V6/V8 turbo manifold questions

[simmode1]

I'm trying to educate myself/wrap my head around some turbo concepts here and I'm having a hard time finding good research material. I'm wanting to learn more about the pros and cons of different types of turbo exhaust manifolds on V formation engines. Stuff like Equal length vs Unequal length vs Combined header. Single turbo vs twin turbo on a V formation motor. Flow characteristics, exhaust pulses and whatnot.

Anybody got any good links on this?

[RCA]

Bump for great question...

Maybe looking into the engineering section would be a good idea. I am not sure how active it is but I would love to know more about the same things.

[raremotive]

Get this?

http://autospeed.com.au/cms/ti....html

[simmode1]

I might repost this there. Good idea.

Specifically, I'm trying to flesh out the pros and cons on this subject as it relates to swapping a VQ30DET into a 240. It's stock unequal length manifold looks pretty lame and inefficient:

You gotta ditch that manifold anyways for a USDM S13 swap. So since you gotta fab up a new manifold, it would be good to know what works best. Xxtokesxx is doing a combined header setup kinda like this:^^^But imaging what all the piping is gonna look like makes me thing of tentacle rape...

IMO, This kind of setup is the most aestetically pleasing, but what merit does it have over a combined manifold setup :

[simmode1]

Get this?

http://autospeed.com.au/cms/ti....html

Oh wow... thats great! I iz reading...

[Mr1der]

see what the Buick guys are running

[simmode1]

see what the Buick guys are running

Yeah, this swap is a handful enough already without trying to reinvent the wheel on manifold design. Looking at the domestic guys was the first thing i did. The Buick guys seem to prefer the combined header route, but this made so much sense when I saw this:LS2TT

Mainly, I want to know if it is worth it to run twins just so the turbo won't be in front of the motor and then I can run a V-mount setup like this:

The weight distribution would be a thing of beauty. But perhaps the complexities of it would far exceed my uses for the car. So I'm just weighing it all out...

[raremotive]

^ you can do the twins with a v-mount.. not as complex you just need two intercoolers and stack them like as if they were one big intercooler.

Edit: I was thinking for the dual throttle bodies..
Modified by Rare_f8 at 3:15 PM 3/14/2010

[simmode1]

^^^Yeah, only yeah somebody could pull that off is with an dual intake manifold like the VQ35HR has... soooo no go there.

I tried to think of a scenario where SMIC's would be superior to a FMIC for this application and came up empty handed.

I guess the combined header route with the FMIC in the traditional position is the best route for simplicity and to cut down on materials...

A googled a single turbo setup 350Z and hell... not only do you not even see all that snakey piping, such easy access to your turbo really isn't something to discount so quickly I suppose...

Hmmm...
Modified by simmode1 at 6:35 PM 3/14/2010

[raremotive]

I was thinking for the VG30 too...



Rudi has opt for the fmic and he has itb's hiding under that plenum.

This one has itb with a fuel injectors lingering over it hiding in that plenum.
Modified by Rare_f8 at 7:18 PM 3/14/2010

[AZ89two4Tsx]

If you're gonna go to all that trouble for a turbo on a V motor, why not just twin turbo it? It'll be less piping and you get two turbos which means a faster spool if you're going for the same power numbers because of the smaller turbochargers.

Right?

This too has been a question I've had for a while.

[simmode1]

If you're gonna go to all that trouble for a turbo on a V motor, why not just twin turbo it?

I'm sure you're aware the VQ30DET come turbo'd from the factory, but us U.S. guys have to redo the manifold for our swaps.

It'll be less piping and you get two turbos which means a faster spool if you're going for the same power numbers because of the smaller turbochargers.

Right?

This is what I've been thinking as well. Even that great article that Rare_F8 linked earlier in the thread concluded that a TT setup and a combined manifold setup would be roughly equal (in theory). So I think it just comes down to aesthetics and cost of materials. I heavily favor the idea of two T28's with a V mounted intercooler and it seems ultimately it'll will just come down to planning and preference. Between these two options, neither seems superior.

Although, there is a possibility that the VQ30DET's accessories might get in the way of a TT setup...

[MinisterofDOOM]

Wanna see something trippy? Google 6.7 Powerstroke.

It has reverse-flow cylinder heads with the exhaust manifolds (and turbocharger) nested in the valley where the intake manifold would be on a normal V engine. Intake manifolds are on the outside of the V.

[raremotive]

Wanna see something trippy? Google 6.7 Powerstroke.

It has reverse-flow cylinder heads with the exhaust manifolds (and turbocharger) nested in the valley where the intake manifold would be on a normal V engine. Intake manifolds are on the outside of the V.

yeah that is pretty sweet. funny how the old one style head set up is being used. It be sweet if this stacks up just as high as the 7.3 did in desirability.