Tramlining and sort of heavy steering issue?

[tprY51]

I've had my 2013 M37s RWD for half a year now and this problem (Maybe normal?) is bugging me so much especially after the first long distance drive with this car last weekend. Since the day I bought it, the car had pretty heavy weight steering (normal I assume because it was the same as a Q70s I drove but I don't remember if it tramlined) and I noticed it tramlines alot which didnt really bother me much. I put a new set of 20s on it (9s and 10.5s) With a 255 and 285 staggered Kumho PS91 and it was less angry on bad roads. After putting 5,000 miles on the car since I bought it and driving back to LA from Arizona I realized I can never drive this car without 2 hands on the wheel and there might be an issue... So I am wondering if everyone else's car drives like how I generally explained or had any issue that caused this. Some other Y51 owners on IG told me it's probably just me and I would get use to it...but I've even thought about trading it in for a GS350 or A7 because of it. Please let me know. Thanks

[parkstr8r]

Hi - I have had the tram lining you are speaking of when in LA. Part of it is the grooves and expansion joints in the roads there. The wider tires don't help it. I swapped tires in the past - explaining it to the tire shops so I avoided tires that would exacerbate it. The tires made a ton of difference. I still get a bit of weird steering feel with my 255's and spacers - so I can see the 285 sending a lot more feedback up front. To me, the front never feels as planted as I would like for some reason. Its an Infiniti thing as I had a version of it in all my other Infinitis - QX70S, EX35, and Q60S. The best feeling front was the QX70S.

I'm doing coilovers which will tone down the sports suspension feedback while adding control.

[Ilya]

This is normal. It gets better/worse with tires, etc. My 07 did it, my 11 does it. It's the nature of the engineering of this beast.

[Frog]

I Disagree put some great Michelin tires on it and mine Will drive straight for 2 miles. The only tramline I’ve ever had was with the original factory tires and that was pretty bad but since then for 100,000 it’s been great with high end tires.

[Ilya]

I Disagree put some great Michelin tires on it and mine Will drive straight for 2 miles. The only tramline I’ve ever had was with the original factory tires and that was pretty bad but since then for 100,000 it’s been great with high end tires.

My car would drive straight for 2 miles too if I was on a smooth road. Unless we're talking about two different things, to me tramlining is how 'good' or 'bad' a car is affected by slight creases or cracks in the road. Some tires are softer (so they might tramline less) while some are harder (which might tramline more). I don't think it has to do with the car pulling random directions on a smooth as glass road.

[Larz]

All of my Inifniti's have had tramline issues. It's just a matter of degree. Seems the two biggest causes are tire design, and road surface.
My 07 and 09 M35's had issues that were nearly 100% abated by switching to Michelin tires. My 09 will still do it as I come to a stop at traffic signals if the roadway has ruts in it from heavy trucks. It's rare, but it will happen. Otherwise, regardless of speed or weather, no tramline whatsoever.
The new Q60 we just bought months ago had Crapstone, OOPS I mean, Bridgestone tires and driving the same roads was night and day regarding tramline. Out of concern for the lovely misses, I chucked the crapo tires and had Michelin's installed. She has had NO issues aside from the rare traffic signal problem.
Like the requirement for 93 octane, these cars require high grade, well made tires. I use only "ultra high performance all season" tires.

[tprY51]

Hi - I have had the tram lining you are speaking of when in LA. Part of it is the grooves and expansion joints in the roads there. The wider tires don't help it. I swapped tires in the past - explaining it to the tire shops so I avoided tires that would exacerbate it. The tires made a ton of difference. I still get a bit of weird steering feel with my 255's and spacers - so I can see the 285 sending a lot more feedback up front. To me, the front never feels as planted as I would like for some reason. Its an Infiniti thing as I had a version of it in all my other Infinitis - QX70S, EX35, and Q60S. The best feeling front was the QX70S.

I'm doing coilovers which will tone down the sports suspension feedback while adding control.

I have a 2nd gen FX35 as well and the steering is numb and never have tramlining even with 285s all around and super stretched tires with over 4 degrees of camber. And LA roads specifically are s*** and make my daily drives stressful.

[tprY51]

Thanks for all the replies. I put a very nice set of Kumho PS91 on my M and I ran a set on my GTR on my stock wheels which got rid of the horrible tramlining. I'm thinking the rear wheel steer makes the tramlining worse.

Also when the power steering is off and I turn the wheel back and forth it makes a little clunk somewhere along the steering rack (which seems normal and completely goes away when the engine is on) but maybe someone can check if theirs does that too? I appreciate that I will try to post a video of what I mean.

[paranoidjack]

Was running staggered GTR wheels with Pirelli Pzero's...loud, noisy, no traction, and tons of tramline.

Just installed 4 new Michelin PS4's - all gone, car is perfect.

[tprY51]

UPDATE: Drove a brand new Q70 still has tramlining ( not as aggresive) but steering feels way lighter than mine. I think it has to do with sport package / HICAS... So I guess its normal...

[John2]

My 2007 M35x did it. Worst was sections of roads, particularly approaching and thru intersections, where the heavy trucks had caused 'ruts' in the asphalt. Changing from stock tires fixed it. No sign of it at all on my current 2013 M37x.

[tprY51]

Tested my boy's 12' M37s. And immediately lighter steering, no clunk that I have when the car is off. I knew my car wasn't normal haha. Now time to find the issue. A little play in the outer tie rods and clunk I think coming from the inner tie rod (didn't get chance to open the boot). But I've never seen tie rods cause heavy steering... Any suggestions?

[EdBwoy]

Is either your or your boy's M lowered or on a modified suspension?

On a different note, your tramlining might be related to the clunking (I'll try to remember to deliberately test my M56 for this) or some looseness that's making your steering wheel constantly chase and try to catch up to what the wheels are doing.
When you said you were having to keep both hands on the steering wheel, was this a comment on vibration or plainly the effort needed to steer the car?

[tprY51]

Is either your or your boy's M lowered or on a modified suspension?

On a different note, your tramlining might be related to the clunking (I'll try to remember to deliberately test my M56 for this) or some looseness that's making your steering wheel constantly chase and try to catch up to what the wheels are doing.
When you said you were having to keep both hands on the steering wheel, was this a comment on vibration or plainly the effort needed to steer the car?

His M is bagged.

That's what I also believe is causing the tramlining. 2 hands on the wheel so that it doesn't rip out of my hand on horrible freeways. Steering is definitely heavier (which probably has to do with everything else) but not to the point where its unbearable. Both of the problems combined makes it harder to control... So 2 hands on the wheel NOT just because the weight but the combination of tramlining and "heavier" steering if that makes sense haha

[EdBwoy]

I believe I understand what you're describing.
Hands on the steering wheel, because the car will otherwise steer all over the road.
2 hands because it takes a lot of steering wheel effort to guide the vehicle in your desired direction.
... Pretty much what you said earlier. Haha

Seems like a steering rack/solenoid issue but I need to think about it more.

[tprY51]

Well.. M is at the dealer because I had a little CPO warranty left. Drove with a mechanic and it was definitely not normal. Hopefully they can fix the issue.

[GMBQ70]

My car would drive straight for 2 miles too if I was on a smooth road. Unless we're talking about two different things, to me tramlining is how 'good' or 'bad' a car is affected by slight creases or cracks in the road. Some tires are softer (so they might tramline less) while some are harder (which might tramline more). I don't think it has to do with the car pulling random directions on a smooth as glass road.

No doubt decent Tires make a difference here. Purchased my 2015 Q70 with 16K miles and the factory Bridgestones were shot.
I live in Louisiana and the roads here leave a lot to be desired (I’m being kind). Some dips in the roads would practically jerk the steering wheel out of my hands, and grooved pavement caused the dreaded tram lining issue.
I did plenty of research prior to my purchase, and knew I needed new tires based on the reviews on the factory Bridgestones
Got a new set of tires shortly after and I’m about 6K miles in and so far so good.... much better handling and no more steering wheel jerk.

[tprY51]

Dealer fixed my car! It was the rack and pinion like you mentioned EdBwoy, and was covered under warranty. Feels so good now, steering is light and zero tramlining. Now I'm really liking this car lol

[GMBQ70]

Dealer fixed my car! It was the rack and pinion like you mentioned EdBwoy, and was covered under warranty. Feels so good now, steering is light and zero tramlining. Now I'm really liking this car lol

Good news! Even better that it was covered under warranty.

[ssmrico]

Yeah I think I have a bit of this and I think the rack is leaking ill be checking it later today

[jackartman]

I Disagree put some great Michelin tires on it and mine Will drive straight for 2 miles. The only tramline I’ve ever had was with the original factory tires and that was pretty bad but since then for 100,000 it’s been great with high end tires.

Glad you posted this! My Q70L with Bridgestones is awful. You are not the first person to mention this so I'm changing tires with the Spring "4 for the price of 3" offer.

[mike17mjh]

Dealer fixed my car! It was the rack and pinion like you mentioned EdBwoy, and was covered under warranty. Feels so good now, steering is light and zero tramlining. Now I'm really liking this car lol

Did they replace the entire rack and pinion? What exactly was the dealer solution? I'd like to fix mine as well, but I'm not in warranty, so I'm wondering what all needs to be done.

[Q70sGuy]

Hello, I realize this is two years old but have not found a similar thread anywhere else. I have the same issue OP had, and would be curious to know what exactly was wrong with the steering rack. I’m leaning towards the solenoid, which is unfortunately dealer only and costs upwards 1500$. Even remanufactured doesn’t seem to replace them , they just reuse them.

So OP or anyone else who has this issue - heavy steering at standstill and extreme levels of tramlining - how did you fix it and what was the problem?

Thanks

[conaigh]

Hello, I realize this is two years old but have not found a similar thread anywhere else. I have the same issue OP had, and would be curious to know what exactly was wrong with the steering rack. I’m leaning towards the solenoid, which is unfortunately dealer only and costs upwards 1500$. Even remanufactured doesn’t seem to replace them , they just reuse them.

So OP or anyone else who has this issue - heavy steering at standstill and extreme levels of tramlining - how did you fix it and what was the problem?

Thanks

Do you hear any noise coming from the steering column? Would be more apparent when stationary and full cutting left/right. Almost like a metallic crinkling / tink noise

The heavy steering could be related in your case as a bad clockspring could cause that but I was experiencing tramlining suddenly after having my Q70 for about a year / driving 30,000 miles. I do a lot of driving and it was so bad that I wouldn't drive in certain lanes / spots on the highway that was close to the jersey wall /barrier for fear of getting sent to the shadow realm. Started happening roughly around the same time/maybe shortly before I noticed the steering column noise. Had clockspring replaced due to the noise and weirdly tramlining went away as well and haven't experienced it since, even after another 30k or so miles

[Q70sGuy]

I will look into that however the clock spring is just a coiled up bunch of wires inside the steering column, it’s so bizarre that it could affect anything. Are you sure they didn’t replace more?

Did you also have a very heavy steering only when parked?

and when I lift the car I am able to move the wheels from side to side with extreme ease even with the engine off. So I don’t believe there’s a “mechanical” reason, hence leaning for the steering rack solenoid being bad. I will need to test it though but wondering if this is common

[VStar650CL]

I will look into that however the clock spring is just a coiled up bunch of wires inside the steering column, it’s so bizarre that it could affect anything.

That isn't exactly true. There's also a Steering Angle Sensor attached to the clockspring, and of course the SAS can have a major affect on anything in an electrically-modulated steering system. I'm not sure about the M's, but on a lot of Nissan models, the SAS comes as part of the clockspring assembly. On some, like the newest Altimas, it actually governs the lion's share of chassis control. So effects on VDC, tramlining, and steering effort may not be farfetched at all.

[conaigh]

I will look into that however the clock spring is just a coiled up bunch of wires inside the steering column, it’s so bizarre that it could affect anything. Are you sure they didn’t replace more?

Did you also have a very heavy steering only when parked?

and when I lift the car I am able to move the wheels from side to side with extreme ease even with the engine off. So I don’t believe there’s a “mechanical” reason, hence leaning for the steering rack solenoid being bad. I will need to test it though but wondering if this is common

Yeah, that was the only thing touched on the car besides an oil change. I work at the dealer and had checked in while they were doing the job since I was curious to see what the clockspring looked like. Thinking back, I guess steering did feel a bit heavier when parked as well.

The tech wasn't certain how they were related but what VStar mentioned was our line of thinking. SAS / Clockspring causing some affect on chassis control. Maybe speed sensitive steering, giving steering feel/force expected at lower speeds, causing tramlining? Either way, all I know is that I have not experienced it since clockspring was replaced.

[Q70sGuy]

Interesting, maybe the clock spring contains the wire for the steering angle sensor which feed info into the steering module. and if the cable was faulty it crated an issue. That’s the only way I can see it relate and definitely a possibility…

My hypothesis is same as yours, that the power steering pressure is stuck at a level that is too weak for a stopped car and too high for the highway, for whatever reason, it’s allowing the road to pull on the wheels when driving fast enough or hitting big enough potholes.

Thanks for the info.. will have to do a lot of testing.

Anyone with more info please share ! I wonder if this isn’t a bigger problem that most people don’t even notice

[Q70sGuy]

I will look into that however the clock spring is just a coiled up bunch of wires inside the steering column, it’s so bizarre that it could affect anything.

That isn't exactly true. There's also a Steering Angle Sensor attached to the clockspring, and of course the SAS can have a major affect on anything in an electrically-modulated steering system. I'm not sure about the M's, but on a lot of Nissan models, the SAS comes as part of the clockspring assembly. On some, like the newest Altimas, it actually governs the lion's share of chassis control. So effects on VDC, tramlining, and steering effort may not be farfetched at all.

I actually didn’t see your response and somehow came to that conclusion in my earlier post however I have looked over the service manual ( steering control chapter) and the steering rack solenoid, which controls the power assist, relies only on two signals:vehicle speed, and falls back on engine speed if vehicle speed isn’t available. So far I am going step by step in the service manual, to see if I can find any fault in that system as described. Thanks!

[Teggy68]

I’m from the UK and have a QX70 S and have same issue with my car, although I have improved it a lot by swapping out the bushes on the steering rack as there was loads of play and the rack was moving side to side quite badly. The issue I had was spares in the UK for this car are quite hard to get hold of, especially suspension parts and specialist parts, so when I found out about bushes I managed to speak to a Infiniti dealer and there was a 13 week wait and they don’t just supply the bushes, it’s a whole steering rack. I don’t know about you, but I’m not changing a whole steering rack just for the sake of a couple of bushes.

So I managed to get the rack off the car and the burnt old bushes out and cleaned the rack as good as I could. Once cleaned up I measured it up and searched bushes on interweb. I found some poly bushes from a VW t4 should match size wise and ordered up, and low and behold they fit great. I put rack back on, now it's improved it loads but it still chases ruts in road, but my tires need replacing so I’m hoping that is going to cure it altogether. Fingers crossed.