The best fuel injector cleaner

[1GR8M56S]

Has any heard or used liquid Moly injector cleaner or can recommend of one with good results?

[silberma]

From my days of owning a BMW that requires you to use top tier gasoline I learned a few things. The EPA requires that oil companies use a minimum amount detergent in the gasoline. BMW, General Motors, Volkswagen, Mercedes-Benz and Audi recognize that the current EPA minimum detergent requirements do not go far enough to ensure optimal engine performance. However, tier one (top tier) gasolines have several times the minimum amount of the EPA recommended detergents. To earn Top Tier certification a fuel must pass four tests – deposit control on intake valves, fuel injectors and combustion chambers. Additionally, to earn the seal of approval fuels cannot contain metallic additives, which are potentially harmful to automotive emissions-control systems. Beyond that it must also prevent intake-valve sticking. Basically it’s gas with extra cleaning agents designed to keep engines running their best.
If you use Exxon, Mobil, Chevron, Conoco, Phillip 66, Esso, and Texaco gasolines you will not need any additives.

[1GR8M56S]

Thank, Ive always put premium fuel 93+octane, but I dont think it'll hurt to through something in the tank ever so often.

[Ilya]

I use the best gas I can find and I always run a can of Seafoam every like 5-6k.

[beachbum718]

Seafoam in where? I only heard about usong that with high milage cars

[Larz]

I use a full can in a full tank of fuel twice a year (about 5,000 mile intervals). I also add about 4 ounces in the vacuum line once per year. There are DIYs for this in the FAQ section.
Some people say it's a wast of time, but I notice an improvement and it can't harm anything if used correctly, so there.

[Ilya]

Seafoam in where? I only heard about usong that with high milage cars

I do a maintenance dose with new oil every change and a full can every 5kmi or so. Once a year I'll run it through the vacuum line.

[SwissCheeseHead]

Redline SI-1 Fuel System cleaner has the highest PEA than any fuel system cleaner in the market. IMO, Seafoam is snake oil. Prices drop as low as $11 on Amazon. There is an initial treatment, and a prolonged schedule that really stretches out each bottle. The reviews on Amazon are extremely helpful.

http://smile.amazon.com/dp/B000CPI5Z0/r ... dline+fuel

[Ilya]

Is it though? (Seafoam is snake oil)

Threads like these make me disagree with you, and I've been using it for years with zero adverse effects.

http://www.yotatech.com/f123/seafoam-be ... es-246424/

If it can clean carbon that well, whose to say it can't clean stuff in your engine while circulating with your oil or fuel? I use it via all three methods, never had a problem with my engines or fuel systems in the 3 cars I've been using it on over the last 10 years.

[Debonair]

Calling it "snake oil" does not automatically imply it will cause harm. Simply that it is (in this case scientifically) unproven and of questionable benefit. I for one could not find any independent lab tests done on it even on their own website.

I have used Seafoam in the past and did not have any issues.

THIS ARTICLE article has some discussion on the subject. Pretty good short read. Basically it will have some effect but not as great as a PEA based additive.

I just run good gas and synthetic oil. No additives in my cars in a long time.

[Larz]

I disagree. There are independent testimonials with visual proof. Here is one example of before / after on a car that has 125,000 miles before the Seafoam was applied.
https://youtu.be/u6UeJXkzDW8
There are detergents in today's fuel that are supposed to prevent carbon build-up. So, is Seafoam or any other additive really necessary or required? I'd say probably not. However, Seafoam has been found to make a significant difference at the piston edges, where cabron build-up causes friction. There are absolute horror stories online with videos of people who have hydro locked their engines, caused all sort of damage to crank cases, etc. However, in each case it was clearly proven they did NOT follow instructions. Like most after market tinkering, if you don't read or don't follow instructions, you can cause huge problems.
Personally, there is a noticeable difference in driving after Seafoam. Using it properly, it causes NO harm.

[Ilya]

Calling it "snake oil" does not automatically imply it will cause harm. Simply that it is (in this case scientifically) unproven and of questionable benefit. I for one could not find any independent lab tests done on it even on their own website.

I have used Seafoam in the past and did not have any issues.

THIS ARTICLE article has some discussion on the subject. Pretty good short read. Basically it will have some effect but not as great as a PEA based additive.

I just run good gas and synthetic oil. No additives in my cars in a long time.

To me when someone says snake oil it means 'not worth it'. That's what I was disagreeing with. I think it's a great product.

[szh]

Has any heard or used liquid Moly injector cleaner or can recommend of one with good results?

I still use and like BG-44K in my car every so often ... usually at about a couple of gas tankfuls prior to an oil change.

This is like a concentrated version of Techron (that the Chevron folks put into the auto stores, and add to their premium gasoline).

Note, there are people who don't think BG-44K is great anymore, in the latest formulations. I do not agree with them - it seems to help my 2003 M45 occasionally.

Z

[SwissCheeseHead]

To each their own. I personally would not use Seafoam in any of my cars as there is no proven benefit from using it. "Snake Oil" is usually when a product leads you to believe that it is doing something, when there is no evidence that it is actually doing anything. It will most likely not harm your car, but it is also most likely not giving it any benefit either.

True fuel system cleaners have polyether amines (PEA), which we know for a fact, is the most effective fuel system cleaner.

Per the MSDS, Seafom is <95% hydrocarbon blend and <25% isoproponal. Basically, a combustible compound and alcohol (much like gasoline (hydrocarbon) and ethanol (alcohol) blends). It's basically a combustible fuel in a can. No PEA's are listed in the MSDS, which to reaffirm, is the active compound found in fuel system cleaners.

Redline SI-1, on the other hand has 30-39.9% of PEA per bottle of cleaner, which is purported to be the highest quantity per bottle on the market.

I would rather take the facts, then some friend's/buddy's/joe schmoe's word for it. No offense.

Here are the MSDS as sources:
Seafoam: ftp://69.2.51.153/pub/MSDS/289404_SeafoamSDS.pdf
Redline SI-1: https://www.redlineoil.com/content/file ... 012-12.pdf

Of course there are other fuel system cleaners on the market that have PEA as an active compound, but they are not in as high a quantity as Redline.

*not affiliated with Redline in any way (even though I am a huge fan of their products)*

Again, to each their own.

[Ilya]

Redline makes good stuff. I use their Water Wetter product with my coolant (had the dealer pour it in).

I'll give that product a shot...but I still believe Seafoam, at least for cleaning out the carbon buildup via the intake manifold, is an excellent product.

[Larz]

Swiss, you make a convincing argument. Redline has detergent action, whereas Seafoam is basically a solvent. Chemically speaking, solvents work on the premise that "like dissolves like" and they dissolve deposits and make them part of the resulting solution which is burned off with the fuel combustion. Detergents, however, have a polar "charge" that will attach to non-polar deposits like those in the fuel system (gasoline is non-polar) so it makes sense that a nitrogen based PEA detergent will make a stronger bond to the deposits and will likely remove them more effectively.
All of this started swimming in my head and got me to thinking so I did some research based on Detergent Vs Solvent and how that applies to hydrocarbons, carbon build-up, and specifically fuel and fuel systems. I found this interesting discussion:
http://www.ericthecarguy.com/kunena/6-M ... -additives
I do not agree that Seafoam has no proven results. Results are results, whether done in a million-dollar lab or a driveway. Both would include visual confirmation like that in the case of the Joe with a cam, and visually there is a clear difference after using Seafoam.
However, that also started me thinking about the composition of Seafoam Vs PEA cleaners. The fuel we use in our cars contains ethanol which is a solvent and Seafoam is also a solvent, so it makes sense that Seafoam in the fuel will be diluted by the ethanol and thus it's cleaning power will be diminished before it reaches the injectors.
Then, I found confirmation from an unlikely source:
https://youtu.be/gg9ppeUMpK4
If I'm honest, I have to say I have been turned round about Seafoam. It is definitely NOT snake oil, but seems it is out-of-date as a fuel system cleaner and less effective than PEA-containing cleaners.
Swiss, you have a convert in me. I will use Redline from now on.

[Debonair]

Swiss, your $5 conversion check from Redline is in the mail.

[SwissCheeseHead]

Lol. Thanks for the affirmation. Really. I want consumers to be edumacated is all. We all work hard for our dollars, and the last thing I want to see is someone wasting money when there is a better alternative out there. I'm glad I can help. Isn't that what we're here for?

In all honestly, I was expecting a very heated argument as to why Seafoam does wonders. So thanks for the pleasant surprise

[Ilya]

Heated argument? Come on now. You guys know you can't mess with me and my section of the forum...., I'm kidding. But in all seriousness, and I've told the power figures that run this site, I'm lucky enough to moderate two forums which are comprised of mostly working professionals who behave as such. When you buy cars this expensive, it's rare to get one of those 'daddies boys' in the mix who screw it up for everyone. You guys do a good job of keeping it in line and if anything, policing yourselves. Makes my job easier.

[SwissCheeseHead]

You know how some people can get. I've been part of forums where people argue over far more pointless and stupid things. I agree 100% that everyone on here so far has been awesome to deal with.

[ibc]

Hmm. Interesting. Thanks for posting this. Guess I'll stop using Seafoam in the car, and instead use Redline SI-1 from now on.

[pedsemdoc]

Wanted some opinions about this: useful or overpriced service?

Just got my oil changed today and the service advisor reviewed the "Items requiring attention soon" portion of the inspection report: They recommended the Complete Fuel & Induction Service, to the tune of $319.95.

Is this going to do a better job than me pulling off the throttle bodies, cleaning them and trying to clean as much as I can in the intake manifold that I can reach without taking it completely apart as well as running some Redline SI-1 through the engine?

[EdBwoy]

They recommended the Complete Fuel & Induction Service, to the tune of $319.95.

I know I probably get people on the defensive sometimes with my objective (to me) questions, but I would ask them how they plan do it and what kind of benefits their customers have reported.
IIRC, someone here (DFW?) showed us what kind of cleaning his intake needed (direct injected M56). For that kind of labor, why not pay.

I always understood the service as a throttle body and injector cleaning. For a car with a fuel filter using premium fuel, idk what kind of issues the port mounted injectors will see. I haven't seen any issues with the injectors I've taken apart in old engines.

So if the guy is gonna pour seafoam in your tank, spray MAF cleaner on your sensors and dab a rag soaked in throttle body cleaner on your throttle plates, I personally wouldn't pay.
If they somehow feel the need to disassemble and basically rebuild the injectors, maybe I'd play.

[ssmrico]

I have used sea foam all 3 ways on my m37 and evo and other cars no issues

[Malbec 56 Beast]

I only fill up at Sinclair or Shell. I use full synthetic oil Mobile one, Castrol.

I occasionally use 3M injector cleaner.

From what I hear on this board about racing etc I'd be surprised if anyone had any carbon buildup lol.

Andy

[ProverbPsalms]

I'm no expert, but I thought I'd chime in.

Two times my M56x had a check engine light, I believe code was 0142? - the one for the catalytic converter.

I put a can of sea foam in each time, and after 24 hours honestly they went away, this was nearly 9 months apart from each other

[Moveitsmikey]

I quit using seafoam when I found out it contains namptha which harms your engine. I am a huge amsoil guy and I live by their products, ill add a bottle of their P.I fuel system cleaner and a powerfoam through the intake. The proof is all in the facts.

[amc49]

What 'facts'?

I use absolutely NONE of that stuff and fix my own cars, no one else ever touches them once I buy one and 3 or 4 cars running at all times for some 40 years now.

[hagani]

I'm no expert, but I thought I'd chime in.

Two times my M56x had a check engine light, I believe code was 0142? - the one for the catalytic converter.

I put a can of sea foam in each time, and after 24 hours honestly they went away, this was nearly 9 months apart from each other

P0142 - is the code for downstream O2 sensor.

Catalytic converter codes are - P0420 and P0430

[Frog]

Agreed use none of it.