VH45 Rebuild kit?

[Piper]

I have looked everywhere, and searched my anus off, and I cant find anything.

I just found a 93 Q45 at my local junkyard. It has 217 grand on it and the car itself looks fine. That tells me that the motor is blown. So I've been looking for a rebuild kit for the entire engine, and I'm lost. I'm going to be putting this in my 90 240sx and I wanna do it right the first time. So any help would be great guys.

Thanks for your time.

Steve

[maxnix]

Too much money.

Inspect and purchase and rehabilitate a JDM take out per Q45tech's method.

[qship96]

Leave the 93 in the junkyard where it belongs and look for a well running 94 car for sale locally- they can be found all day for roughly 2,000 with a good running engine that wont need rebuilding, or chain guide replacement like the 90-93 motor does.You can then part out the rest of the car and recoup much of your 2,000- almost like getting the engine for FREE!!!!

[Infinitiguy19]

The above or you if your lucky and you fell like taking a chance find a nice late 1993 and see if it has the metal guides, Might be a 50/50 chance or better.

[qship96]

Why take unnecessary risks???? people get fired for that in the real world

[Piper]

Too much money.

Inspect and purchase and rehabilitate a JDM take out per Q45tech's method.

what about a gasket kit and such?

Leave the 93 in the junkyard where it belongs and look for a well running 94 car for sale locally- they can be found all day for roughly 2,000 with a good running engine that wont need rebuilding, or chain guide replacement like the 90-93 motor does.You can then part out the rest of the car and recoup much of your 2,000- almost like getting the engine for FREE!!!!

there are none localy, ive been looking alot. and i want to have this swap done by april or may. and i wanna keep it under 1000 bucks.

The above or you if your lucky and you fell like taking a chance find a nice late 1993 and see if it has the metal guides, Might be a 50/50 chance or better.

if im lucky enough to even find one around here. lol

[Piper]

Why take unnecessary risks???? people get fired for that in the real world

there is a lack of q45s here. ive been looking for about 2 months now and im lucky to run across this one. the guy said he will pull it for me and everything for 200. cant go wrong there. if its toast, im out 200 and i have extra parts.

[qship96]

Even if you get a "good one" for 200....you will need to spend $2,000 minimum to update the chain guides{ only on 90-93 engine} and replace all 35 or so hoses under the plenum along with knock sensors...then you have the issue with the early fuel injectors failing from age and exposure to ethanol in current fuels...possibly another $1000-1500

Your $200 engine {IF it doesnt need rebuilding} will cost you a real $ 2200 to $ 3700{NOT INCLUDING LABOR} by the time it is ready to install and use....NO WAY AROUND IT never confuse price with cost.

[Piper]

Even if you get a "good one" for 200....you will need to spend $2,000 minimum to update the chain guides{ only on 90-93 engine} and replace all 35 or so hoses under the plenum along with knock sensors...then you have the issue with the early fuel injectors failing from age and exposure to ethanol in current fuels...possibly another $1000-1500

Your $200 engine {IF it doesnt need rebuilding} will cost you a real $ 2200 to $ 3700{NOT INCLUDING LABOR} by the time it is ready to install and use....NO WAY AROUND IT never confuse price with cost.

Holy sh!!t batman. maybe i shouldent get into this engine then. thats nuts. thought these engines were a dime a dozen. how do i check to see if it has the metal valve guides? and does not the 94 have the same problems with the injectors and exposure to ethanol also? what is the chance of actually finding a 94 in good running condition anyway?

[Infinitiguy19]

You want this in a 240 SX right?

Do it the right way, Take your time save your money and rebuild the engine COMPLETELY sure it will take some time but in the what will you have...... On bad *** mother ****ing 240 SX right.

If I were you I would strip the engine completely and get all new internals, hoses... EVERYTHING, Clean everything as well.

In the end it will all be worth it.

No risk No reward.

[Piper]

well where do i start??!? i dont even know where to source parts or anything. fsm, specs, all this is new to me. im a ka and 4g63 guy. venturing into v8 land is very foreign to me. but i really want to do this. my friends have everything from kat to rbs and i want to do something different. and kick their *** also. ha. any help would be very very great!! thanks for your time guys.

Ps what is the estimate for a total rebuild?

[Unnatural1]

Like you said. If you get it and it's a bad engine you're out $200 and you have spare engine parts. Not a completely bad deal. This is the kind of question that you may want to ask in the VH45DE forum. Some of the people in here you apparently like to scare you off with LARGE $$$ rather than try to be helpful.

The first question that should be asked is are you doing the work yourself? If so you can save lots of $$$. That said if you need timing chain guides the kit from Infinti to do this can be had for $430 online. These parts can be had aftermarket too. The engine may or may not need injectors, knock sensors or hoses. It depends on condition.

The early phase I injectors are supposedly more subject to failure than the later phase II injectors that started on the 94 Q45. That said I have a 94 Q45 with phase II injectors and all but 2 injectors have been replaced. I'll be replacing them soon as well. There are less expensive alternatives to brand new factory injectors such as DeatschWerks (NICO sponsor and the route I went for mine). The are not new but are thoroughly checked and flow tested and come with a 1 year warranty. All that for about 1/2 the price of new depending on where the new ones are purchased.

The truth is all these engines are old and will probably need some TLC. If you can find a 94-95 model engine I would go for that. But it will probably need some work too. The 90-93 models may need just a bit more with the price of timing chain guide replacement. This will be easy to do labor wise with the engine on a stand. Gaskets are available from Infiniti, parts stores, and online at places like Rockauto.com.

Assuming this engine hasn't suffered a major catastrophe, such as trashed rod or crank, etc., and you are unable to find a new model engine you could be in business with this engine. It will cost you more than $1000 but not an outrageous amount. Or you will have $200 in spare VH45 parts.

Are you planning on a turbo in the future? Or NA? You don't need new pistons and rods if they are in good shape currently. The pistons are the biggest "weak" point in this engine as they are cast. Just like KA24DE if I'm not mistaken. Don't let the fact that the VH is a V8 scare you. An engine is an engine to a certain extent. If you are planing on forced induction or nitrous forged lower compression pistons may not be a bad idea. At least, something to keep in mind for the future.

[Piper]

Unnatural, your awesome!! thats what im looking for! i owe you!! i will get it just to have it. and if i rebuild it, i will be doing all the work myself. i wonder what is the best way to test a engine that is out of a junk car? i could turn it by hand and see if it turns over, but that wont show me much. any ideas on how to see if this engine is even worth it? any signs of how well off a engine might be? besides the oil and coolant, cause they drain the car as they come in.

[maxnix]

Holy sh!!t batman. maybe i shouldent get into this engine then. thats nuts. thought these engines were a dime a dozen

The new long block from the dealer is close to $10K. You have to inspect the timing chain guides, the camshaft chain tensioners, the oil pump drive chain, the thermostat and water pump, the VC gaskets, KS and harness, under plenum hoses, EGR and IAC valves, the TB and the plenum itself. Alsoflow test the injectors. Replace all hoses. About $2K for parts.

A twin cam, all aloy 4 valve heads, coil on plug design with each cylinder is not a cheap design, nor is its assembly haphazardly executed.
Modified by maxnix at 6:15 AM 11/11/2008

[Unnatural1]

The new long block from the dealer is close to $10K. You have to inspect the timing chain guides, the camshaft cahin tensioners, teh oil pump drive chain, the thermostat and water pump, the VC gaskets, KS and harness, under plenum hoses, EGR and IAC valves, the TB and the plenum itself. Alsoflow test the injectors. Replace all hoses. About $2K for parts.

A twin cam, all aloy 4 valve heads, coil on plug design with each cylinder is not a cheap design, nor is its assembly haphazardly executed.

That's all true too. I think the new engine is just over $10k!

Before you do anything with this you need to go through it thoroughly. If you don't replace anything else under the plenum, replace both knock sensors and the harness. You've already mentioned that you will be getting new gaskets and I would add all coolant hoses to that list. Take this opportunity to replace any cracked/damaged vacuum lines. Some of them can be bulk vacuum hose and others may have to be dealer items. I would pull the injectors with the rails and send the whole thing to DeatschWerks and let them test them for you. They will check coils and flow test them for a reasonable price (mention you are from NICO).

To check this engine out of the car, you have to use a leak down test. You need a leak down tester an air compressor for this for this. But, short of tearing the engine down this is about the only option with the engine out of the car. A leak down test can find worn rings, damaged valves, combustion chamber leaks, etc... It can't find a bent rod however like a compression test may. But, removal of the oil pan can allow you to check for that. If the engine rotates freely and passes a leak test, and you've checked for bent rods and bottom end damage, you don't have to go any further. The engine should be mechanically sound and not require new internal components or disassembly.

If you end up buying a boat anchor instead of an engine, tear it apart and save what you can and sell the scrap to a metal salvage yard. When doing an engine build up it never hurts to have extra parts.

[Rex]

Long story short ...

If you're looking for a donor engine, look for 94-95's. Most likely any 90-93 in a junk yard didn't have the guides updated. It's not an absolute, but a safe bet.

How far are you from Dearborn?http://detroit.craigslist.org/ctd/903683632.html

You can part out a lot of the car and get some of your $$ back.

[Q45tech]

The problem is who is experienced enough or has the precision tools to rebuild to factory hand assembled standards, even if they could afford the expensive rebuild parts.

Always less expensive to buy a lightly used JDM takeout engine IF you can examine it before committing to a purchase.

In ATL we have 3 importers where we can go and examine at least 3 different engines, same in Baltimore and California.

These enigine are hand assembled and component matched to tolerances way beyond what racing shops can do economically...........everything is balance within 1.0 grams.

A rebuild is not just replacing rings and bearings as many find too late when disassembled...............piston scuffing requires new coating on cylinder inserts plus new pistons. New HLA and valve stem seals, exhaust valves and seats cost $583 wholesale.

[AlabamaDan]

Not that this isn't an interesting thread, but the forum on VH/VK engines might be more educational for you over there. Not everyone in this forum tears into their VH much past valve cover gaskets, plugs, injectors, etc.

[Kiven422]

You should search for a low priced JDM take out. The deals are out there!

Sounds like your about to do the work yourself anyway. I'd do it myself too... This is one of the easiest engines I've ever worked on.

P.S. I favor the 90-93 engines for their strength.

Besides when you open the engine up.... it just won't ever feel the same after.

[Piper]

You should search for a low priced JDM take out. The deals are out there!

Sounds like your about to do the work yourself anyway. I'd do it myself too... This is one of the easiest engines I've ever worked on.

P.S. I favor the 90-93 engines for their strength.

Besides when you open the engine up.... it just won't ever feel the same after.

i dont know where to even look for a jdm engine. and i would do all the work myself, ive done full rebuilds before, but like i said it was all on 420a, 4g63, and ka motors. and why would it not feel the same?

Not that this isn't an interesting thread, but the forum on VH/VK engines might be more educational for you over there. Not everyone in this forum tears into their VH much past valve cover gaskets, plugs, injectors, etc.

I will do just that, thanks!

Long story short ...

If you're looking for a donor engine, look for 94-95's. Most likely any 90-93 in a junk yard didn't have the guides updated. It's not an absolute, but a safe bet.

How far are you from Dearborn?http://detroit.craigslist.org/ctd/903683632.html

You can part out a lot of the car and get some of your $$ back.

Dearborn is about 10 mins away from me give or take with traffic conditions. Thanks for looking that up for me, I will give him a call today or tomorrow.

That's all true too. I think the new engine is just over $10k!

Before you do anything with this you need to go through it thoroughly. If you don't replace anything else under the plenum, replace both knock sensors and the harness. You've already mentioned that you will be getting new gaskets and I would add all coolant hoses to that list. Take this opportunity to replace any cracked/damaged vacuum lines. Some of them can be bulk vacuum hose and others may have to be dealer items. I would pull the injectors with the rails and send the whole thing to DeatschWerks and let them test them for you. They will check coils and flow test them for a reasonable price (mention you are from NICO).

To check this engine out of the car, you have to use a leak down test. You need a leak down tester an air compressor for this for this. But, short of tearing the engine down this is about the only option with the engine out of the car. A leak down test can find worn rings, damaged valves, combustion chamber leaks, etc... It can't find a bent rod however like a compression test may. But, removal of the oil pan can allow you to check for that. If the engine rotates freely and passes a leak test, and you've checked for bent rods and bottom end damage, you don't have to go any further. The engine should be mechanically sound and not require new internal components or disassembly.

If you end up buying a boat anchor instead of an engine, tear it apart and save what you can and sell the scrap to a metal salvage yard. When doing an engine build up it never hurts to have extra parts.

So if i run a leakdown test and compression test, other than that, this engine has no known major problems? No crankwalk to look for or anything of the sort? I just want to do this right, and as cheap as possible.If it takes more than what im looking to spend, im ok with that, so long as it is right and i dont have to dig into it every weekend to get it running again.

Thank you guys very very much for your information and ideas.They are very very helpful!!

[Unnatural1]

So if i run a leakdown test and compression test, other than that, this engine has no known major problems? No crankwalk to look for or anything of the sort? I just want to do this right, and as cheap as possible.If it takes more than what im looking to spend, im ok with that, so long as it is right and i dont have to dig into it every weekend to get it running again.

Thank you guys very very much for your information and ideas.They are very very helpful!!

A leak down test will be the only test you can do on an engine that you can't crank over with the starter. Of course, you can always tear everything apart and inspect if but that's not easy. With a leak down test, you want each piston at top dead center on the compression stroke (with all valves closed). Then you pressurize each cylinder one by one with compressed air and measure the rate the compressed air leaks out. Most engines will leak some (even new engines) but you are looking for excessive leak down. The leak down test has a gauge that is marked in percentages to measure the size of the leak. If you do find excessive leak down you need to listen to where the air is escaping. Can you hear air escaping into the intake manifold, exhaust, or into the crankcase (remove the oil cap)?

I know of no MAJOR problems other than the timing chain guide issue. Crank walk is a later model 4G63 occurrence. That sort of thing is not typically seen on other engine that I've seen or read about. From what I've read it's typically caused by oil starvation to the main bearings in the later 4G63 blocks.

If you decide to add forced induction or nitrous in the future you should know the VH has cast pistons that will probably become the weak link in the engine. All evidence is that the rest of the bottom end is very strong. One the other hand, KA's have cast pistons too and I've seen some insane power numbers from those engines under boost on the stock engine components. For reliability, new pistons are going to be required, in my opinion. There are a few people running VH under boost on the forums and so far I have not heard of a failure...but someone else may have.

This engine comes from the factory with 6 bolt main caps and a deep skirted block with thick reinforcement webbing cast in. Very ahead of it's time I think. Everything about it screams durability. That shouldn't be an issue once everything else is sort out.

Again, if you can find a good engine from a 94-95 Q45 then I would consider buying that and saving yourself some work. But for the price, this engine may be a good deal. Even if it turns out to be bad you either have extra parts or part the good pieces out and recoup some of the money you spend. It could also be completely thrashed. The moral of the story is check it first with a leak down test and remove the oil pan and visually inspect the bottom engine. You may remove a main and/or rod cap and inspect them too.

Thanks for reading my novel!

~Brendan

[Piper]

A leak down test will be the only test you can do on an engine that you can't crank over with the starter. Of course, you can always tear everything apart and inspect if but that's not easy. With a leak down test, you want each piston at top dead center on the compression stroke (with all valves closed). Then you pressurize each cylinder one by one with compressed air and measure the rate the compressed air leaks out. Most engines will leak some (even new engines) but you are looking for excessive leak down. The leak down test has a gauge that is marked in percentages to measure the size of the leak. If you do find excessive leak down you need to listen to where the air is escaping. Can you hear air escaping into the intake manifold, exhaust, or into the crankcase (remove the oil cap)?

I know of no MAJOR problems other than the timing chain guide issue. Crank walk is a later model 4G63 occurrence. That sort of thing is not typically seen on other engine that I've seen or read about. From what I've read it's typically caused by oil starvation to the main bearings in the later 4G63 blocks.

If you decide to add forced induction or nitrous in the future you should know the VH has cast pistons that will probably become the weak link in the engine. All evidence is that the rest of the bottom end is very strong. One the other hand, KA's have cast pistons too and I've seen some insane power numbers from those engines under boost on the stock engine components. For reliability, new pistons are going to be required, in my opinion. There are a few people running VH under boost on the forums and so far I have not heard of a failure...but someone else may have.

This engine comes from the factory with 6 bolt main caps and a deep skirted block with thick reinforcement webbing cast in. Very ahead of it's time I think. Everything about it screams durability. That shouldn't be an issue once everything else is sort out.

Again, if you can find a good engine from a 94-95 Q45 then I would consider buying that and saving yourself some work. But for the price, this engine may be a good deal. Even if it turns out to be bad you either have extra parts or part the good pieces out and recoup some of the money you spend. It could also be completely thrashed. The moral of the story is check it first with a leak down test and remove the oil pan and visually inspect the bottom engine. You may remove a main and/or rod cap and inspect them too.

Thanks for reading my novel!

~Brendan

Well this Friday I will head to the yard and do a quick once over and remove the timing chain cover to see if anything looks broken or if im lucky and get one with metal!! Anyone have a pic of what the visual difference of the two are? And also what a broken one looks like? Thanks!!

Steve

[maxnix]

They appear the same, except one has a metal backing plate.

There are (or at least were) some pictures associated with the chain guide threads in IOM.

Be sure to hand crank the engine to extablish non-interference. That may not detect and bounced and thus bent valve.

[Haitian_King]

Even if you get a "good one" for 200....you will need to spend $2,000 minimum to update the chain guides{ only on 90-93 engine} and replace all 35 or so hoses under the plenum along with knock sensors...then you have the issue with the early fuel injectors failing from age and exposure to ethanol in current fuels...possibly another $1000-1500

Your $200 engine {IF it doesnt need rebuilding} will cost you a real $ 2200 to $ 3700{NOT INCLUDING LABOR} by the time it is ready to install and use....NO WAY AROUND IT never confuse price with cost.

Isn't the average cost of a JDM takeout roughly $5k? $3700 sounds like a bargain.

[Piper]

Well, because today was such a sh1ty day, i didnt get to go look into the car, and tomorrow is going to be worse. So it looks like next weekend will be the weekend to do it. I hate putting stuff off.