Tire Options for Stock 18s and Tire/Wheel options - Pilot Sports are horrible!

[mikeatx]

I have the stock 7 Spoke 18" wheels on my Coupe and want to get some decent tires. I have the stock Michilen Pilot Sports and they are the worst tires I've ever driven on in any car. They do not handle the 130 degree asfault here in central texas. You simply can't give it gas in a corner. Have to drive like grandma.

Anyways. As they say, wider is better. So I was reasearching tire sizes and thinking if I replace the wheels while I'm at it. I could go with these:

Front: 245/40-18Rear: 275/40-18

These are only 1% front and .1% rear off from stock. My question is what size wheels and offset do I need to run this setup?

I have a feeling the tire/wheel setup will end up costing quite a bit more than I'm willing to spend. Are there any other size options for the stock 18" wheels that will improve the contact patch area?

Or... Are the Michlens worst than I think and any Ultra Summer Performance tire should be fine at stock sizes?

I'll buy Yoko's, Falkens, Nittos or the BFGoodrich most likely. Depending on size/pricing... May consider the Kumhos also. I've owned most of these on other rides and always been happy.

[GamingMom]

My car came with a different stock tire and I upgraded to the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S (all-season) and absolutely love them. I'm in Arizona so it gets hot as Hades here like it does in Texas...I have no problem cornering (I may be a mom but I don't drive like one hehe). If Michelin just leaves a bad taste in your mouth I'm sure others here will chime in with some different recommendations.

[mikeatx]

I can corner better in my '03 Maxima than I can in my Infiniti with the stock tires on each.

My Acura RSX had Yokohama ES100s all around and I could push it extremely hard in the corners without even a peep from the tires.

I expect my Coupe could corner even better with the right tires, but with these tires, it feels like I'll spin out if I turn off the VDC. My rear end slides at least a foot out of the corner even at at least what I consider very slow cornering speeds and thats with the VDC saving me from a spin. I see SUVs pulling threw corners faster than I dare.

Maybe its the asfault and concrete roads we have here that are different. Its been in the mid 100's for the most part this month. I'm sure the Asfault is in the 160s and the concrete is at least 130.

[AZhitman]

Hmmmm.

I liked my Pilot Sports, and it's hotter here than anywhere in the US.

I have a set of Goodyear F1-GS that you'd probably love. I'm taking them off soon for something less-aggressive...

[AZhitman]

EDIT: Never mind, I have 19's.

I'm a big fan of the KDW's.

[IlsG35]

Pilot sport A/S are really good i jut replace my old set with a set of pilot sport ps2's the ps2's give u a much better ride comfort but the A/S's are more performance based like for turning n track use. i work for merchants tire or tire kingdom as u would call it in other states. so i know a lil something about the tires. if all ur going for is performance then get some BFG kDW there only like $146 compared to the $250 for the Ps2's and $320 for the A/S's.

[szh]

The stock G35 tire was not Michelin Pilot Sport, as far as I know (but may be wrong). It was either the Goodyear RS-A or the Michelin MXM4 ...

The Pilot Sport is an outstanding world-class tire, so I am surprised by your experience, if you indeed have it. What is the date code on the tire? Look for the month and year next to the DOT mark. If more than four or five years old, that may be the problem.

My personal favorite is the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. Noisier than the Michelin but better in wet. Probable comparable in dry.

Z

[C-Kwik]

The pilot sports were the OEM tire for the stock 18" wheels on the coupe. I found them to be a great tire. Test results in magazines concur, the car handles great with these tires. Mine handled quite well with them. I have to speculate here that maybe your expectation are that the car will feel significantly faster, thus pushing the car more than you should. You may be overdriving the car.

[C-Kwik]

Pilot sport A/S are really good i jut replace my old set with a set of pilot sport ps2's the ps2's give u a much better ride comfort but the A/S's are more performance based like for turning n track use. i work for merchants tire or tire kingdom as u would call it in other states. so i know a lil something about the tires. if all ur going for is performance then get some BFG kDW there only like $146 compared to the $250 for the Ps2's and $320 for the A/S's.

The A/S stands for All Season. They are not a better track performing tire. Just take a look at a picture of the thread and you'll see a lot of siping. Performance tires tend to use larger tread blocks. You're going to get more tread squirm with a A/S tire. This generates more heat. You'll find a max performance tire will provide much better stability in the short term and long term on a race track over an all-season tire. The All season wil probably have an advantage in any inclement or very cold(but dry) weather, but definitely not in the dry when temperatures are reasonably warm.

As far as the PS2, you're probably not going to find many tires that can outperform them short of a race tire. Most Porsches (if not all) wear them. Even the 205 mph Carerra GT. These are a much more serious tire then you seem to realize. There is a reason they cost more than $300 a piece.

[szh]

The pilot sports were the OEM tire for the stock 18" wheels on the coupe.

Ah! Thanks for the correction.

Z

[szh]

As far as the PS2, you're probably not going to find many tires that can outperform them short of a race tire.

Agreed! The PS2 is an awesome tire, for which, as you also noted, you do end up paying a premium price. Most people will never need such tires, or find their limits, in normal day to day driving - I know that it would be unusual for me to drive that way all the time and need these tires. Also, when I went looking some time back, they were not available in the size I wanted: 245/45-18, although I think this has recently changed.

Hence, my use of the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 instead of the PS2. For 245/45-18 100W, I just got a set of four for about $833 (including shipping) from Tire Rack.

Z

[mikeatx]

These are just the Pilot Sports. They arn't all season or the PS2s.

I cannot take a wide/flat 90 degree corner in 2nd at 15 mph and give it 25% throttle as I exit the corner.

The slip light will blink, rear end will slide out several inches and the VDC will brake the front end. They do have some miles on them, so they are probably at 7/32ths tread left, maybe a bit more.

I can get in my Maxima with Continental all season tires on 16s and take that very same corner at full throttle accellerating from 20 MPH and it rolls threw the corner without squeeling or slipping. I do get some noise from the tires and a ton of body roll, but it doesn't slip out of its line.

Maybe somethings wrong with these tires.

I went out and looked for a date code, but couldn't find anything that looked like a month and year to me.

My guess is these are the factory tires with 37k miles on them. Up close I notice the rears have alot of cracking threw the center of the sidewalls. I'm just gonna have to replace them soon. Those side walls arn't going to hold up to my love for corners.
Modified by mikeatx at 1:25 PM 8/17/2006

[C-Kwik]

My guess is these are the factory tires with 37k miles on them. Up close I notice the rears have alot of cracking threw the center of the sidewalls. I'm just gonna have to replace them soon. Those side walls arn't going to hold up to my love for corners.

I'd be surprised if they are the original tires. 37K miles is a lot out of pilot sports. Unless the previous owner took them off to put different wheels on and put these back on when he sold the car. The condition does seem to indicate that the tires may have been abused though. If they are abused and/or old, they are not going to grip well at all. Tires actually have a relatively low shelf life. Most tires with high mileage ratings will become dried out and hard before they ever see their mileage rating. Despite the age of the Pilot Sport design, they are still a pretty good tire. I'm sure a new set would perform much better. At their time, they were considered a top of the line tire.

[mikeatx]

Well I know the car belonged to a lady in her 50's. There were alot of receipts in the glove box. Nearly all were oil changes at the dealer and a few warranty repairs for interior problems. Nothing for tires, altho that doesn't mean that havn't been replaced.

It could be she ran the tires underpressured frequently. The cracks in the side wall are right in the center, almost like the sidewall has been folded along that line.

The Pilot sports are some of the more expensive tires. I'll probably goto a less expensive summer performance tire. Like the Kumos or Yohohamas. I've had great experiance with both on other rides. I'll replace the rears next month. The front's don't have any cracking or other damage.

I'd really like to go with wider rear tires, but I havn't found anything that will properly fit the factory 18s properly. 275/40s are just too wide for an 8.5" wheel.

[33infinity33]

The factory 18s are 8.0" wide. I have 285/40 BFG G-Force KDW 2's on the rear of my coupe with no problems. The tires "look" right on the wheel despite what you might think. I'll get a pic up later.

[33infinity33]

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[33infinity33]

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[33infinity33]

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[Q45tech]

other size options for the stock 18" wheels that will improve the contact patch area?

Say what ..........the contact patch AREA is solely a function of weight on the tire and inflation...........tire width has nothing to do with contact patch AREA........a wider tire is just that wider and the length [of patch] just reduces to compensate. With 1000 lbs on tire and 35 psi the patch AREA is 1000/35= 28.571428 square inches.

[joe603]

it would seem to me that a wider tire using the same psi/weight would spread the contact area over a larger spot. Isn't that why the G35/350Z use a stag setup?

[szh]

it would seem to me that a wider tire using the same psi/weight would spread the contact area over a larger spot.

Common misconception. Making it wider makes it narrower front-to-back. Area stays the same.

SIde comment: Note that total friction is indeed somewhat related to area (in the real-world, although physics books will say otherwise).

Z

[szh]

The factory 18s are 8.0" wide. I have 285/40 BFG G-Force KDW 2's on the rear of my coupe with no problems. The tires "look" right on the wheel despite what you might think. I'll get a pic up later.

Looks are not the issue. You should not exceed the tire width that is maximal for a given wheel width. It is both a safety issue (tire bead does not sit as well on the wheel and could break under hard cornering conditions) and, surprisingly enough, a performance issue!

Because, putting a wide tire on too narrow a wheel actually changes the tire section profile and lifts the edge of the tire tread. This has the counter-intuitive net effect of actually reducing the actual tire width that contacts the ground - maybe even less than the width for a proper tire for the wheel! Result is poorer handling, increased wear, etc. Compensating for this lift on the edges by reducing the tire pressure is a bad idea - you get increased wear in the center, reduced load index, etc.

The right thing to do is fit the correct tire for the wheel you have. Period!

Z

[kahakauai]

My car came with a different stock tire and I upgraded to the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S (all-season) and absolutely love them.

I've got the same setup on my coupe - and the Michilin pilot sport A/S kick a$$. Handle really well in all conditions - Only downside is that they are kinda pricey...