which work better?

[180sx Dreams]

Hey guys I was working on my project 240 and got to thinking which set up i was going to use, I didnt want to resort to coilovers because I still want to daily drive the thing. So I came down to either tein s.tech springs with KYB AGX's or the eibach pro-kits with the AGX's. I'm having a ahard time choosing because I know that eibach has been in the game for quite a while, but tein has also blown up into a trustworthy name brand. So I was just wondering which set up would be better. I will be doing more ground pounding than granny driving.

[Cholos_D]

You really need to decide what springrates you want. Pro kit's and S-Techs are only about 1.5 times stiff as stock. They're pretty much a lowering spring that is slightly more stiff to compensate for the loss of suspension travel. I like the RS*R Race springs because their rates are at 5k, which is less than coilovers, but 2.5 times as stiff as stock. I'm also looking at the Tokiko D-spec shocks. They're 16 way adjustable, but they cost more than AGX's. There is a post on here somewhere that has the rates for just about every spring that's available.

[Looneybomber]

Why not go with full blown coil-overs since you're going to be doing more "ground pounding" than daily driving? I've heard of guys on the Miata forum running JIC's with 12/9kg spring rates and love the way they ride on the road. Just because you have a coilovers with a stiff spring rate, doesn't mean your car will ride like crap. The Tein Basics come in a 7/7 for the 240 IIRC though that might not be an optimal combination for a 240. I know in miatas you'll want a 2-3 kg spread from front to back to keep the front roll couple in check, but I don't know if you need to stagger your rates on a 240. It's worth checking into sway bars too!

[crackler]

From my own exsperience / driving style Tien S techs are not a high enough sping rate, I still get a fair amount of body roll, that is with stock swaybar, Koni yellows and ES full bushings kit. FWIWAnd if I'm not mistaken; the Tein's area a (slighty) higher spring rate than the comperable Eibach's?
Modified by cracker at 7:31 PM 7/28/2006

[nismofly]

eibachs are softer than stock

teins are progressive, which is teh suck

if you want to keep spring and shock combo with decent ride and performance compromise, id say go with rs*r down springs, theyre 1 and 1/2 times stock stiffness, lower fairly well, and will still be comfortable

[SR20Essex]

Im running Eibachs and KYB's, lower than stock, sweetest, smoothest daily Ive ever had. Thick Greddy swaybars Front and rear though so there isn't that much body roll (I used poly bushings and larger truck swaybar links too). I did all the camber arms, subframe bushings, tie rods, tension rods...etc too. I really should do a writeup on what I did. Some of my local 240 friends took a ride in it and ask me 1000 questions about the suspension setup.

Its not just the shocks/springs you need to think about when considering comfort, body roll..etc.

[sr20goofus]

some thing u need to consider is how and where you drive your car. A coilover system with 12k/9k spring rates is a rediculous setup for road driving, u will hate it. But a system with like 9k/8k or a 550lb/450lb setup is more of the setup that is ideal for track 240's not too stiff to keep traction alive in the rear, but also ...MUCH stiffer than stock.

I personally run Tein Springs with KYB shocks because at the time i was strapped for cash, but after doing 9 HPDE's and a year of dailydriving i realize the only fault is teh springs, i have learned a great deal on this basic suspension, but me and my past instructor believe i am outdriving the suspension now. So i am upgrading to Koni shiocks with a ground control coilover with 550lb/450lb spring rates and upper pillowballmounts. Overall cost is abtou teh same as all the decent coilover systems even tho it is pieced togeather, but i nthe end it has the exact spring rates i want, replaceable shock, proper valving, and built for abuse .

most of the companies that advertise their basic spring for the stock setup use different units of measurment for what their spring rates are, or they arnt listed at all, do a little research to find out which springs are the stiffest, from what i recall RSR does make the stiffest spring for stock setup (KYB Shocks), goodluck to ya, and being that this is yoru first time doing suspension on a 240, dont jump into a fancy setup and replacing all the linkages and all, u dont even know what your changing if you dont even know whats best for your driving style yet.

[AmoebAssassin]

From experience (I road race/drift my 240sx), you won't be happy with a spring/shock combo once you become comfortable with your car in a performance environment. I say just go with KTS or Stance coilovers (best bang for buck). I have KTS on mine, and I'd say the car is rough, but still daily driveable.

[onosqv]

From experience (I road race/drift my 240sx), you won't be happy with a spring/shock combo once you become comfortable with your car in a performance environment. I say just go with KTS or Stance coilovers (best bang for buck). I have KTS on mine, and I'd say the car is rough, but still daily driveable.

You know what's really interesting? I've been overly spoiled by a built up 240sx, that I hit a plateau, went back to stock suspension, and found out a few of my problems .

No matter what your setup, if you are out there on the track and ask for help from more veteran drivers, you'll learn something.

I thought I had been doing great in my full suspensioned out 240 (never tracked a stock 240 before), and knew I had a lot more to improve. After a while (a month or so ago), I just couldn't get better... partially car problems w/ acceleration, but weird things were happening that I couldn't figure out.

Took my stock VERT to the track. You learn so much more about weight distribution/management and driving techniques in a stock car, haha. Found out there's actually another 4 seconds AT LEAST for me to get out of the stock suspension.

After the autox school/event I attended this past weekend. I'm all about learning to drive the car stock first.

*p.s. I had kts coilovers, FTW.

[nismofly]

i went to one track day on stock suspension, blew two shocks curbing, and havent been back

i decided to skip the steps in between and go straight to coils, they go on probably this weekend

im still hoping to learn more in a softer suspension-ed car at some point though

[91rs13]

From experience (I road race/drift my 240sx), you won't be happy with a spring/shock combo once you become comfortable with your car in a performance environment. I say just go with KTS or Stance coilovers (best bang for buck). I have KTS on mine, and I'd say the car is rough, but still daily driveable.

I agree with this statement. I had a Whiteline lowering spring with Koni Yellows on the car and recently converted the Koni's to Coilovers. Wow--what a difference the stiffer springs make.

If you do not already have good dampers ---get the KTS or Stance set up --based on the feedback out there you will be quite happy.

[DanS]

The more that I have learned the more I understand that springs are stupid. They simply provide a progressive mechanical force and the dampers if working well make them look good. In short invest your money in the best dampers you can get your hands on.

Sadly most of the things I have under my belt go back to FWD cars with very poor geometry and working hard to correct it. I look forward to learning a great deal about the geometry of these cars and putting some of the things I have learned to use on S13s and S14s.

My guess would be to keep the car off its bump stops (don't lower it), keep the huge sways off the car with none at all on the rear. Add a bit of stiffness to the spring rates with maybe a bit more in the front than the rear. I would be careful to keep the suspension frequency in the 2.2 ballpark.

After that I would do a lot of work with the dampers, maybe call up my friends at Aftershocks or DMS and see what we could work out. I know that DMS makes a rally tarmac set up for the S13 and S14 both and they may well be a very nice place to start. Aftershocks however will custome make whatever I want.

To cap it off I'd move the batt and maybe a fuel cell in the back seat to keep the PMI reasonable. After that its time to tinker with rubber and fine tune it until it turns like a top.

For some interesting tidbits read http://www.rqriley.com/suspensn.htm

[DanS]

By the way... I think its interesting to read that one member put his stock set up on the car, went back to the track and went faster. This is not a mirage.

The sad facts are that most all of the stuff you can buy on the open market is made to "feel fast" and not be fast. They slam the car so it rides on the bumps, get rid of a lot of the roll and at the least keep, if not put in more understeer than was there to start with.

They do this for the simple reason that to put a neutral car in the hands of most folks can kill people. Sad facts are that many folks can't drive and understeer is forgiving and easy to deal with. Also the sudden snap into oversteer that you can get on an otherwise neutral car can be a beech.

I for one set up my cars to be neutral and respect the limits. Understeer feels dead to me and I long to get back in my own car and have at it.

Now in the intrest of not hijacking this any more than I have, I like the RS-Rs.
Modified by DanS at 7:00 AM 8/11/2006

[onosqv]

By the way... I think its interesting to read that one member put his stock set up on the car, went back to the track and went faster. This is not a mirage.

I hope you're not referring to my post... my stock setup is slower than my fixed up setup no contest, but the stock allowed me to learn how to be a faster driver overall.

But if not referring to mine, carry on!!!

[DanS]

Oops, I guess I misread your post. Sad facts are however that many aftermarket kits just "feel" faster. I was using your observation as a point which I guess you did not make.

[onosqv]

We're just attacking the same points at different angles .

In the end, it's all about just getting out on the track. Everything else comes second.

[DanS]

No question at all. I am however a big fan of spending money where it works the most for us.