Whats up with all the NA/KA's Now?

[SMoKeM240]

in the past two weeks, ive seen more NA stuff poping up than turbo stuff it seems like... so is everyone going NA now or something? i thought i was the only one with a built E motor, but it looks like more people are starting to do it...

[250sx]

what kind of built do you mean about your motor?

[1991S13]

Not to put down turbos, because I would love to boost my s13, but I think I would be more proud of a built NA engine rather than having an engine that got most of it's power from a turbo.

[240marcuSX]

i bounced around about which motor, turbo or not etc etc for a while, but i started racing more seriously last season, and now im modding my car to fit into my class (street touring) so turbocharging my car would be out of the question.

[SMoKeM240]

i like NA power and i want to do scca this year too, so i need it to be NA, and im also gonna do dual carbs or itbs...

[Z Style]

Not to put down turbos, because I would love to boost my s13, but I think I would be more proud of a built NA engine rather than having an engine that got most of it's power from a turbo.

I agree. Where I come from people think that boost is the only way to get good HP out of an engine and they are louder.

[Chingon]

I read your car profile...is there anything else to your built engine that you have not updated? Many ppl in the na section seem to be running at least the same amount of mods you have.

I really haven't seen a fully counterweighted crank, a blueprinted engine, high comp. pistons, aggressive cams, ported head, port-matched manifolds, light-weight rods, balanced pistons/rods, itbs etc.. besides maybe devious...?

[deviousKA]

This forum here on nico probably has the most posters that actually have NA ka's, but there is a lot around that dont post on internet forums, mainly in datsuns. Just be glad the breed continues to develop and that we have decent discussion here. I have lots of projects that i dont discuss much because i have still lots of time and effort to finish them to 100%. Problem i have is absence of good lightweight chassis besides my s13 to test with, of my own that is. I have a 240sx coupe, but i feel the need to sell it and go with a smaller car.

Heres a picture of a 2005 season sprint car that i am helping develop an engine for. It is the 2004 washington sprint 100 champion, owned by mike miller. The rules have been changed for this next season and a ka is going to be utilized, ka24e. The ka is far from dead, the competition is going to have quite a handful.

[Chingon]

yeah...i meant in the forums,...not overall, I mean, the engine seems to be a fav. for lots of 510 guys.

[matt4pl]

im gonna be joining the ranks soon too. I got a local shop to go into the project with me. the guy will do the labor for free and i pay for the parts (which he gets me at cost)

[SMoKeM240]

I read your car profile...is there anything else to your built engine that you have not updated? Many ppl in the na section seem to be running at least the same amount of mods you have.

I really haven't seen a fully counterweighted crank, a blueprinted engine, high comp. pistons, aggressive cams, ported head, port-matched manifolds, light-weight rods, balanced pistons/rods, itbs etc.. besides maybe devious...?

If you where talking to me, then yes i have more mods that most do.. mines bored .040 over, head shaved, 3angle job, block decked, had crank work, rods worked on, mild porting job.. the only thing i can do left is ITBs and a cam and maybe higher comp. but its at 9.8:1 right now, maybe higher. plus i have have all smog stuff removed, header, UD Pulley,exhaust.. so i think i have more than most people do

[crzycav86]

I really haven't seen a fully counterweighted crank, a blueprinted engine, high comp. pistons, aggressive cams, ported head, port-matched manifolds, light-weight rods, balanced pistons/rods, itbs etc.. besides maybe devious...?

I think that when people get to that level of engine-work, they realize that it would have been much easier and cheaper to make power with a decent turbo setup. That's why you don't see too many NA-KA's making real power.

NA is for the true hardcore and the true layman alike. Most people inbetween have a turbo under their hoods.

[Chingon]

you're right...it's kinda sad really. I want to build a ka, but am hopefully saving for something bigger, lighter, newer, more reliable, well, I'm going "inbetween" you may say.

[ca18datsun510]

ka's are popular with 510's cause they are abundant and cheap. everybody takes the ka out of there 240, to put in a sr. everybody takes the l series out of there 510 to put in a ka. somebody should start build l16's and putting them in 240's

[mackdaddy240]

Very true, after building up my NA to a decent level, one of my friends bolted a turbo on with cheap sr20 parts along with fuel management, and smoked me. Kind of depressing, since I spent a lot more time on my NA, but like your said, its a lot better accomplishment to build it up na rather than just bolting on a turbo.

[midnightsliding]

im jumping on the band wagon b/c i love the way NA feels. if a stock KA feels good to me i cant wait untill i can really put some money into it for some decint power.

[Arrow]

I think that either way someone goes the old saying: "you get out what you put in." comes into play here. To build a NA KA most ppl have personaly knowledge and a good number of them do the work themselves. While a good number of ppl that have a turbo don't necessarily do the work themselves, they have a shop do it. Yeah, a shop might be great, but you're going to pay more and you can't really have the same sense of doing it yourself....

Personally, I'm planning on turbocharging my KA. But, I'm also planning on doing it all myself or with the help of some knowledgeable friends and ppl. I'm going to start to rebuild my SOHC engine this summer (I have a second engine sitting in my shed so I don't have to have my car down)

And as far as daily driving goes, I think that a turbo holds more daily driving ability (and fuel economy) than a good NA build... Gut to each his/her own! And it comes down to what you want to do with your car aswell.

Just my two cents...

[mackdaddy240]

I've done quite a bit to my NA and I still get 28-30 mpg. But I'm sure that cams will drop it about 4-8 mpg havent asked anyone that has them yet, anyone know how much cams hurts your mpg??

[ArticDragon192]

^ Whoa! You get mean *** gas mileage!

[mackdaddy240]

Thats on the highway about 70-75 mph. In town its closer to 22 to 24 but my damn ACT 4 puck clutch makes me rev kinda higher then normal and drop the clutch in order to take off from dead stop so that probably doesnt help.

[r0b]

the KA is just a great performer. according to the dyno sheets on this site: http://www.datsuns.com/Tech/datsundyno.htm

a guy got 170lb.-ft and 169hp to the wheels with a '92 ka24de with bolt-ons and a JWT ecu. That is more hp and WAY MORE torque (which is what matters anyway ) sooner in the RPM range than NissanPerformanceMag.com's tuned SR20VE swap.

i like the KA more and more each day. now if only there was a bolt-on supercharger for it...

[SMoKeM240]

isn't that what a stock SR puts down to the wheels? so he has 200hp at the crank

[ArticDragon192]

Just about, but think about it. An NA enigine make the same amount of power as a stock FI engine with only a few bolt ons.

[mackdaddy240]

But the bolt ons are pretty damn expensive especially jwt way overpriced in my opinion, spend the same money on stock turbo sr engine and the gains will be much higher. I'm NA ka guy but you have to look at both sides.

[mackdaddy240]

Just noticed on the site that it says 104 octane also.

KA24DE (1992 240SX SE 5-speed)(RWD)KA24DE (DOHC)Jim Wolf Technology ECU, S & S Headers, Greddy Cat Back Exhaust, Ram Air Intake, Unorthodox Racing Pulley, 104 octane.169hp @ 5600rpm170ft/lbs @ 4400rpm

[r0b]

from NPM.com:

"The 187 horses and the whiplash pull of variable valve lift (VVL) produced by the SR20VE motor teases the 140 horsepower SR20DE owners..."

"Now it's time for the dyno results! Horsepower peaks at 173whp at 7100rpms and torque peaks at 140 ft/lbs around 5300-5400 rpm."

Their sr20ve has a Hotshot CIA & Header, a 2.5" exhaust, and JWT tuned ECU, not to mention VVL.

as far as N/A vs. N/A and $ vs. $ is concerned, tuning the KA reaps great rewards with little effort.

even though i haven't seen their charts (i'd really like to see DeviousKA's, and those other ITB wild-men) i know there are guys making very respectable numbers, very respectably (no boost). I've owned 3 turbocharged cars (still own one of them) and I LOVE boost, but they have all been turbo'd from the factory. It is easy to get gains, but that is because the turbo is there to begin with. A lot of people don't have $3,000 at any one time to pay for a swap (or just the engine, for that matter!). Most people mod their car gradually, and if over time that same $3,000 went into an N/A 240, you could build a better all-around package (things that need it like flywheel/clutch/LSD, brakes, suspension, chassis bracing, etc).

Granted, i see forced-induction (supercharger or CA18DET) in my future, but I plan to have the car completely "sorted out" before then.

but that's just my approach