Starter replacement help

[DannyLeDuc]

Hello all, I'm new to the site, and new to owning an Infiniti. I just drove a 1999 Q45 from SW Missouri to Pittsburgh, thanks to my mother's generosity. It drove like a dream the whole trip...until the first day back in town. The starter went out an hour from my house.

I got it towed back home, got a new starter to replace the faulty unit, and set to work.

Those of you who have replaced a starter on these, please stop laughing at me now, thanks.

So, it definitely seems as if I have to remove the rack and pinion unit in order to access the starter. So far, I've gotten the outer tie rod ends to break loose (dear God, that took some beating/PB Blaster soaking), gotten the power steering fluid drained to avoid messiness, gotten the four bolts holding the rack in place removed, and loosened the U-joint attached to the steering column (marked with paint already, one less screw up for me to screw up).

My issue at this point is that I cannot seem to maneuver the rack in any meaningful way in order to get it out of place so I can access the starter. I must be missing something, but I cannot see what it would be. I've read a few posts on here so far, but none have mentioned my specific set of circumstances.

Has anyone else done this themselves, and can tell me what the heck I'm doing wrong so far?

[3Q Jay]

yep. itsa pain. you are doing all the right things. the rack can be pushed up and out. I believe I undid the lower motor mount nuts so I could jack the engine up just a bit. I also undid one of the pipes going into the rack near the gear block.
after that, just jockey around. you will still be twisting and rotating to get the starter in and out.

[my12by60]

Jay,

What do you think is a fair rate for the shop to charge for getting the starter out and re-installing once they already have the steering rack off for the warranty replacement that we discussed on another thread?

I figured something like $20 or so as I thought the starter was fully accessible and just a bolt/off - bolt/on job once the rack was out of the way. But now that I see the two posts above, I wonder if removing the starter is still a bit of a job even with the rack already off. I want to be fair to the shop, but I also don't want to get ripped off and have them try to charge for the full book time for the starter remove/replace (which time must include the rack removal time).

[DannyLeDuc]

Thanks, Jay. I'll keep at it, and post an update when I'm victorious!

Or, alternatively, when I pay a shop to finish the job, rofl...we'll see which.

[3Q Jay]

Jay,

What do you think is a fair rate for the shop to charge for getting the starter out and re-installing once they already have the steering rack off for the warranty replacement that we discussed on another thread?

I figured something like $20 or so as I thought the starter was fully accessible and just a bolt/off - bolt/on job once the rack was out of the way. But now that I see the two posts above, I wonder if removing the starter is still a bit of a job even with the rack already off. I want to be fair to the shop, but I also don't want to get ripped off and have them try to charge for the full book time for the starter remove/replace (which time must include the rack removal time).

Well, I think $20 is fair.
once the rack is COMPLETELY out the starter is not that big of a deal. I only repositioned the rack, so it was still a pain.

[my12by60]

Ok. I get it. You had to do some twisting and rotating because you did not remove the rack entirely. Thanks.

[DannyLeDuc]

Okay, I have good news and bad news.

Good news: Rack and pinion is out, starter is replaced with a new unit.

Bad news: Hooked battery up to test the new starter before reassembling the rack and pinion assembly, and the F-ing thing does the exact same thing it did before embarking on this adventure. When you turn the key, you hear the click, which I assumed was the starter solenoid activating. Absolutely nothing else happens. I've checked the fusible link, which is fine. There is apparently no starter relay, but instead a Neutral/Park Safety Switch, and to test this, I put the car in N and all of the gears to try and rule it out. In N or P, I hear the click...but in any gear including R, not even that. I assume this is the switch correctly preventing the solenoid from getting power while not in N or P.

So...any other ideas I'm missing?

[3Q Jay]

good progress.
as for the click, very very common on the fgy33 starter.
sounds to me like a bad starter solenoid (on top of the starter, but you prolly knew that). just because it is 'rebuilt' does not guarantee pedigree--assume you did not go for a genuine nissan rebuild (are they even still available)?
you know how to verify the starter off the car before installing?

[3Q Jay]

PS- when my factory starter would do the dreaded click about 1 time in 10 (always would crank on the next subsequent try) is when i decided to home rebuild it.

[DannyLeDuc]

I have the old starter off the car already, obviously. I can take it to Autozone and have it tested, if the solenoid is bad on it, then I likely have the same issue on the "new" (rebuilt) model. I haven't put the rack back in yet, so if I need to take the rebuilt unit off and have it tested too, I can still do so with a minimum of fuss.

Good call, and thanks for the help, Jay!

[3Q Jay]

autozone can test, but you can too (at least functionality, maybe not current draw) with jumpercables and an alligator clip lead.....that would possibly rule out ignition switch, etc. (or point to it....)

[DannyLeDuc]

Okay, so the old starter failed the AZ test. The motor spun, but the gear didn't move the position necessary to engage the flywheel. I'm going to pull the rebuilt unit off, and take it in for testing also. If it does the same thing, or passes, I'll have more info to go on.

Good idea on the self-testing, but I'm a little leery about doing something potentially unsafe when I'm not that knowledgeable, lol. Chances are pretty good I would do everything right, but I've already given a blood sacrifice to the Infiniti gods on this repair, I don't think a burnt offering would help my chances any more, rofl....

[DannyLeDuc]

So, fun wrinkle. I took both starters to Autozone after I pulled the remanufactured starter off. This employee was much more knowledgeable than the first guy, and hooked both starters up differently. This time, they both passed. I'm still going to put the new unit in and call that a good thing, based on how hard it was to get to it.

The AZ dude suggested an ignition relay, which was kinda my thought also originally. But...there isn't one listed on the wiring diagram of the technical manuals listed on this forum. It shows the battery to the fusible link (both of which are good), then goes to the ignition switch, to the Park/Neutral Position switch, and to the starter solenoid.

Confusing matters worse for me, is that Rock Auto actually lists an ignition relay for this vehicle, as does Autozone.
http://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/infi ... 7,ignition
I don't see it in the tech manual anywhere, although I'll keep looking.

He also said a common cause of this problem is an internally corroded battery cable to the starter. I suppose it could be, but the car refused to do anything more than click once, and I had never had a problem starting the thing prior to this. I literally started the car ten minutes prior to it not starting, and it's never started since in the last week.

I'm tempted to put everything back in place, have it towed to a garage and see if they can figure it out. I'm not really able to spend a lot on repairs right now, though, so I really should exhaust what I can here on my own.

[3Q Jay]

do the idiot lights dim at all when you move the key from 'ON' to "START"? if they do your battery is crap.
if not, then you have bad electrical connection. on the fgy33, there is a replaceable positive cable end. yeah yeah they're all 'replaceable', but I mean--GOOD STUFF--has the holder for the fusible link integrated. Not some universal garbage.
check the battery voltage when the starter (should be) engaged. If above 11v, no juice is flowing to the starter, and I'd start with that replaceable cable end.
P/N is LINK HOLDER INF#24380-4P410.

[DannyLeDuc]

Nice! Thanks, sir...I will give that a look!

[DannyLeDuc]

Jay, I just wanted to thank you for all your help on this topic. It ended up being a relay of some sort. I had a mechanic figure it out after several days of me struggling with the whole mess.

Car runs great now, though!

[3Q Jay]

Glad you are back in business!