Staggered wheel question

[dmuramoto]

Here's a question OCG35 sent me that might have interest for others on the NSM/NICO board:

"I have an 04 G35 sedan - it has some custom body work and the fenders have been flared moderately and now the offsets I need are a bit different than before.

My question is regarding staggering... currently I run same width and same offset all around, but I'm considering rears to be an inch wider... How important (if at all) is it that wheels front and rear be pushed out equally? In other words, 9.5" + 30 is 2mm sucked in from 10.5 + 40. I am trying to have them equal (20mm farther out front and back) but some of the wheels I'm looking at arent made in the right offsets to make that happen.

I recall an article you did (I think it was you) quite a while back (might have been SportZ) that discussed handling characteristics when staggering - but I don't think it addressed this question specifically.

I'm inclined to believe that front sucked in a bit more than rear might be okay - but I wouldn't think having rear in farther than front would be good...

Any insight you could give is appreciated."

Mike- if I understand your question correctly, it seems the biggest factor to consider is whether the overall track width will be altered and by how much. Since you're running a 'square' setup, a 20 mm change in F&R track is not a significant change and by retaining the OEM offsets you've minimized any problems.

In general, making a car's track slightly wider will usually affect handling in a postive manner. But if you make, say the rear track a lot wider, there may be some unintended consequences. Is there enough clearance for all suspension components at full bump? Will there be enough adjustment left in the suspension components to properly set toe and camber? Could you be overloading the bearings, wheel studs or other components axially?

I'd suggest checking some of these factors with a test wheel. There are such a myriad of factors to consider and using the proposed rim width, offset and possibly even a spacer, the answer to your question is...it depends. HA! Sorry to say, but this answer applies to most complex questions.

[OCG35]

Dave, thank for taking the time to create thread and respond.

As to the info - I'm aware of suspension travel issues, brake clearance, and potential for bearing wear (from using spacers and being pushed out 20 mm farther)

But in relation to handling... "tracking" is the term that left me... considering tracking - I believe the article I mentioned indicated staggering may affect over-steer/under-steer... I presume this to be true particularly with a car that was not designed to be staggered.

If I'm understanding your initial statement, a few mm isn't going to create a problem? So if my width and offset causes rear wheels to be 4mm farther out (for example), there wont be any significant over-steer/under-steer issues?

FWIW, I currently have 8.5 +35 with 20mm spacers - I was using 25mm for a while, but rubbed on fender edge... the overall handling was improved notably! I would not have thought having wheels set out farther would make such a noticeable difference. But I would rather just have wheels that fill the extra space created by the fender flares - this is what prompts my question.

Thanks again for your response(s)

[dmuramoto]

Mike- I'm not certain which article you're referring to, but I'm not aware of any piece I did which covered this topic. In any case, depending on how much difference the rear track ends up being, the effect could be negligible all the way to making your G understeer more.

Assuming you've already checked and made sure nothing is rubbing AND you can still maintain camber and toe to within factory specs, my only concern remains what happens to the clearences once the suspension goes full bump on one side and is loaded at the same time. That might be somewhat unpredictable, but then again, how many times will that happen?

[OCG35]

I'm not sure how this site feels about linking other websites... but during some internet research I came across a really interesting thread regarding the subject of front track being wider than rear:

http://74.125.155.132/search?q...fox-a

[dmuramoto]

Interesting reading, but it still sounds like there's some controversy on this topic from the posters on that thread. Ultimately--unless you have access to an top engineering program on suspension--it comes down to a trial-and-error effort on your G35. Changing F&R track will affect a car's handling, perhaps radically, at the limit. Problem is, how do you test it? Sure, you could rent a road race track and I'd be happy to take it to 10/10ths and report back. But that also means I might come back with just the steering wheel in hand and say "well, that wasn't such a good idea after all...".