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RicerX
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Patrick George of Jalopnik wrote:
Few automakers embody the concept of disappointment more than Nissan does. With the notable exception of the GT-R, there's no real reason to buy Nissan's middling, anonymous, bloated-looking cars over their competitors. Many were hoping the Nissan IDx and Infiniti Q50 Eau Rogue would help snap the company out of its coma, but don't bank on that happening.

Automotive News reports that Nissan and Infiniti have "mellowed out" as they head into 2015, shifting their emphasis away from exciting new products like the Eau Rogue, IDx and the electric BladeGlider to focus more on "tried-and-true volume products" and global market share.

Ugh. Basically, their plan is to shy away from compelling products and double-down on boring ones to chase volume. That's awesome. That's what the world needs. It's worked so well for Volkswagen, hasn't it?

The report doesn't say that the on again, off again IDx and Q50 Eau Rogue are in fact dead, but it certainly implies their production chances aren't great. They've been hurt by the departures of two executives who were champions for exciting cars — Andy Palmer, who left for Aston Martin, and Johan De Nysschen, who split for Cadillac, both apparently taking any sense of enthusiasm the company had with them.

Palmer was the one who promised a production BladeGlider, and De Nysschen later took to Facebook to b**** about how it was like pulling teeth to get his engineers to build an actual driver's car.

Maybe there's some hope still. We know a new hybrid GT-R is in development; a new Z is supposedly in the works, even if it seems like they can't figure out what to do with it; and while it won't be for public consumption, their front-engine Le Mans racer seems fascinating.

Get your s*** together, Nissan. Give the world something that makes them care about your brand again. The Altima's not going to do it.
via Jalopnik

Beat the dead horse, NICONauts.


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Bubba1
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I would call it more of a pile-on than whipping a dead horse. Nissan still has a pulse and still has the ability to bring back the fun. They' appear to be choosing to move away from fun, which suggests being steered by accountants instead of car guys. Not good. That said, I think Nissan's bean-counter centric braintrust is on borrowed time with their surge in appliance vehicle sales, as the key to selling a lot in that segment is good reliability. And there's evidence to suggest that they've been taking reliability a bit for granted recently as they're in a significant decline. At some point, consumers will notice that and begin looking elsewhere.

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RicerX
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I can tell you that with the electronics in our Rogue SV's infortainment system (as well as the maintenance tracking software) being broken and Nissan not having a resolution for it, the wife and I are definitely discouraged.

My family has owned two Stanzas, two Maximas, an S13 hatch, a Sentra Spec V, three Altimas, and three Zs in addition to this Rogue, and I'm not getting warm fuzzies here. I believe that I am now past the point where I may have bought my last new Nissan product. The only exception to the rule may be if I grab a Frontier in the coming year or two.

I am noticing many cut corners in their products, and its for no other reason than to pad profits and get generic crap out the door in the name of volume. It's very disappointing when I know what they're capable of producing.

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You know, as I was driving a B13 sentra today to replace a busted mustang, I had a mini-epiphany.

We all complain about how long the models have hung around and everything, but in truth, we only seem to complain about the new models more and more.
And then I got to wondering... were people complaining when the S13 was in its 10th year of production or something? We all WISH we had more of those cars. I just wonder if in 15 years from now, we wish Nissan kept making the same ol Z34 for a few years longer.

Then again, I could be TOTALLY wrong.

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No, I distinctly remember when they axed the Z32 in 96, that a lot of my friends were sad, and complaining about how it was unfair that Japan still had it in production. I still don't like the Z33, and it's been out for 12 years now. Z34 will be the same way. Reason being, they aren't driver's cars. They just aren't. Mazda is still doing it right. On the fun cars, they're going light on the driver aids. Nissan thinks we can pile more crap into a car, and people will like it. When a built in Keurig is a factory option, don't say I didn't warn you.

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PapaSmurf2k3 wrote:You know, as I was driving a B13 sentra today to replace a busted mustang, I had a mini-epiphany.

We all complain about how long the models have hung around and everything, but in truth, we only seem to complain about the new models more and more.
And then I got to wondering... were people complaining when the S13 was in its 10th year of production or something? We all WISH we had more of those cars. I just wonder if in 15 years from now, we wish Nissan kept making the same ol Z34 for a few years longer.

Then again, I could be TOTALLY wrong.
That's an interesting theory... Looking at the last generation G35/G37 as an example, which was essentially unchanged from 2007-2013 (with the exception of a few options and 20HP), you could buy a 2013 brand new nicely equipped for like 33k, which made it a steal compared to any competition... Obviously the longer they build the same thing, the cheaper they should be able to make it...

I feel the same way about the current Z. I drove one not too long ago and it's a nice car, there's not a lot I'd change about it. I don't want a computer on wheels, and finding a reasonably priced well performing sports car that's not loaded with tons of useless crap is getting hard to find.

There is something to be said about sticking with something that's good, but I highly doubt people will be saying that about muranos and altimas with CVT's.

One thing that I've noticed is that it seems that BMW particularly does, is their models evolve very slowly. Comparing one model to prior generation, it's definitely different, but it's not DRASTICALLY different. I think minor changes are easier to swallow than major changes..

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I came into this thread thinking we were gonna talk about aliens or something. Not what I expected at all.

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AAhhahhhaahhhaa!! It wasn't just me! I was going to post the same thing, lol!

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themadscientist
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Nissan lost me a while ago. My old GTR will be surrounded by Subarus by the end of the month.

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MinisterofDOOM
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PapaSmurf2k3 wrote:You know, as I was driving a B13 sentra today to replace a busted mustang, I had a mini-epiphany.

We all complain about how long the models have hung around and everything, but in truth, we only seem to complain about the new models more and more.
And then I got to wondering... were people complaining when the S13 was in its 10th year of production or something? We all WISH we had more of those cars. I just wonder if in 15 years from now, we wish Nissan kept making the same ol Z34 for a few years longer.

Then again, I could be TOTALLY wrong.
That's certainly not the '90s I remember. The '90s I remember were full of enthusiasm for the likes of the 240sx, Z, Supra, Celica, Miata, and other fun Japanese cars. The Maxima was a huge hit back then, not just some also-ran blandiferous segment-filler like today. I do vividly remember the disappointment in both owners and the media when Nissan decided to keep the Maxima's MSRP the same for the '95 redesign by cutting features (like IRS) and offering a true base model with steel wheels and cheaper trimwork. But, even then, the Altima continued to excell with a superb platform and engine, Maxima was STILL an outstanding car even in its complacency, the 240 was still unique and appreciated (and very overpriced)...

Nope, I remember an early-mid 1990s that loved Nissan, because Nissan loved building cars. Now, Nissan just loves trying to pretend they're Toyota. Different company, different times, both reflected in the models they made.

Honestly, I think part of the problem with Nissan today might be fear of what happened to the company in the late 90s. As financial troubles piled up, the company kept right on doing what they had always done for the most part (at least in terms of products). That didn't fix the financial troubles, but it also didn't necessarily cause them. I think modern Nissan might be afraid to be daring because they remember how close they came to oblivion before the all-consuming French Ennui saved them. The problem is that there's no direct link between those 3 parts of the puzzle, and I don't think even Renault and Carlos realize that.

Either way, Nissan is not what it used to be, and likely never will be again. They're certainly not alone. I don't think I'm the only NICO member who would have a very, very, very short list of cars to shop if buying brand new today. Everyone is lost trying to chase too many rabits to do anything right. Competing regulatory issues conflict with each-other and uncertain market direction and clueless buyers (e.g. do people actually LIKE crossovers or do they just buy them because that's all anyone builds anymore because the Feds have made it so much more appealing through legislation? It's an endless circle with too many variables to really control effectively.).

The problem is: a lot of these factors are the automakers' own fault. Toyota, VW, Nissan, and others have built their modern businesses on keeping their buyers as naiively loyal as possible rather than helping them understand what they want and then doing more of that. Toyota makes people want the Corolla (and every other model), rather than building the Corolla people want. Same with Nissan and basically everything they build. It's all so directionless and unguided, there's no wonder it's not leading to anything of value. Instead of building brand-common TRAITS into their cars, they're worried about whether the face looks recognizable. Instead of pushing the envelope they're cowering in the corner for fear of failure.

Look at the automotive market right now and pick out the brands that are going places. They are almost universally NOT the brands resting on their laurels. They are, in most cases, brands who are terrified of stagnation (and maybe trying to distance themselves from past failures or at least mediocrity) who are pushing boundaries and trying new and exciting things.

As a business, it's easy to just stick with what works, and what has always worked. The problem with that is you lose relevance. And what worked in the past depended directly upon the brand's relevance at the time. You can only do the same magic trick so many times before people tire of it and someone else does something new. After that, you're just old hat and people barely remember your name.

Basically, it's the first rule of doing good business: don't get lazy or it'll bite you in the a**.

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themadscientist
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You rang?

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While the BRZ/FRS shook things up a few years ago, Toybaru is squandering the buzz by not pushing the envelope and delivering the same old thing.

Image

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Ace2cool
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Tms, that was my exact thought reading MoD's post.


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