lead.

With regard to the war, McCain is the only one of the two that has seen the horror of war. He understands exactly what the ramifications are if he was to pull the trigger, so don't you guys think that he would make it his last resort?

I suppose also the many years he has spent as a Senator don't count? If that's the case, that renders Obama HIGHLY unqualified to lead. So, if that is the case, what does make Obama qualified?

No one can answer that question. No one.

Obama has 7 years as Illinois state Senator and 3.5 more as federal Senator.

And what did he accomplish in those years? What has he done as the Senator from Illinois to put us on the right track? What legislation has he sponsored? What position has he taken on ANYTHING that may have been unpopular?

[stopcamping]

If you wish, we can tke up Obama's elusive qualifications, or their necessity, in a new thread.

As the op, I dont mind.

[rn79870]

Although the current administration will not be on the ballot this November, the republican choice represents 4 to 8 more years of the same. Show me one example of McCain calling Busk to task for any of the many mistakes he's made in Iraq, or for that matter, where McCain is not intent on continuing the failed policy.

Even if the "inexperienced" moniker is true, (which I don't buy) perhaps we need a leader who is willing to learn as he goes instead of one who has been taught by an administration that fails to see the errors of its ways.

[Cold_Zero]

I would also point out that Legislative experience does not always translate into Administrative Experience. We typically elect govenors and people that have overseen large federal bodies or administrations:Bush- GovernorClinton- GovernorBush- Director of Central Intelligence and Vice PresidentReagan- GovernorCarter- GovernorFord- Not electedNixon- Governor and Vice PresidentJohnson- Vice PresidentKennedy- ExceptionEisenhower- Supreme Allied CommanderTruman- Vice PresidentFDR- Governor and Assistant Sec of NavyHoover- Head of FDA and Secretary of CommerceCoolidge- Governor and Vice President

You guys get the point.

[Encryptshun]

^ Not to shirk your original question, CZ (I'm researching that one), but in your example of Governors becoming Presidents maybe the formula isn't really working. If you elect a State executive to the position of Federal executive what you get is arguably (1) someone who runs a country like a state and (2) someone who is experienced at keeping a legislative body in check. Maybe (and you are correct, we cannot know) someone with more legislative experience understands the system a bit better from a law-making standpoint.

*EDIT -- I should state for the record that I'm not an Obama fanboi. Neither am I rah-rah McCain. I am tired of having to vote for the person who will do the least harm rather than the most good. /rant

[Repo Man]

Apparently you haven't seen Obama's resume. An expert on constitutional law...

He obviously doesn't understand the 2nd Amendment...

[Repo Man]

Even if the "inexperienced" moniker is true, (which I don't buy) perhaps we need a leader who is willing to learn as he goes instead of one who has been taught by an administration that fails to see the errors of its ways.

Yep. That's about what I thought. Neither one of those you present is a good choice.

[AZhitman]

Show me one example of McCain calling Busk to task for any of the many mistakes he's made in Iraq, or for that matter, where McCain is not intent on continuing the failed policy.

we need a leader who is willing to learn as he goes .

You didn't answer the question. Is this telcoman logged in as Bob?

McCain has CLEARLY distanced himself from the President. You think he's gonna risk the support of his party by throwing the current POTUS under the bus?

"Learns as he goes"? The most powerful man in the WORLD? Good God, Bobby. Woud you get on a plane flown by a pre-teen?