Thoughts on hybrid technology

[Npop]

I apologize in advance if this gets a little long winded. Just wanting to share what I've learned about hybrids through my ownership of one.

No, I'm not the least worried that we are causing climate change. We have been coming out of an ice age for thousands of years now.

Yes, I believe we should clean up our act though.(I really dislike smelling people's cars where they cut out the cats because they think it improves performance so much).

Yes, I love (safely) driving my vehicles to their limits and mine. (Performance or hypermileing sp?)

Probably my biggest concern with my cars is reliability. I enjoy that peace of mind. Love ya Nissan, Infiniti! Lot of great reliable cars out there but I'll be with N/I for a while.

Ok, so I'm writing this to maybe clarify/educate on hybrids these days. I AM NO EXPERT, I own a hybrid Altima and have only driven one other hybrid M35h with 99k. ( but I would love to change opinions on hybrids. Mainly so big car companies keep making them so I can drive them!)

These are my opinions and open for debate. Debate is good! Makes things change, hopefully for the betterment of us all.

3 ACTUAL negatives about hybrids compared to non hybrids.
SMALL TRUNKS. Kinda a big deal when your a new pop like myself.
HIGHER NEW PRICE. Fortunately I get to buy them used from people that prefer new.
HEAVIER. This isn't too bad since it doesn't put on that much. N/I more than make up for that with their aerodynamics nowadays. .26 for the M35h/q70h!


SO MANY positives. These are my favorites .(specifically on M35h/Q70h since these are performance oriented hybrids)
RELIABILITY. The two cars I own are extremely reliable and my hybrid takes first place. It is soo much easier on Brakes, accessories (e.g. AC compressor, water pump, power steering pump, basically everything that would normally be engine driven), and the engine itself.
PERFORMANCE. Torque from 0-?mph. Nice. Sorry, tires.
GAS MILEAGE. 27/34 mpg. This is kinda of a big deal in many ways. I'm not that much worried about any off them but it's nice not to frequent gas pumps often. You get to keep extra cash in your account too. Used to pay 150$ average a week when I visited the pumps in my deisel dually when prices were up.
I didn't much care then but I'll never go back now.


Tell me what YOUR opinions, so I can squash them!


Hybrid >turbo!

[Ilya]

It's probably more of a future than we think...and I updated your thread title to be a little more concise.

[ArmedAviator]

I like hybrids that add performance and help save some gas, for my own benefit. I don't believe hybrids help the environment. It takes non-renewable precious metals to make the batteries used in hybrids.

<rant>
I am a believer that we have gone well past the breaking point for fossil fuel usage. Very few new oil wells are being found and the use of oil is up dramatically, especially now that China is really ramping up their use of oil. Eventually this planet will run out. This doesn't mean high gas prices, or no more gas/diesel vehicles. It means no more plastics, no more synthetic materials, no more solar panel materials, no more synthetic greases for wind and water power, no more many things that we depend on. Also remember that this means vastly reduced agriculture leaving millions to starve, vastly more difficult means of transporting goods, such as food and medicines (which also will undeniably be reduced in quantity and increased in price).
</rant>

tl;dr

Hybrids are cool for their performance abilities. They are absolutely stupid when being used for "saving the Earth." I'd rather have a non-hybrid, battery-only vehicle like a Tesla and keep it charged using solar and wind power.....somehow.

[BlackCat81]

Seriously. Lithium-Ion mining is EXTREMELY damaging to the environment.

[Npop]

Seriously. Lithium-Ion mining is EXTREMELY damaging to the environment.

https://cleantechnica.com/2016/05/12/li ... -response/

Very enlightening article Blackcat.

[Npop]

Teslas are awesome and I love how Mr Musk wants people to compete with his car. I will own one someday when there are more supercharger stations.
The thing with them are, people give those batteries hell, from not understanding you just can't cycle those batteries (any batteries) like they do. You lose a LOT of life from it by totally/nearly depleting it. I don't blame them either, if I had one I'd want to drive more and charge less. Hybrids have the upper hand here. They use cycle times that maximize lifespan.(will never fully deplete unless you just let it sit for long periods) Also, they don't completely charge it to full capacity either. 2 reasons- lifespan and they leave room for more charge for regen braking while engine is off. (Like coming down mountain roads) which has happened to me before. I always wondered why the needle never showed 100% full.

Thanks again Ilya! You are always on top of things.

[Npop]

I like hybrids that add performance and help save some gas, for my own benefit. I don't believe hybrids help the environment. It takes non-renewable precious metals to make the batteries used in hybrids.

<rant>
I am a believer that we have gone well past the breaking point for fossil fuel usage. Very few new oil wells are being found and the use of oil is up dramatically, especially now that China is really ramping up their use of oil. Eventually this planet will run out. This doesn't mean high gas prices, or no more gas/diesel vehicles. It means no more plastics, no more synthetic materials, no more solar panel materials, no more synthetic greases for wind and water power, no more many things that we depend on. Also remember that this means vastly reduced agriculture leaving millions to starve, vastly more difficult means of transporting goods, such as food and medicines (which also will undeniably be reduced in quantity and increased in price).
</rant>

tl;dr

Hybrids are cool for their performance abilities. They are absolutely stupid when being used for "saving the Earth." I'd rather have a non-hybrid, battery-only vehicle like a Tesla and keep it charged using solar and wind power.....somehow.

You must be a Gen X'r with a conscience like myself.
Truth is our heads have been pumped with a lot of worrying thoughts, but believe me, things are good. We can make things better for sure though.

[Npop]

The batteries are also recyclable.

[Npop]

Another thought on hybrids.

Why do people calculate payback on them?
Isn't even having that option saying something?
Every vehicle I've had before, I only calculated how much I was gonna lose. :p

[Larz]

First, regarding the environment and climate change. The planet has been and will continue to experience climate change till the end of its existence. There is NO way to stop it - a matter of matter . However, the actions of the inhabitants on the planet DO contribute to the rate at which climate changes and decreasing the use of fossil fuels is one of many ways to reduce that rate. That is not an opinion. Science is fact and facts do not require belief to be true. Anyone who says they don't 'believe' science amuses me.

Regarding hybrid vehicles. They burn less fuel and deserve credit for that. A car maker who touts their hybrid as 'saving the planet' is simply lying. It's a huge over statement at best. A consumer who wants to use less fuel for their car can be happy that they have personally reduced fuel usage, but they haven't really done anything to help the planet. Although the have reduced that vehicle's use of fossil fuels, they have also increased the damage from mining for the batteries. To me, one washes out the other with regard to saving the planet.

Regarding total electric cars. The biggest gain in my opinion is the lack of all the components found on gasoline powered cars. No more spark plugs, oil changes, fan belts, radiators filled with coolant, etc. Mechanical repairs are reduced to a fraction of those required on gasoline and hybrid vehicles. I haven't seen the comparison between damage done by gasoline cars Vs electric but I reckon it shows gasoline cars are worse for the planet. But even the Tesla requires electricity to re-charge and that uses fossil fuels as well. Still, it's the only electric car I would consider owning. In fact, if the interior of the Tesla was not so gopping ugly, I'd fancy owning one right now. The gigantic sideways mounted double laptop screen is just hideous and totally unnecessary. The interior is hopelessly bland and the opposite of luxurious in every way.

I am not interested n any hybrid vehicles but I think Infiniti has made the best use of hybrid tech. It is a performance hybrid and that makes it more appealing to sport sedan drivers.

In the future, I'd like to see a Tesla with a gizmo that charges via ONLY solar on such a high level so it can go from drained to fully charged in a couple of hours. It also needs a more luxurious interior with proper inside door panels, deep wool carpeting, supportive seating, and of course a panoramic roof.

[BlackCat81]

Seriously. Lithium-Ion mining is EXTREMELY damaging to the environment.

https://cleantechnica.com/2016/05/12/li ... -response/

Very enlightening article Blackcat.

And a counter to yours good sir.....
http://www.kitco.com/ind/Albrecht/2014- ... e=fullsite

[Npop]

I agree, science, once proven is fact. Science proved the earth has gone through many heating and cooling periods. Many thaws between the ice ages, we just happen to be in a heating cycle. It is my opinion that pollution sucks, that's why Effeciency in all that we do should be strived for.

They just made a huge stride in solar panels. They've created some that are 34.5 effecient now. That means you could in fact on a perfect day charge the tesla in two hours. It would take a quarter acre of panels to do but that be a nice shade to sit under in all this heat.

[Npop]

Good article as well. I agree with most all of that one as well.
Not this line though.
Consumers buy these vehicles despite lower gas prices out of a growing conscience and concern for the environment.

This is exactly why I started this post. I'm a consumer and I only started buying hybrids because of increased performance/efficiency.

[BlackCat81]

Good article as well. I agree with most all of that one as well.
Not this line though.
Consumers buy these vehicles despite lower gas prices out of a growing conscience and concern for the environment.

This is exactly why I started this post. I'm a consumer and I only started buying hybrids because of increased performance/efficiency.

And I'm sure there are others who do as well. But I think it's safe to say that's the exception to the rule. Most people who look at hybrids are doing it with good intentions, thinking they're saving the environment one Prius at a time.

Also, increased efficiency is technically better for The environment no?

[Npop]

Yes but better is just plain better.
In the case of this hybrid, better for all comers.

[Npop]

Performance-better
Reliability-better
ROI-better
Environment-better

I've got to blinded by love. If the above were true, it'd be like "Highlander", "There can be only one." Well one type of car and if they battled.

[mazz]

very interesting reading after reviewing the two attachments in Black Cats reply with contrary opinions i think i am dumber than before i woke up this AM. I did enjoy learning others opinion on these topics and now understand Hybrid is more than just gas mileage.
Mazz

[Npop]

A car maker who touts their hybrid as 'saving the planet' is simply lying.


I could be wrong but I've never heard a car maker say this.

[ArmedAviator]

A car maker who touts their hybrid as 'saving the planet' is simply lying.


I could be wrong but I've never heard a car maker say this.

All of them do, just a little more subtly. What do you think "green" implies? Of course that goes far beyond cars.

[Npop]

Thank you Mazz, my job here is done.
I don't enjoy posting stuff that goes against popular opinion, but I thought that this was a deserving topic, because I felt Infiniti may stop producing these fine hybrids because people's opinions drive the market.
I want more of these cars.

Really wish they offered them with the performance look that they deserve. I saw one for sale in Florida where the (guy?) put the sport wheels and aero bumper on. Sweet!

Can't believe no one has called me out on why I say they are more reliable. I'd kinda like to have that discussion, especially with a mechanical engineer to figure out if my conclusions or wrong. Maybe I am just basing it off flawed understanding and my personal experience with one that has proved so reliable?

[Npop]

Dang, yeah I guess your right in a sense about the Green label.

I'm not 100% sure, but I'm guessing that automotive writers labeled them as such, and it has just stuck to more efficient cars, even the non hybrid types.

[goat35]

At the current time period I believe turbo will be the push for the next 5-10 years.

Hybrids are cool but displacement laws worldwide are pushing big engines out. Turbo can solve this issue was easier than hybrids and physical issues are always cheaper to fix the circuit/electrical.

I drive a hybrid but now that turbos have found there way all over the suv and trucking industry I think it will take a huge jump.

[ArmedAviator]

Dang, yeah I guess your right in a sense completely about the Green label..

[dmclone]

I would only buy a hybrid if it did two things. Save me money and/or increase performance at a reasonable price. I think both can be done in the near future and when that happens I'll buy one. Worrying about the environment is in about 56th place on my list of things that are important and are likely to have a dramatic affect on my life.

[Npop]

Dmclone, good news! Not only do they have hybrids that do both of those, but they do both simultaneously.

[dmclone]

Dmclone, good news! Not only do they have hybrids that do both of those, but they do both simultaneously.

Cool, Examples?

[Npop]

Actually all hybrids these days do just that.
I'm a big fan of the M35h/Q70h. Check out the stats and drive one for yourself.
Even the Prius. It's shooting totally at economy though, by using a tiny engine and great aerodynamics. It just depends on what you're looking for in a car.
Just know when you see a hybrid, know it's higher performance than same engine without hybrid. Much like adding a turbo, except much more reliable, and efficient

Prius is quicker than you think. My first experience with one pissed me off. Ha. I was driving my f150 fx4 supercrew 5.4 2003 when a Prius full of people were in the turning lane in front of me and I had already made in my mind that I was gonna blast past them when made the turn. Nope. I couldn't gain any ground on them. Yes I know my ford isn't that fast, but my mistake was underestimating that ugly little car.

[milto0n]

My next car will be an Infiniti hybrid mostly because I want a good looking car that's pretty quick and is decent on gas (overall 60 mile commute a day.) As much as I'd rather own a v8 q70, I'd settle with the hybrid version if it's almost as quick and it costs slightly less when new.

Regarding hybrid technology, you have to understand that hybrids are a stepping stone in the overall move to renewable technologies. It is impossible (at least for now) for a car to be "green" because of the energy required to move the vehicle and of course the resources to build it. However, if the production and use of hybrid and electric vehicles is less damaging to the environment overall, than those types of vehicle are definitely the more environmentally friendly option. Basically if Option A and Option B are both damaging, but Option B is not as damaging, then Option B is the better choice. Additionally, as hybrid and electric vehicles become more popular, the push for those technological advances will result in more efficient, safer, and less expensive means of production much like how over the past few years the cost of installing solar panels in a home has dropped significantly as it has become so much more popular.

I can go on for days about the environment and conservation but I'll spare the lecture. I think it is important to understand that we are currently in the middle of the transition toward greener technologies and the change is gradual.

[Npop]

I wish I had been more clear when I started this thread. There have been some good discussions on here but my main concern was changing the way people think when they hear hybrid. Everyone automatically thinks- "GREEN", Economical, slow, ha or something along those lines. They are all of those things except slow. (If apples to apples).
Oh saw where the 35h did a 0-60 in 5.1. And 13.2 1/4
And the q50hybrid does 0-60 in 4.9

This is with 3.5's! And stellar mpgs!

Can you imagine if they made the already fast m56 into a hybrid. If they used the same setup as th 35 that put the 56 at 480hp/@500tq.
I bet it'd also get around 27mpg.

[Ilya]

I'd buy a Q70h 5.6. OH MY LANTA that thing would rock. I honestly think this M56 has ruined me...I don't know if I will ever be able to drive a car sub-400hp.