THE WORLD JUST SHRANK

Forum for Infiniti M37, M56 M35h Hybrid and Q70 owners.
Larz
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The world of Infiniti just got much smaller.
My peeps back home have been telling me for ages now about the Infiniti plant in Sunderland UK that churns out the Q30 and QX30 and that most of them are sent to the states and China because most of the UK and Europe will not buy one. Mercedes' A-class & GLA as well as BMW's X1, 1-series and 2-series beat the crap out of Infiniti in short order.
As of this month, it's official ...... Infiniti will withdraw from most of Europe in 2020. This, of course, means the new plant (2015) in Sunderland UK that makes the Q30 and QX30 will close this year, leaving over 7,000 people to look for work elsewhere. The Middle East, Asia, and Eastern Europe (Czech, Bulgaria, Poland, Romania, Ukraine, and Russia) will be the only chance for Infiniti to grow outside the USA (the US represents 70% of total sales for Infiniti - up another 10% in 2018).
Some say the failure of Infiniti in the UK is due to Brexit ... not bloody likely ... Infiniti's original target was to average 90-120 thousand units in Europe each year by 2019. During the last 3 years, they barely sold 12,000 units in total (only 10% of their target). That isn't Brexit, it's the market saying: We aren't interested, move along.
And now, Infiniti plans to go all-electric by 2021. They will stop all diesel engines and all hybrids this year and plan to focus mostly on SUVs and Crossovers. All this leads me to wonder about the future of the full size sedan we call Q70. Will it drop off the menu in 2020? Will it morph into a slightly smaller Tesla-sized EV? Or will Infiniti just do what it has done for years now - minor cosmetic changes but still the same body, drivetrain, and interior for one last model year? Nobody seems to be talking about the future of Q70 specifically. I cannot find any reliable information aside from the hoopla about the "Infiniti Inspiration" concept car (which is full electric).
What are your thoughts? Should we be concerned?


Frog
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I asked my dealer this question a few months ago. With the reply of the Q 70 is done!

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pedsemdoc
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Larz, it's sad that Nissan doesn't seem to want to invest in new innovative tech/engine/transmission into their Infiniti line - it seemed like there was more advanced tech in the top model Nissans, Genesis/Hyundai, and Kia's than the Q70 (their supposed flagship sedan). They did try to update things in the G/Q50, but numerous car mags dis on the touchscreen/nav appearance, interior controls in Infiniti's. Basically they state things look dated, and what's the deal with no Apple CarPlay or Android Auto - you've got to buy aftermarket adapters/harnesses to get that functionality.... :rolleyes:

Don't get me wrong, I love my M37, but when I compare what's in my one year newer Audi RS7 (heads up display, WiFi hotspot, Google maps option for navigation, multiple mode massaging, heated and cooled seats that have almost infinite adjustment including side bolsters, adaptive air suspension, Bang & Olufsen stereo with front tweeters that rise out of the dash to improve the soundstage, ability to write letters/numbers on a touchpad for nav and radio entry, night vision, etc. - granted when comparing the same model years the base RS7 is prolly about $60k more) but you start to wonder where Infiniti has their priorities. Seems like that's where most manufacturers are going though. Less emphasis on sedans and more on crossovers/smaller SUVs with turbocharged smaller engines/hybrid set ups, ultimately to full electric. Car guys who want the sound of their big engines, buying modern electric will have to settle for artificial computerized sounds piped into the cabin- lol or else continue to care for their fossil-fuel burning beasts, until there aren't replacement parts available for them anymore and they have an issue that can't be fixed...lol.

Larz
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I agree completely! Infiniti was created almost solely for the US market to make a profitable dent in Mercedes / BMW / Audi sales. The Q45 and the first generation M35 / M45 were at the leading edge of tech, value, and reliability. The second generation of M's kept up with advances in tech, but only to a degree. Then came the Q generation. The Q70's are great cars, but by then, Infiniti slowed it's drive to stay above the crowd and concentrated their efforts on the Q50 sedan. The result is that Q70 competitors now have more kit, more tech, and more of what 'drivers' look for. Statisticians will prove to us all that crossovers and SUVs have been in much higher demand for years and everyone is churning them out fast as they can. But Merc,BMW, and Audi have never stopped advancing their sedans. They all followed the SUV trend, but also kept advancing and improving other vehicles as well. Why didn't Infiniti do that? Since the debut of the Q70, Infiniti has kept the car a secret - no advert blitz, no effort to attract new buyers, nothing to make anyone 'want' one. Since the debut, Infiniti has done absolutely nothing with the Q70 aside from slight cosmetic bumper changes. From the M37 in 2011 it's been nearly the same interior, same tech, and they still only offer the same old stereo since 2006!
If this is indeed the last year for the Q70, I am forced to look elsewhere for my next sedan. The new Genesis G80 and G90 are light years ahead of Infiniti and less costly to own and maintain that Mercs, BMWs, and Audi's. I'm a huge Jag fan but the high cost to own and maintain one makes the Genesis look pretty good to me.

kmiles
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Larz - great post and comments. Wasn't the Q30 and QX30 a joint project with Mercedes? I'm betting that Mercedes pulled out of the partnership due to Brexit, too. No matter what, Nissan has lost focus due to their CEO issues and the lack of vision and direction are showing right now. I've been reading about the new Genesis cars and the G70 and G80 are incredibly well reviewed for such a new car. However, they are new and don't have a lot of history. Last year, the Alfa's were all getting incredible reviews. This year, everyone is talking about how much time they spend in the dealer's repair shops. Audi's are VW's and while well designed and loaded with new tech and features, they are expensive to repair and many have low reliability rates. I'm going to stick with my Q70 for a few years, hoping that Nissan/Infiniti get's their act together before it is too late. I'm a fan of powerful sedans and hope to continue to have great choices. I'm not a fan of SUV's and hope that the downturn in sedans and coupes doesn't last long. Kind of reminds me of when station wagons like the Volvo's and Audi's were hot, then went away completely and now they're coming back - but called SUV's, just jacked up and modernized. They all serve a purpose. I need a sleek sedan with great power, the latest tech and a secure trunk. I don't want an old boring Datsun. I'm also not sold on electric cars. The tax breaks that were making them attractive are going away. Our state is trying to figure out how to tax the heck out them since they aren't getting tax revenues from gasoline. Sorry for the rambling!

Larz
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You're right. Electric is NOT the future. They are only a 'good idea' if you are short-sighted. The truth about electric cars will someday become common knowledge. Ever since the debut of the Tesla, scientists have warned (and proven) that the creation of the batteries does much more lasting damage to the environment and climate change than carbon powered engines. I'm a huge fan of Hydrogen, but that will require a HUGE infrastructure investment and we are still left with a general public who still thinks Hydrogen is more dangerous than gasoline (which is isn't). With Infiniti out of the 'full size' sedan market, The Genesis G70-G80-G90 are in perfect position to become the ONLY reasonably priced, high trim level sedans for those who don't want or cannot afford the S-class, 7-series, and Audi sedans. I don't have the same cost-to-own fears about the Genesis that I have for any of the German sedans. If I'm honest, the only reason I'm not in a Jag XJ right now is the high price for parts and maintenance.

M37xfan
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Check out edmunds.com review of the 2015 Hyundai Genesis (2015 the year it was re-designed)....you will be impressed

Larz
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Here is Doug Muro's detailed review of the 2017 G90.
It's interesting that Genesis made the same mistakes as Infiniti when trying to promote this car. Since this is the 2017 model it does not have the rear screens that were added on newer models. And this model is 2 years old now. Assuming the same speed of depreciation as Infinity and others, it is probably an even better value. I fancy the 2020 model, so that gives me 2 more years time before I might choose between a used 2020 Genesis and whatever Infiniti offers between now and 2022.

emm3seven
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Sad news, and doesn't bode well for the Q70's future. Based on sales volume I'm not surprised that they're following other car makers and pivoting away from sedans and focusing on SUVs/crossovers.

Larz
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Here is a little info on the new president of Infiniti: Christian Meunier
Meunier’s appointment comes almost two months after former Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn was arrested in Japan and charged with several counts of financial misconduct. Meunier, the former Mercedes-Benz and Land Rover executive held several positions in marketing and sales before becoming president of Nissan Brazil in 2010, where he helped turn around the company and made Infiniti the fastest growing brand in Brazil for three consecutive years. In 2013, Meunier was named president of Nissan Canada. Four years later, he was named Infiniti’s head of global marketing and sales. Meunier, based in Nashville, Tenn., is familiar with Infiniti’s No. 1 market -- the United States. The U.S. accounts for more than 70 percent of Infiniti’s business worldwide. He is now the president of Infiniti Global LTD - the entire Infiniti arm of Nissan. His main goal: By 2025, Infiniti will be making ONLY electric and hybrid powertrain cars. The first is expected to be in showrooms in 2021.

Here are some quotes from the new president:
“Infiniti, for a lot of reasons, has been very much middle-of-the-road for many years and has tried to do too many things and tried to compete head-to-head with all the premium brands, including the Germans. The purpose for the next two to three years is not to grow, it’s to consolidate and to prepare for the launch of all electric cars. It’s to get ready for electrification. Infiniti shouldn’t be competing against luxury brands, anyway. We don’t want to be the No. 1 brand, we want to be the No. 1 challenging brand. We can’t be the car for everyone. We don’t need 50 different models like the Germans. We need the only the models that will give us the edge in the electric and hybrid marketplace.”

So ........ Infiniti is no longer interested in luxury autos - just electric vehicles. Seems Infinti will now challenge the likes of Tesla - much less luxurious, but with lots of electricity and doing more damage to the globe than any fossil fuel cars (read about how the batteries are made). If I were president of Genesis Motors, I'd be doing the happy dog dance about the boardroom. This means that my closest priced, most reliable competitor is going over the cliff like a cheap chest of drawers. That leaves only the Germans and my Genesis cars are lower priced, more luxurious, have a better warranty, still use reliable V6 / V8 power plants, and don't become money pits after 3-4 years. Cadillac, KIA, and Lincoln are still poor build quality with low engine and drivetrain reliability, so no worries there. It's time to ramp up production, open new dealerships next to Inifniti stores, and buy some money counting machines - electric counting machines, that is.


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