Transmission

[eaadams]

Can a 2010 EX Transmission be retrofitted into a 2008 EX?

I drove a loaner G37 with the new transmission and am so sold.

[CDNicecube]

Aren't they the same? Both 5-speed? You must be referring to the 2011 7-speed, unless I am missing something?

[eaadams]

Yea that is what I mean

[XIS]

not sure if it would be worth the cost. I have driven the G37 7 speed too and it wasn't too too big of a difference IMO.
I definately liked driving my EX better, regardless of transmission or the slightly bigger engine. I like our seats better too.

[JohnD]

I have an EX35 with the 7 speed transmission and love it, but you should consider that that loaner G37 you drove also has 35 more horsepower and is lighter than an EX35. The G37 loaner I drove was noticeably faster than than my 7 speed EX35.

I agree with XIS, though. I wouldn't swap. They are different cars. The EX35 is more luxury oriented than a G37.

[JohnD]

I have an EX35 with the 7 speed transmission and love it, but you should consider that that loaner G37 you drove also has 35 more horsepower and is lighter than an EX35. The G37 loaner I drove was noticeably faster than than my 7 speed EX35.

I agree with XIS, though. I wouldn't swap. They are different cars. The EX35 is more luxury oriented than a G37.

[eaadams]

No I'm thinking years down the road when I need a new one.

[CDNicecube]

I tried the 2011 EX35 when I bough the 2010 in November 2010. I really drove both back to back, hard and for a rather long time (35-45m each). The salesman was stellar and was ok with my testdrives.

To be honest, I liked the 5-speed more. I am not sure why, it just felt... sportier, crisper....tighter. Nothing scientific here. Also on the highway, at 75mph (120km), both engines were running at about the same rpm, so I did not feel that there was any major gearing change between them. In manual mode, I did prefer the 5 speed for the longer revs. Again, just an opinion. In the end, I took the 2010. There was not enough difference for me.

I did not know the seats were different between the 2011 and 2010. I did not notice that (opps!)

What I would LOVE would be to have a 6 speed MANUAL on this car. WRX anyone???

[Hono]

I tried the 2011 EX35 when I bough the 2010 in November 2010. I really drove both back to back, hard and for a rather long time (35-45m each). The salesman was stellar and was ok with my testdrives.

To be honest, I liked the 5-speed more. I am not sure why, it just felt... sportier, crisper....tighter. Nothing scientific here. Also on the highway, at 75mph (120km), both engines were running at about the same rpm, so I did not feel that there was any major gearing change between them. In manual mode, I did prefer the 5 speed for the longer revs. Again, just an opinion. In the end, I took the 2010. There was not enough difference for me.

I did not know the seats were different between the 2011 and 2010. I did not notice that (opps!)

What I would LOVE would be to have a 6 speed MANUAL on this car. WRX anyone???

I'm with CDNicecube on this one. IMO also the Infiniti 5-speed automatic is a FAR more drivable transmission. Now that I have enough miles on my 2011 EX for a fair assessment I'd also like to add a few more words in this regard...

I swapped a 2003 G35/5-speed automatic and coin of the realm for a new 2011 EX last year. Within 200 miles I was disappointed with the 7-speed but figured it would get better by the time break-in was complete. Now, five months and 2,500+ mile later on, my dissatisfaction with the transmission and it's black-box shift-point mapping has reached the point where I would NOT buy another EX if some soccer-mom yakking on a cell-phone totaled this one.

That's a pretty sad and harsh assessment of the 7-speed transmission because I'm a long-time Infiniti owner, absolutely love the rest of the EX package---it fits our requirements far better than the G---and service at the local emporium has been outstanding...

Am sure the Infiniti engineers and designers thought they'd created a 7-speed marvel---buttery smooth with shift-point mapping emphasis on the best possible fuel economy. Unfortunately, somewhere along the line they neglected to install the part called drivability which was standard equipment in the G's 5-speed automatic and one of the reasons many people like myself buy this class of car and return to the showroom...

My driving environment (the same as the eight years I drove a G35) is 90% congested urban stop and go with most of that driving is in the 25-40mph range. Unlike the 5-speed automatic in my G35, at those speeds the EX's 7-speed appears programmed to get into the highest possible gear it can without stalling out and to do so as quickly as possible...

To me, ramifications of the 7-speed being in the highest gear possible at the lowest RPM are very annoying and even more so at lower speeds. With a manual transmission that style of driving would be called "lugging"---which is a derogatory idiom sometimes mumbled quietly under ones breath when their spouse is driving. Not a good thing since there is simply very little torque to hand whenever one needs a little bit of get go for an emergency lane change or to dodge a confused tourist...

Unlike my G35, the EX gas pedal/transmission response is neither linear nor quick---it is almost like the car is sending an SMS back to the factory asking what to do next and then waiting for a reply before shifting down a couple of gears and getting on with my request. Reminds me of the turbo-lag on a his & hers pair of manual transmission SAABs we owned back in the mid-80's, but worse. Of course one can always mash the EX's gas pedal to the floor thereby bringing about an abrupt increase in forward momentum. But that is neither an intelligent nor insurance-renewal friendly solution for many driving situations...

Have no way of knowing if the 7-speed low-speed hesitation is systemic with the rest of the Infiniti line using the 3.5/3.7 liter engine or just germane to the EX? Perhaps with the 2011 model year EX Infiniti was simply doing final beta-testing of their new 7-speed transmission and since then has reprogrammed the shift points in the 2012's???

On the other hand, drivers sans any experience with a G35/5-speed automatic, a different driving environment, or fewer years experience behind a steering wheel could easily have a far more amenable view of the new 7-speed. Especially those moving up from something like a VW Kombi Van or newly graduated from High School Drivers Ed...

After five months of EX ownership, I'd now recommend to a friend contemplating a EX35, FX35, G37 or M37 equipped with the 7-speed automatic that they first take a very long critical look at lower-speed drivability first to see if it fits their requirements and/or tolerance level. For people I don't like very much I'd recommend foregoing any test drive before buying or leasing...

[CDNicecube]

Thanks Hono; You helped me put the finger on what I did not like with the 7-speed. I was not sure why i preferred the 5-speed until I read your post. It is the lugging that is more pronounced in the 7-speed and that I did not like. Like you, I also drive in rush hours traffic a lot and the 5-speed seems to stay in gear a little longer; this gives me the feeling that power and torque is available for a quick lane change. Flooring it to down shift is not advisable either in these circumstances for the reason you mentioned (danger!).

To be honest, I have found myself "lugging" in the 5-speed as well so it is not immune to it. But putting it in S mode or manually down shifting not only solves the problem, but is somewhat quite satisfying (I am a manual driver at heart and miss it dearly in the EX).

The 7-speed transmission shifts were smoother than the 5-speed, however. I just can't live with the lugging, 60 minutes a day, 5 days per week.

That is strictly my 2 cents opinion. I can see and respect why some drivers may prefer the newer 7-speed.

Hono, have you tried the S-mode to avoid lugging? Do you use the manual function? How is the 7-speed in these modes? Can you share your experience?

[JohnD]

Jut to chime in with a contrary opinion, I traded a 2006 M35x with the 5 speed for a 2011 EX35 with the 7 speed. I test drove a 2010 EX35 with the 5 speed on a number of occasions and always felt it was slower than my M35x. I felt (and still feel) that the EX 35 with the 7 speed is faster.

I like the fact that the 7 speed keeps the revs low when you are not pushing it. It also learns your driving. If you start driving aggressively, it will alter the shift points appropriately, especially when in sport mode.

I don't mind shifting into sport mode if I have been caught in traffic and need some pickup.

I also really like how the 7 speed in sport mode adapts to aggressive driving. A little while back, I was really pushing it on a windy, hilly two lane rural road and the transmission was so good, there was no need to shift manually. You could dive into a corner and hammer the brakes and the transmission would automatically downshift and hold the lower gears so that when you came out of the corner, you were at 4,000 RPM and in the right gear.

[Hono]

Thanks Hono; You helped me put the finger on what I did not like with the 7-speed. I was not sure why i preferred the 5-speed until I read your post. It is the lugging that is more pronounced in the 7-speed and that I did not like. Like you, I also drive in rush hours traffic a lot and the 5-speed seems to stay in gear a little longer; this gives me the feeling that power and torque is available for a quick lane change. Flooring it to down shift is not advisable either in these circumstances for the reason you mentioned (danger!).

To be honest, I have found myself "lugging" in the 5-speed as well so it is not immune to it. But putting it in S mode or manually down shifting not only solves the problem, but is somewhat quite satisfying (I am a manual driver at heart and miss it dearly in the EX).

The 7-speed transmission shifts were smoother than the 5-speed, however. I just can't live with the lugging, 60 minutes a day, 5 days per week.

That is strictly my 2 cents opinion. I can see and respect why some drivers may prefer the newer 7-speed.

Hono, have you tried the S-mode to avoid lugging? Do you use the manual function? How is the 7-speed in these modes? Can you share your experience?

You made a wise choice buying the '10 with the 5-speed CDNicecube. Very astute of you pick up on the difference. Agree also that most buyers would be perfectly content with the EX/7-speed matchup since most have no experience with the 5-speed pairing. BTW, my Sheila doesn't care for the 7-speed either. Though not much of a car person (differentiates cars by colour, not makes and models) she is a far more experienced driver then most so knew something was not quite right. Albeit without the foggiest idea why she felt uneasy...

Haven't tried the "S" button. Remember our salesman mumbled something about the "S" on the button stood for "SNOW" so my eyes glazed over and I didn't hear another word. For all I know he could have been expounding on Einstein's Theory of Relativity from that point on. Will RTMP to see if it remaps shift points for more aggressive driving like the Sports Chrono plus button does on PDK-equipped Porsches. Would sure be happy if that is so...

If that snow association proves correct though questions arise as to actual function/modus operandi since more aggressive driving in snow hardly seem prudent. As importantly, can the S button be left on continually for warmer dry-weather driving at higher speeds/gearing? Bit leery at this juncture since I remember manual chokes (my '70 Ghia had one of those archaic throwbacks) could only be engaged a short period after start up without incurring unwanted consequences. Be a bit awkward trying to get warranty work on a component failure due to using the snow button here in Hawaii...

Alas, cannot proffer words on your request for thoughts regarding the 7-speed's manual mode. After 8+ years driving automatics I've morphed to sloth mode and seldom use manual except for engine braking on long downgrades. As do you, at times I miss the totally-in-command feeling manuals afford. That antiquated sentiment fades very quickly however when plodding along from one stop light to the next...

One more parting thought about the EX's 7-speed. Now lean towards the idea that lower-speed lugging/hesitation is just a problem with the '11> EX models (maybe the heavier FX35 too?) because of the older generation 3.5 ltr engine. Have read that Infiniti uses different more sophisticated external hardware, plumbing and electronics with the G and M's newer 3.7 ltr engine block. Would not be overly surprised in there are internal changes also besides a bigger bore. Stands to reason therefore that with a newer 3.7 mated to a 7-speed automatic Infiniti engineers have used a different algorithm to map shift points. Of course the extra ponies and torque of the 3.7 would play too...

Hope the aforementioned hypothesis is correct and Infiniti puts the bigger engine into the next gen EX ('13 or '14?). Get the uneasy feeling what we are seeing here is simply a harbinger of unpleasantness as ever stricter MPG requirements by the EPA force OEMs to comply by tweaking older components to the detriment of some drivability aspects...

[Hono]

Jut to chime in with a contrary opinion, I traded a 2006 M35x with the 5 speed for a 2011 EX35 with the 7 speed. I test drove a 2010 EX35 with the 5 speed on a number of occasions and always felt it was slower than my M35x. I felt (and still feel) that the EX 35 with the 7 speed is faster.

I like the fact that the 7 speed keeps the revs low when you are not pushing it. It also learns your driving. If you start driving aggressively, it will alter the shift points appropriately, especially when in sport mode.

I don't mind shifting into sport mode if I have been caught in traffic and need some pickup.

I also really like how the 7 speed in sport mode adapts to aggressive driving. A little while back, I was really pushing it on a windy, hilly two lane rural road and the transmission was so good, there was no need to shift manually. You could dive into a corner and hammer the brakes and the transmission would automatically downshift and hold the lower gears so that when you came out of the corner, you were at 4,000 RPM and in the right gear.

Aloha John, am a bit confused if you are weighing in on the discussion-within-a-discussion between CDNicecube & me or simply sharing your experience with the EX's 7-speed automatic in the Transmission thread? In either case most of the denizens hereabouts have the older 5-speed EX model so am glad to share words with a fellow 7-speed EX owner...

If your intent is the former I generally agree with your observations regarding EX 7-speed performance under open-road conditions at higher speeds and the manual option for slower speeds. Moreover, being an all-wheel drive (I think that is what x denotes) your old '06 M35x would likely have been slower straight-line than your new '11 EX. Or even an '08 EX with the 5-speed. My '11 EX is considerably faster straight-line 0-60mph than a '03 G with 5-speed automatic I drove for 8 years (6.2 sec vs. 6.6 sec according to car magazine tests supported by my worn-out old butt). Of course, "fast" in this case is relevant to the venue---straight-line fast being different animal than road road-course fast. In spite of advances Infiniti has made since they built our two earlier relics, on a road course my "fast" money (drivers being equal) would be on the better handling '03 G or '06 M34X both with a much lower center of gravity than the EX...

Doubt they are, but if I'm mistaken and your comments are in fact joining my discussion with CDNicecube, fear you've missed the salient point. Just to reiterate, he and I were talking about full automatic drivability in congested urban traffic at lower-speeds (under 45mph). It has nothing in common whatsoever with the road conditions, speeds or venues described in your post nor have he and I dwelled on other virtues of the EX 7-speed...

We both felt the 7-speed in the '11 EX does not handle adverse low-speed events as well as the older 5-speed automatic in the '08-'10 EX. In that regard I'm of the opinion, based on 40-some years of driving experience, that at lower-speeds my '11 EX 7-speed simply shifts into too high a gear too quickly and tends to linger there far too long in many cases. And I don't like it doing so since throttle response is not good when one needs to respond to potential emergencies at lower speeds in heavy traffic. He and I both frequently drive in congested heavy traffic---the main reason we were exchanging opinions...

Suspect most people driving the EX 7-speed in our road conditions on a daily basis do not use the manual mode---too big a PITA. Quite a few people, myself included, also share driving with another so the transmission adapt-mode does not come into play. BTW, that adaptation technology has been around a long time. Had it on both a '83 Volvo and '85.5 Porsche bought new in a era long ago and far away. Don't remember it on any earlier cars however...

Getting late, perhaps more words after footie playoffs tomorrow if friends neglect to bring beer...

[CDNicecube]

Hi all.

"S" mode: I meant the drive sport mode, not the "snow mode". The snow mode robs power from the engine but makes the AWD more responsive (?). I have been using the Snow Mode for a while now, mostly during snow (!) storm or when ice/slippery. It works wonder on this car. For those in the sunshine belt, I would add that I use it during torrential rains. You might want to try the snow mode when it rains. (I always wondered why people who lives in clement weather need AWD, but this is another topic; i'd go full RWD if I live in Hawaii, but what do I know).

"S" - sport or Drive Sport mode - is obtained by moving the shift lever left and then you can change gears manually (up or down).

I did not try the 7-speed in manual mode much. For those who have a 7-speed, how is the manual mode? I am particularly interested in knowing if you are constantly changing gears because, well, there are more of them to row through. How is the driving in manual mode in the 7-speed peppy?

[JohnD]

I agree, I don't drive my EX in heavy traffic much.

I was referring to the sport mode achieved by moving the shift lever to the left.

This works differently that in the 5 speed. In the 5 speed, moving the lever to the left did nothing but enable manual shifting.

With the 7 speed, moving the the lever to the left changes the shift points and also causes the gearbox to shift down under braking.

You might try using the sport mode without manual shifting in traffic to see if that improves response.

Also, the learn feature, particularly in sport mode seems to adapt very quickly. Just hard braking once seems to be enough to reconfigure it for more aggressive driving.

[JohnD]

Here is Nissan's official explanation:

Originally Posted by Nissan North America
Explaining the benefits of Infiniti’s new transmission

The target: create an automatic transmission with all the best features of a manual transmission. Here’s how Infiniti engineering gives drivers the best of both worlds.


The automatic transmission traditionally represented a compromise. It gave drivers the convenience of smooth, clutchless shifting, but it sacrificed the direct connection, driver control, and enhanced fuel economy of a stick shift.

Infiniti’s new 7-speed automatic transmission, available on 2009 FX35, FX45, G37 Sedan, G37 Coupe, and the upcoming 2009 M35 (rear-wheel-drive), takes the automatic closer than ever before to the feel and operation of a manual transmission.

No More “Slush-Box”

Slippage between the engine and transmission earned early automatics the nickname “slush-boxes.” The hydraulic clutch system for making gear changes could not operate as quickly or directly as a manual transmission’s mechanical clutch.

All modern automatics have a lockup torque converter, which limits slippage by creating a solid mechanical connection between the engine and transmission. For smoother operation over a wider range of operating conditions, newer designs vary the amount of converter lockup (from a 100% solid connection to a partial lockup condition).

Infiniti’s 5- and 7-speed transmissions use a multiple disc torque converter lockup design that allows the unit to “ease” into lockup, minimizing the shudder that can occur in single-disc designs.

While Infiniti is not the first manufacturer to vary the level of torque converter lockup, it has created an extremely wide available lock-up range with the new 7-speed transmission:

With the transmission in Drive, partial lockup is available in 2nd through 7th gears while full lockup occurs in 7th.
With the transmission in manual shift mode, both partial and full lockup are available in 2nd through 7th gears.
Some amount of lockup occurs at all throttle positions and at speeds greater than about 15 mph. The result? Infiniti's 7-speed transmission provides a more direct, solid-feeling connection than drivers typically expect from an automatic transmission.

In manual shift mode, a flick of the 7-speed’s shift lever makes the half-second gear change a reality.

Driver Control

For driving enthusiasts, one of the lures of a manual transmission is the control it gives them to select and maintain the gear they want. Several features of Infiniti’s new automatic transmission directly address this concern.

One of the foremost is manual shift mode. Consider this: for anyone other than a seasoned race driver, it generally takes more than half a second to make a smooth shift with a manual transmission — depress clutch, move shift lever, release clutch, apply throttle.

But in manual shift mode, a flick of the 7-speed’s shift lever (or available steering-column-mounted paddle shifters) makes that half-second gear change a reality.

For smoother downshifting, Downshift Rev Matching (DRM) mimics the heel-and-toe maneuver used by skilled drivers during manual transmission downshifts.

The 7-speed design targets both performance and fuel efficiency.


The 7-speed includes other features first seen on Infiniti 5-speeds, including:

Adaptive Shift Control, which enhances gear selection by using a lateral acceleration sensor to detect changes in the road (such as hills and turns).
Drive Sport Mode (DSM), which allows the driver to select a more aggressive shift pattern (automatic up- and downshifting at higher rpm).
Combined, these features allow any driver to enjoy quick, smooth shifts and gear choices that are appropriate to both the road and their desired driving style — some of the enthusiast’s main reasons for choosing a manual.

Enhancing Economy

Automatic transmission vehicles typically suffer a small penalty in fuel economy estimates when compared to their manual transmission counterparts. Infiniti’s 7-speed design targets not only performance, but also enhanced fuel economy:

The wide range of torque converter lockup operation maximizes engine efficiency (less power is wasted as slippage).
In previous 5-speeds, only 5th gear provided an overdrive ratio. Now both 6th and 7th gears are overdrive ratios, allowing the engine to operate at lower rpm during a broader range of highway speeds.
Owners may not understand the penalties they have paid in the past for the convenience of an automatic transmission. But whether drivers want “hands on” or “hands off” control, Infiniti’s new transmission will provide a satisfying driving experience.

[CDNicecube]

....

This works differently that in the 5 speed. In the 5 speed, moving the lever to the left did nothing but enable manual shifting.

With the 7 speed, moving the the lever to the left changes the shift points and also causes the gearbox to shift down under braking.

My 5-speed EX, moving the gear shift to the left engages DS (sport). I know that from the big DS letters that appears on the display

You might be referring to another 5-speed, from other models perhaps JohnD?

[R1chard]

I agree, I don't drive my EX in heavy traffic much.

I was referring to the sport mode achieved by moving the shift lever to the left.

This works differently that in the 5 speed. In the 5 speed, moving the lever to the left did nothing but enable manual shifting.

With the 7 speed, moving the the lever to the left changes the shift points and also causes the gearbox to shift down under braking.

You might try using the sport mode without manual shifting in traffic to see if that improves response.

Also, the learn feature, particularly in sport mode seems to adapt very quickly. Just hard braking once seems to be enough to reconfigure it for more aggressive driving.

On my 2008 5 speed EX placing it into Sport mode changes the shift points ( reaches higher revs, more aggressive / responsive) so it's not exclusive to the 7 speed transmission.

[JohnD]

I am sure you are right. My 2006 M35x did not seem to do that, so I suspect that was an upgrade on newer models of the 5 speed.

[Hono]

I agree, I don't drive my EX in heavy traffic much.

I was referring to the sport mode achieved by moving the shift lever to the left.

This works differently that in the 5 speed. In the 5 speed, moving the lever to the left did nothing but enable manual shifting.

With the 7 speed, moving the the lever to the left changes the shift points and also causes the gearbox to shift down under braking.

You might try using the sport mode without manual shifting in traffic to see if that improves response.

Also, the learn feature, particularly in sport mode seems to adapt very quickly. Just hard braking once seems to be enough to reconfigure it for more aggressive driving.

John,
Don't know if I should laugh, cry or do both simultaneously. In either event am awarding you 5 Gold Stars for your info regarding the "DS" automatic mode on the 7-speed...

Hadn't been near the EX for a couple of days, but today I did something totally un-American---I read the Owner's Manual. Apparently I missed, or more likely misunderstood, the whole thing about the "DS" mode invoked by moving the shift lever to the left when in the drive ("D") mode...

Had just assume moving the stick to the left worked the same as it did on the 5-speed (at least in a '03 G35) where it only engages the clutch-less manual mode. Not so, "Wallaby" in the DS mode is no longer a gutless wonder so am one happy camper again. Not sure it will do anything good for my license point total however. Probably wouldn't increase gas mileage either, but MPG was not amongst the top 100 reasons I bought an EX...

To confirm the "DS" effectiveness took it on a spirited lunch-time run over to other end of the island and back---works as promised so I take back all those bad things I said about the 7-speed... Thanks, Hono

[JohnD]

Glad you are happy. I must say, I was just astounded at how well the DS mode worked on a windy, hilly, deserted country road where I was able to really push the car. It was so good, it made no sense to try to shift manually. Better to have both hands on the wheel.

[CDNicecube]

Hono, I would cry

Yep, the owner manual, the least read book in the world.

Enjoy your new found joy, Hono!

Cheers

Ice

[JohnD]

RTFM! as we used to say on the computer support forums.