Starting probs... electrical or starter

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

I've been searching all over throughout the forums and other places for starting problems and have not found any real answers. First off, how many people who have had starting problems have had or still have an alarm system installed? I know my car did, and i found many other articles about too much resistance in the starting circuit due to "remnants of an old alarm system". But many also say that if you smack your solenoid with a wrench and it starts, its the starter... Both of these seem to be a cause for my starting prob. Also my ignition was "broken" when i first bought the car. any key could start it. Then i read about something in the ignition that could been worn out and cause starting problems. So, when i first took my car in to fix the alternator the "mechanic" broke the key in the ignition and some how removed it. After I got it back he told me there was a starting problem with the starter and to hit the starter with something to get it started. Before that there was no starting problem, and when i bought it the guy said he had the starter check and it showed up fine. So I'm thinking it could just be the ignition, because he could have screwed it up when removing the broken key... Oh yeah and my car gives that characteristic click when you turn the key to on. Some times it starts no problem, sometimes when you turn the key a few times, sometimes when you hit the solenoid.... symptoms and solutions to all three above problems. So whats going on?!?!?:help

Post by **navysnail** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

if he had to hit the starter, then the starter is bad

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Yeah but almost half the time it doesn't start you just need to turn the key a couple more times and it'll start, the rest of the times it either starts when you hit it or it doesn't at all, that's whats so confusing...

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

anybody?anything?

Post by **f8sjester** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

if hitting the solenoid works, then it's almost definitely your starter. The solenoid basically works by using a small amount of electricity to push a plunger into place, which then sends full juice to the starter itself. If the plunger is sticking/is stuck in the solenoid, a whack with a wrench/hammer/small child will usually dislodge it and get it working.

Or, you can make sure that all the electrical leads going to your starter/solenoid are in good working order. If the solenoid isn't even getting the minimal electricity when you hit the ACC, then the magnet for the plunger isn't going to engage anything. . .

good luck with the problem. . .

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

ok, this morning me and my dad were looking at my car. we started it up 15+ times in a row, then about 1 hour later when i left for work it started up fine again. but at lunch (At work) and when trying to leave work it wouldn't start, the same click. i tried hitting the solenoid and turning the key (same time) and nothing. i tried it over and over and waited for 1 1/2 hours and nothing, the only thing that happend was the solenoid got really hot. also a friend from work looked at the starter and he couldn't get the car to start, but he is pretty sure its not the starter. i have found a few parts left in the car from an old alarm system, thats why i'm thinking it could be electrical, not the starter. but it also sometimes starts when hitting the starter (just a coincidence??maybe). so i plan on taking it in on my day off. Which is monday!! i'll probably get stuck at work another 3 times before then... i know someone here has had the same problem, so help!

Post by **navysnail** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

i dunno man, it really sounds like the starter, if you have to turn they key, then eventually it will click, but it will take a few times

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

well it's still stuck in my work's parking lot, looks like i'm going to have to get it towed, if i find out whats wrong soon i guess i'll post it

Post by **Ubernoober** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

While it isn't the cheapest thing, I would begin with replacing the starter. It really sounds as if it may be the main contributor to your problem. The goal here is to fix/replace one thing at a time here. That way when things start working, you know where the problem was. If the starter wasn't the entire problem then you can work into the system and continue eliminating things one at a time. I know it seems slow, but in the end this process will save you a lot of time and frustration. Plus replacing the starter is a one hour job and is easy.

Post by **justmerging** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

I was having the same problem in my 93. I replaced the starter which took all of 45 min at the most and no problems since then. It may just be screwed up battery terminals not making a good connection but it sounds like the starter is about to go to me.

Post by **cdlong** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

the clicking you hear is relays kicking on (or the solenoid trying to work) either way power is getting to the starter and everything is working like it should, not a problem with the alarm, so it is probably your starter.

if you want to check, take a volt meter and check the two wires on the starter for power. the thick wire will be hot all the time and the thin wire will get power when you turn the key.

Post by **Bigrolla** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

this guy is in denial, he just wants someone to tell him its not the starter. Anythign else and he doesnt really wanna here it ha.Good Luck but i think its ur starter.Good Luck but i think its ur starter which isnt a big probelm unless money is tight.

Post by **fiznat** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Its your starter man, face it... haha a good way to know for sure is to pull your starter (its only 2 bolts and some connections, really not that hard at all), and bring it to your local Advance Auto/Pep Boys/Napa/Whatever and have it tested on their bench. They'll put power through it and run a diagnostic... they'll tell you if it's either good or bad point blank: then you will know.

Good luck!

Post by **ramrat** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

I had the exact same problem. Even replaced the starter (with a cheap p*p boys starter - well it wasn't cheap) - still the same problem. I had it in the shop and the mechanic replaced it with a starter from the Nissan dealer - problem solved. The mechanic told me never to purchase those type of items from the chain part store as the place they get it from don't rebuild them good (well its a gamble anyways - I gambled and lost). So my suggestion is - get it rebuilt at a trusted alternator/starter rebuild shop or get a factory rebuilt starter Nissan, but as everyone else said - its your starter.

Post by **Bigrolla** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

ramrat wrote:I had the exact same problem. Even replaced the starter (with a cheap p*p boys starter - well it wasn't cheap) - still the same problem. I had it in the shop and the mechanic replaced it with a starter from the Nissan dealer - problem solved. The mechanic told me never to purchase those type of items from the chain part store as the place they get it from don't rebuild them good (well its a gamble anyways - I gambled and lost). So my suggestion is - get it rebuilt at a trusted alternator/starter rebuild shop or get a factory rebuilt starter Nissan, but as everyone else said - its your starter.

Very ggood point, thats the same problem i had in my corolla with pep boys. I had a lifetime warrenty so i went through 2 starters and never could figure out why. Turned out to be crappy parts.

Post by **Pickalini 240** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

yeah, i figured it was the starter, it's going to get fixed this weekend. Hope it will start everytime from then on... but for now i gotta wait

Post by **ricebike** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

haha, yea peps starters/alternators <prostart brand> do use some inferior parts, but can also be damaged during shipping as well, since they have to restock shelves 2-3-4 times a week...

I now heard that they're carrying Bosch new/reman units; i'd go w/ that choice if I can't afford a stealership unit.

Post by **Hellion240sx** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

where is the starter located???

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Hi,

I am having a similar problem with my '90 240SX SE. I dont drive it much so its parked often. I charged the battery and it gets lights and lap belt and all. When I try to turn the key, the engine doesnt even try to turn over. There was an alarm system installed at one point before i bought the car, and I had to remove the remains myself. I dont know where the solenoid or the starter is located on the KA24E motor, please help!

thank you,

1drifterX

Post by **xekushnr** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

i install a lot of alarms at my work, since you used to have an alarm check to make sure that the starter kill relay is not still hooked up. when you take it out you have to reconnect the two ends of the starter wire.

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Hi,

thanks for the quick reply. Where would that be located? I kind of just pulled it out from underneath my steering wheel. Please reply. Also which two wires need to be connected up with the starter?

thanks.

1drifterX

Post by **xekushnr** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

the starter kill should be right around wherever the alarm brain was. if you removed it from under the steering column, it should be around there too. there would have been a wire from the alarm going to it.

in order for the starter kill to work, you have to cut the starter wire in half, wire one side into a port on the relay and the other onto another port. the other ones are for 12v i believe. just reconnect the cut starter wire and remove the relay.

Post by **xekushnr** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

hopefully this will help. i just drew it in paint. these are the relays i use at work.

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Hi thanks for the diagram. I have pulled all the wires out and seperated them. I am going to take a picture and post it and perhaps you may be able to help me from there.

thanks alot.

1drifterX

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Here are 2 pics, that i hope will serve helpful.

http://pictures.care2.com/view/2/883719153

http://pictures.care2.com/view/2/862828430

please tell me what you think.

thank you,

1drifterX

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

hi,

here's one of the fuse box. Please let me know how i can be of help. Info greatly appreciated!!

http://pictures.care2.com/view/2/985070066

thanks,

1drifterX

Post by **1drifterX** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:42 pm

Starting probs... electrical or starter

Starting probs... electrical or starter

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