What determines a flush/fill on the M45 trannny at the 30k service ?

[LEXKYM45]

Hey guys, getting ready to take my '06 M45 in for its 30k service. Just curious, what do they do to determine whether or not to flush and fill the transmission fluid?

Do they test the current fluid or is it just a visual "test"?

BTW, I'm new to the forum and have enjoyed reading all of the threads posted by all of you. Great job Z !

Rob
Modified by LEXKYM45 at 5:29 PM 3/7/2008

[szh]

Thanks, Rob.

My philosophy is to do a proper flush of the transmission every 30k miles. Not just a "drain and fill". First was at just about 10k (probably overkill), second at 30k (my normal schedule), and the next one is this coming Tuesday at 60k miles.

Does not matter to me if the fluid "looks" good or not at that point - I just do the flush regardless! Although you could, in theory, do the "white filter paper test" described in posts in our Infiniti On Line Mechanic forum to make this decision for yourself.

My reasoning is based on (a) experience with a transmission going bad and needing replacement - expensive! and (b) the words of wisdom from Q45tech, who has many hundreds of thousands of miles in Infiniti vehicles and seen many dead transmissions come through T3 in Atlanta.

Z

[maxnix]

Hey guys, getting ready to take my '06 M45 in for its 30k service. Just curious, what do they do to determine whether or not to flush and fill the transmission fluid?

Do they test the current fluid or is it just a visual "test"?

The dealer does. But don't confuse a partial drain and refill, which leaves about 6 quarts of old fluid in your transmission, with a complete mechanical exchange. And even of the few dealers who perform a complete mechanical exchange none drop the pan to clean and inspect it, the magnetic bolt, and replace the inner filter screen and O ring. Even some BG shops won't do that. And you must use the Nissan fluid (Jmatic?).

http://www.bgfindashop.com

Here is the problem with the inspection. Once any deterioration is noted, the fluid should have been changed already. If you are going to keep the car or want to maintain original as new OEM performance of your transmission, perform the ATF mechnical exchange, pandrop, filter replacement and new gasket and one time use bolts every 30K. We old timers with the more heavily designed RE4 also add an external ATF cooler like a B&M 70264 or 70268.

Remember the RE5 was designed for the VQ35DE series and pressed into service on the VK. Hence the ratios are optimized for the VQ, and it weighs significantly less than the RE4.

Dealers are not concerned abouit long term life of your car. They just want it to last beyond initial or extended warranty so when large costly components fail, it is on your dime, not their's nor Nissan's.
Modified by maxnix at 8:06 PM 3/9/2008

[Q45tech]

Matter of balancing WHEN you get to spend the $4-$5,000 on a replacement transmission. In any case it costs you 2.5-3 cents per mile to USE the transmission..............if you try to sell a car with a bad transmission that amount will be deducted from offering price unless you find an idiot buyer.

Can a total ATF replacement buy you some extension time on the big capital cost - SURE IT CAN. Is $250 worth deferring $5,000 for it sure is you will need to do a breakeven analysis.

If you spend $750 per 100k and gain 75,000 miles you are way ahead!

[LEXKYM45]

Thanks guys! I had made up my mind that I was going to do the flush & fill even if they said it was okay. Do I need to ask service manager if they drop the pan and change the filter and O ring as part of that service? From what I've read that may not always be the case. I'm going to call them today and find out and see if there is any difference in price. I'll let you guys know.

Rob

[szh]

I am not sure about this, but ... it is my understanding that dropping the pan on the new RE5 transmissions is not possible. They sealed it ... a lot more than the RE4! (Please let us know what the dealer says about this - I wil also ask on Tuesday when I take my car in for the work.)

In the early days, there was even a question of whether the fluid could be changed (i.e., the transmission was supposedly totally sealed up - no drain and no fill opening). Fortunately, this turned out to be incorrect ... it is possible to do a fluid flush - not just a drain and fill!

NOTE: these new transmissions require Nissan Fluid J for sure. Your transmission might be damaged otherwise, and Nissan/Infiniti is very clear in numerous bold type locations in the Owner's and Service Manuals, that this will void the transmission warranty!!

Z

[LEXKYM45]

Sorry about the late reply regarding dropping the pan on '06 M45 transmission. I talked to my service tech about dropping the pan on my flush/fill and he said they cant. There is only the screen to replace. I also asked him about switching over to synthetic oil on mine and he wouldn't recommend it. He said he's seen 3 M45s in the past couple years that have blown the engine using it. He did say however he wasnt totally sure of the driving habits of all of the owners. He knew of one that was driven pretty hard and maxxed out his OCI with Mobil 1. He recommended a good dino oil with regular scheduled oil changes. The dealer here uses Valvoline product but he uses Castrol GTX. Ah, the debate goes on.

Rob

[szh]

Sorry about the late reply regarding dropping the pan on '06 M45 transmission. I talked to my service tech about dropping the pan on my flush/fill and he said they cant. There is only the screen to replace.

But they can do a powered flush. And, that is highly recommended every 30k miles. I just had my 60k one done, but I forgot to ask if the pan can be dropped (I believe it cannot).

I also asked him about switching over to synthetic oil on mine and he wouldn't recommend it. He said he's seen 3 M45s in the past couple years that have blown the engine using it.

Not that is something that I have difficulty believing was due to the synthetic oil! It is probably more likely that the owner bought into the "can do extended OCI with synthetic" and did not care for the engine properly.

I now have just over 60k miles on my M45 with a steady diet of Mobil 1 0W-40 and it behaves perfectly (except for the occasional carbon build-up which a can of BG-44K - about 500 miles before the oil change - takes care of).

He did say however he wasnt totally sure of the driving habits of all of the owners. He knew of one that was driven pretty hard and maxxed out his OCI with Mobil 1.

Yup.

He recommended a good dino oil with regular scheduled oil changes. The dealer here uses Valvoline product but he uses Castrol GTX. Ah, the debate goes on.

Like I have always said, if you do regular 3750 miles (or lower) OCI as well as the filter, then any good dino oil will do perfectly fine! If you want to use the good stuff, then go for Chevron Supreme 5W-30 or Castrol GTX 5W-30 and you will be perfectly fine.

If you want to use synthetic and like a particular brand or formulation, then please do so without fear of problems. For example, I use Mobil 1 0W-40 and like it a lot.

If you want to use a blend (to get the best of both worlds), toss in 3 qts of Castrol GTX 5W-30 and 3 qts of Mobil 1 0W-40 and it will still be just fine!

However, and this is the important point, I still do an oil and filter change every 3750 miles without fail. That is the key element to the story.

Z

[Q45tech]

Don't assume the typical service writer is as competent as the typical used car salesman. Don't assume that the typical dealer technican is competent to analyse technology or select fluids.

Since the TCU is now integrated into AT housing of course the AT pan can be removed.................sealed is relative, seal to owner is not sealed to technican.