Thinking of buying a hoopty for a daily driver. Any feedback is helpfull

[Q45CALIBER]

I just painted my Q and I would like to preserve the paint and actually get it up to my standards before I beat the streets again. I am saving up for some nice 18's track wheels. I decided that I will be sticking to my black with machined lip theme.

So....

I am thinking of buying a 1991 Honda Civic sedan. It needs engine.

Engine-$250.00Install-$250.00

I think it will be good on gas, and I the parts are so cheap!

I put the seat back and its actually has some room in it.

What do you guys think. Any feed back would be good.

[96Qowner]

Check out my sig. I put all those miles on the Accord myself - original engine, transmission, AC compressor, etc.

Hondas are great beaters. Don' know about Civics, but I LOVE my Accord - just can't break 'em.

Think about dropping an H22 into that Civic, instead, heheh. 200 HP - another grand, tops - THAT'd be fun stuff.

[Rex]

Good idea, just be wary that a car that needs an engine has generally been neglected elsewhere and may continue to need (allbeit small) ongoing repairs .

I'd suggest finding a running car, to allow for a better evaluation of the car. I was looking in my area, and was surprised at the number of $1000 running beaters out there. Try craigslist and autotrader as well as your local newspaper.

I will say that a Honda can be a reliable beater.

[Q45CALIBER]

That is a hell of alot of miles. You really go a return for you money on that thing. Thats what I am talking about. Something to beat on when I run around in the streets.

[96Qowner]

I like mine enough to be dumping a grand into it this week for suspension, and another 800 coming soon for its FIFTH timing belt.

Oh, and cost of maintaining it has been about 5 cents a mile with NO DIY work.


Modified by 96Qowner at 3:10 PM 3/15/2006

[Q45CALIBER]

Good idea, just be wary that a car that needs an engine has generally been neglected elsewhere and may continue to need (allbeit small) ongoing repairs .

I'd suggest finding a running car, to allow for a better evaluation of the car. I was looking in my area, and was surprised at the number of $1000 running beaters out there. Try craigslist and autotrader as well as your local newspaper.

I will say that a Honda can be a reliable beater.

Rex-

I think you are right. The car belongs to a friend of mine and I have even driven it. It runs but we think one of the o rings may be going because it is burning oil like crazy and everyone is having a problem finding where.

There is no mixture of anti-freeze and oil but is not driving like to used to.Also the gas mileage is declined alot. I am alittle unsure if I want to take on the engine swap. But worse case is doent seem so bad with cheap part prices.

[CrimsonQ]

I bought a 2,000 dollar accord for my daily beater. Souless car, good gas, runs like a rolex and does its intended job (which is to put the 2 miles to work and back)

[jamesmost]

my

I just painted my Q and I would like to preserve the paint and actually get it up to my standards before I beat the streets again. I am saving up for some nice 18's track wheels. I decided that I will be sticking to my black with machined lip theme.

So....

I am thinking of buying a 1991 Honda Civic sedan. It needs engine.

Engine-$250.00Install-$250.00

I think it will be good on gas, and I the parts are so cheap!

I put the seat back and its actually has some room in it.

What do you guys think. Any feed back would be good.

friend is selling his 1998 i30 w/70 k always maintained needs a new quarter panel ($250 painted to code on e-bay) and a little door work otherwise mint. leathed cd etc.... think 3,500 takes it,

[lino]

I agree with everyone also. A Honda is a great beater. My choice would be a 1990-1992 Accord. Biggest problems with these cars is rust and neglect. If the car looks like it has been rasonably maintained and has only small rust, you really can't go wrong. Stay away from American cars and consider a Toyota Corolla or Camry also. Old ladies always have cars like these and sell them cheap, with low miles...keep your eyes open for one of those kinds of deals.

Good Luck!

[HashiriyaS14]

I'd opt for a first-generation Acura Legend. The wierd-looking "ugly" (although I like them) one.

They run FOREVER.

Another option is any Toyota with a 3TC engine, as they are totally indestructible, although that'd be a much older car.

[MinisterofDOOM]

If I was going to buy an older Honda, it'd absolutely be a Vigor. It's got a great 5 cylinder engine (the G25A1) which is surprisingly torquey for a Honda engine from that era. And it's my favorite Honda bodystyle ever (looks VERY similar to the Legend Hashi mentioned).

[Jesda]

I'd opt for a first-generation Acura Legend. The wierd-looking "ugly" (although I like them) one.

They run FOREVER.

I totally agree. Much more dependable than the prettier one that followed (the one that ate trannies and head gaskets and personal incomes). The leather might be beat to hell, but the electrics and mechanicals are ROCK SOLID, and its a hoot to drive.

I'd get a 5-speed 2G Maxima or a 5-speed 3G Maxima.

[gloucester Q]

hey. i've got a 91 civic si (hatchback) and i highly recommend it/them. the thing gets much better hwy mileage than advertised and generally averages at least 30 mpg combined. it's a bummer, but i can go further on 11 gallons in the civic than 20 in the q. ouch. i am under the impression that those civics also have interference engines as does the q, so timing belt is something to be aware of. typical rust spots seem to be around the fenders and over and towards the front of the rear fender. my big worry with the car is having it stolen, i think just about any civic owner should be paranoid about that. oh yeah, and the car is a blast to drive. as opposite from the q as you could get, but the go kart feel is totally fun. good luck.

[Q45CALIBER]

If I was going to buy an older Honda, it'd absolutely be a Vigor. It's got a great 5 cylinder engine (the G25A1) which is surprisingly torquey for a Honda engine from that era. And it's my favorite Honda bodystyle ever (looks VERY similar to the Legend Hashi mentioned).

I have always liked these.

my friend is selling his 1998 i30 w/70 k always maintained needs a new quarter panel ($250 painted to code on e-bay) and a little door work otherwise mint. leathed cd etc.... think 3,500 takes it,

Are you buggin! Thats 3,000 I could put in to my Q. No sir I can't take food out the mouth of my baby.

[HashiriyaS14]

If I was going to buy an older Honda, it'd absolutely be a Vigor. It's got a great 5 cylinder engine (the G25A1) which is surprisingly torquey for a Honda engine from that era. And it's my favorite Honda bodystyle ever (looks VERY similar to the Legend Hashi mentioned).

Actually, that's the 2nd generation legend, I was referring to the fugly (or at least most people think so) first gen, i.e. this thing:



Just swap in seats from a later Acura if you get one with a beat-up interior. Unless you abuse the hell out of it (and possibly even then), it will run longer than you'll probably want to keep it without too many problems.

And, for some reason, they're just obnoxiously cheap. I've seriously seen like 150k examples selling for like $700, and at that mileage, they're just waking up.

Besides, they don't have to be ugly, they can look like this:

I'd take a dark blue or grey coupe with some 3-piece wheels much like what are on MoD's Vigor in the picture.

[96Qowner]

If I was going to buy an older Honda, it'd absolutely be a Vigor. It's got a great 5 cylinder engine (the G25A1) which is surprisingly torquey for a Honda engine from that era. And it's my favorite Honda bodystyle ever (looks VERY similar to the Legend Hashi mentioned).

GREAT idea! Costs about the same as a 4th generation Accord, and adds leather and horsepower. Just kinda hard to find. Good 4th gen Accords can be had for $1500, 93-94 Vigors for about $2000.

http://motors.search-completed...srtZl

http://motors.search-completed...prchi=

Modified by 96Qowner at 11:35 AM 3/16/2006
Modified by 96Qowner at 11:36 AM 3/16/2006

[qship96]

how about an early g20?

[Jesda]

LOL, I havent heard "buggin" in a decade.

[qsiguy]

I bought a '91 Civic a while back for $400 ended up having to put an engine in it. Sold it later as I didn't need it any longer and still made a profit. Great little car. Got 32 MPG

Current beater is a '93 Toyota P/U I picked up for $700 complete with utility rack, use it for work. Q only gets to come out to play about once or twice a week now. Keeps me from putting 75 miles a day on her. She also desperately needs some TLC, tires (wheels would be nice) couple of power window regulators, transmission mount, due for oil change, etc, etc.

[DrewQ45]

If I was going to buy an older Honda, it'd absolutely be a Vigor. It's got a great 5 cylinder engine (the G25A1) which is surprisingly torquey for a Honda engine from that era. And it's my favorite Honda bodystyle ever (looks VERY similar to the Legend Hashi mentioned).

Unfortunately, the vigor is one of the most undependable cars 'Acura' ever made. Notice the model didn't last very long. The thing was rife with electrical gremlins...sorta like the older Jaguars. They are not common cars nowadays and one has to take into account a few things. Unreliable, parts hard to find and when you do, they are EXPENSIVE. Better choices out there IMHO.

....Drew....

[jimmys G50]

i used to have a 96 accord lx before the Q. i added about 15K to the 140K the car had when i got it. it was stolen, then recovered, then given to my cousin (who i know doesn't give the car a break). i'm amazed the car is still truckin' considering what it has been through.i have personally been looking for a 90-93 accord for my hoop ride. its not easy finding a black 2-door for under $2,000.another suggestion but it may be a little more money for a hooptee, toyota avalon. my sister's 95 avalon has 218K on it and the only things it EVER needs is brakes and fluid changes.

[DrewQ45]

used to have an 87 Toyota Camry.... damn thing was so dependable I used to wish for it to die just so I could have an excuse to get a new car. Used to go six months without changing the oil and it didn't care..... kept on ticking like a timex. I eventually gave it away because I was just tired of it... that was years ago....funny thing is... It blew by me on the highway the other day... I recognized the rust stains and damage to left quarter panel. Must be approaching 300k by now. Gotta respect Toyota for that type of absolute depenability. Still my favorite car maker.... Sorry Nissan.

[BlackBirdVQ]

Unfortunately, the vigor is one of the most undependable cars 'Acura' ever made. Notice the model didn't last very long. The thing was rife with electrical gremlins...sorta like the older Jaguars. They are not common cars nowadays and one has to take into account a few things. Unreliable, parts hard to find and when you do, they are EXPENSIVE. Better choices out there IMHO.

....Drew....

Actually you are QUITE wrong, I WORK for Acura as a TECH and lemme tell ya NOTHING but NOTHING will stop the G25 5 banger. That motor will last a nuclear blast and run without any glitch. I never seen a injector go bad on one, never seen a blown head gasket ! There are few common problem areas- cracked exhaust manifold on the 3rd exhaust cylinder runner, oil leaking from the distributor Oring and Oil leaking from the oil cooler "crazy 8 double Oring". 5spd Vigors where actually pretty fast for their time and could challenge some of the entry level luxury cars still- hello BMW 325 and MB C260. It had good handling, interior was built with strong materials.

ABS units tend to fail on ALL Hondas from the 90s, so stay away from the cars with ABS or if the light comes on when engine is fired up- be prepared for a 2K dollar parts bill.

Body/Suspension wise, CV boots are bout done by now after 12+ years and need to be repleaced, front hydraulic actuated motor mounts tend to break if the car is driven aggressivly. Front brake rotors like EVERY Accord till 98 requires removal of the wheel bearings.

G25 motor has THE eassiest Timing belt setup in the world, I could litterally do one in bout 30 min ! People who always ***** n moan bout Vigors are usually the type of people who have no experience working with Vigors. Personally I would sell my 91 Legend for a 93 Vigor 5spd if I had a chance to get one.

91-95 Legend is dependable, only problems to watch for are- ABS lights, HARD SHIFT- due to the broken trans mount, noisy diff- due to lack of fluid changes, aftermarket radiators, blown head gaskets, stumble on acceleration due to clogged EGR port in the intake manifold. I work on these things day in and day out, and to me no one makes a more reliable car ( NOWA DAYS ) and eassy to fix than Honda DID with the Vigor and Legend.

[Q_SHIP]

All I have heard is bad things about the Vigor as well. And Im in the car bizz.

[DrewQ45]

Actually you are QUITE wrong, I WORK for Acura as a TECH and lemme tell ya NOTHING but NOTHING will stop the G25 5 banger. That motor will last a nuclear blast and run without any glitch. I never seen a injector go bad on one, never seen a blown head gasket ! There are few common problem areas- cracked exhaust manifold on the 3rd exhaust cylinder runner, oil leaking from the distributor Oring and Oil leaking from the oil cooler "crazy 8 double Oring". 5spd Vigors where actually pretty fast for their time and could challenge some of the entry level luxury cars still- hello BMW 325 and MB C260. It had good handling, interior was built with strong materials.

ABS units tend to fail on ALL Hondas from the 90s, so stay away from the cars with ABS or if the light comes on when engine is fired up- be prepared for a 2K dollar parts bill.

Body/Suspension wise, CV boots are bout done by now after 12+ years and need to be repleaced, front hydraulic actuated motor mounts tend to break if the car is driven aggressivly. Front brake rotors like EVERY Accord till 98 requires removal of the wheel bearings.

G25 motor has THE eassiest Timing belt setup in the world, I could litterally do one in bout 30 min ! People who always ***** n moan bout Vigors are usually the type of people who have no experience working with Vigors. Personally I would sell my 91 Legend for a 93 Vigor 5spd if I had a chance to get one.

91-95 Legend is dependable, only problems to watch for are- ABS lights, HARD SHIFT- due to the broken trans mount, noisy diff- due to lack of fluid changes, aftermarket radiators, blown head gaskets, stumble on acceleration due to clogged EGR port in the intake manifold. I work on these things day in and day out, and to me no one makes a more reliable car ( NOWA DAYS ) and eassy to fix than Honda DID with the Vigor and Legend.

Not questioning Honda reliablity...and I am pretty fond of the Legend.

The Vigor is the only Honda product I would not recommend for a beater.

Stop being a tech and think from a consumer stand-point for a sec. A short production run (92-95 till replaced by the TL) along with low sale numbers means a short supply of used parts which are very expensive if you can find them. Without question it's the most unreliable Honda model made in the 90's...if I'm wrong, tell me which is?

There are virtually no aftermarket parts, it consumes strictly premium fuel, and oil changes are almost as difficult as the Q due to oil filter location.

You forgot the common leak springing from the oil filter ring which requires removal of the head to fix. The distributor is a b*tch to get to because it's jammed up against the firewall. Electrical systems is also not a strong point for this vehicle. Seems they pop up with a lot of grounding issues causing misc glitches.

You are right about the engine though... aside from the leaks, it's pretty reliable and quick. Handles well and is nice looking too.

IMO a beater should be good on gas, cheap to fix and maintin with loads of parts around... The Vigor just doesn't fit that definition.

[Jesda]

used to have an 87 Toyota Camry....

Bam! Perfect. Smooth, sedate, and dependable.

[BlackBirdVQ]

Not questioning Honda reliablity...and I am pretty fond of the Legend.

The Vigor is the only Honda product I would not recommend for a beater.

Stop being a tech and think from a consumer stand-point for a sec. A short production run (92-95 till replaced by the TL) along with low sale numbers means a short supply of used parts which are very expensive if you can find them. Without question it's the most unreliable Honda model made in the 90's...if I'm wrong, tell me which is?

There are virtually no aftermarket parts, it consumes strictly premium fuel, and oil changes are almost as difficult as the Q due to oil filter location.

You forgot the common leak springing from the oil filter ring which requires removal of the head to fix. The distributor is a b*tch to get to because it's jammed up against the firewall. Electrical systems is also not a strong point for this vehicle. Seems they pop up with a lot of grounding issues causing misc glitches.

You are right about the engine though... aside from the leaks, it's pretty reliable and quick. Handles well and is nice looking too.

IMO a beater should be good on gas, cheap to fix and maintin with loads of parts around... The Vigor just doesn't fit that definition.

I love when people tell me the "head or intake manifold" has to come off for the "oil cooler Crazy 8 oring" that is bolted to the block. Sure thing 99% of the people I know pull the intake off to do this repair, takes them 6 hours to get the job done and get paid 6 hours to do it. Personally I have a trick to doing them in bout 35 min and I still get paid 6 hours to do it (I also managed to do head gaskets and almost a complete engine rebuild from the head gaksets up on my Q45 in the car yet the manual says its not possible). Vigor lacked sales due to it being expenssive and only offering a 5 cylinder engine - which does not sound as nice to say as V6. I have never seen any electrical problems per say, other than ones due to shops hacking up the car trying to diagnose problems that they have no fkn clue how to deal with. I get Vigors and Legends in all the time now for alarm problems- not a single one has a factory alarm in it, and they all have some cheap **** that BestBuy hacked in.

Sure Vigor is not going to be cheap on gasoline, but you discounted the car as being a unreliable expenssive to maintain Acura from the 90s. And like I said before, I would love to see a new TL, Camry, Accord, Galant and Maxima go up against 93 Vigor and Legend- both brand new cars but never been titled. Now this test would be far fetched from reality but I bet that the Vigor and Legend would run 15 years from now and all the other ones would be in the wrecker by then. Stating facts bout Vigors without any real proof other than hearing from mechanics is pure BS. If you asked a Acura tech thats been with the company for lets say 10 years if the Vigor is a dependable car, and to name some problems I doubt he could come up with more than 5 problems which are nothing bad. I like old cars, I am able to fix anything I set my mind on, and there isn't a new car out there that makes me wanna go and sign a paper on. All of my cars are old and have over 100K miles on them, I could afford anything up to 100K if I wanted to, but I worked on lots of diff brands in the past and reather stay with 90s Japanesse cars (my 01 Max is a exception its a Pre- Carlos Ghosn built in Japan vehicle).

[teamgoon]

>My choice would be a 1990-1992 Accord. Biggest problems with these cars >is rust and neglect.

Actually, the correct year range is 90-93.I had a well maintained '93 Accord with 310,000 milles on it.I never noticed any rust at all. I sold it to one of my Son's friends for $2500 (It had a top notch stereo system in it). He uses it to deliver pizzas and called to tell me it just turned over 400,000 miles.It must be the Syntec. :-) I'd stay away from Corollas. My cousin has one and as far as fit & finish, it's about as bad as an American car.The Newer Civics don't pass muster either.ANY car that is built so cheaply it has that tarpaper crap insted of real carpet goes immediately on my POS list.I had an '89 Civic LX & it was a CLASSY car. The new ones just don't compare.

My Q45 IS my daily driver. If I was afraid to drive a car daily, I wouldn't own it.My second vehicle for hauling & chores is a '86 Dodge Caravan 2.2 turbo 5 speed. EXCEPTIONALLY reliable. My Son drives an IDENTICAL '85 Voyager. They both will white smoke the tires.

[Jesda]

My 93 Accord has plenty of rust at 110k and the paint was embarassingly thing. I had a wheel arch that was completely eaten away, yet the car was still worth $4600 at the time.

Somehow the rest of the car was VERY nicely put together. The interior was nicely arranged, functional, and clean with no squeaks or rattles after a decade.

This is me hitting the stupid 112mph speed limiter in the Accord:Thats when I decided it had to go.

The transmission was annoyingly jerky and often indecisive, but Honda suggests using Lubeguard will take care of that. Lots of body roll but the ride quality was nice and handling was secure. Steering was way too stiff for my tastes. I'm sure I could have put another 200k on it with no problems.

[MattB]

The Vigor didn't totally die...the 1st gen 2.5TL has the same engine.