SR20DET in old Beetle

[240SXer]

I have a friend with a 1974 Beetle. He purchased 2.1 liter Bug engine, with forged everything, and even EFI. Basically, it sux. The motor is unreliable as any bug engine, full of problems, AND, my KA 240sx is STILL faster.

With me always blabing about SR20DET motors, he wants to put one into his bug. There is actually an adapter for the transmission for a SR20 motor to bolt to the bug transmission. How different would it be? I thought most of the DE and DET were the same.

How would the wiring work out? Would it even be possible? We're probably gonna start on the project this summer.

What we're looking for is just pure stock (200hp in a beetle is more than enough). Can the motor work with NO intercooler? The intercooler piping looks like it would be pretty hard to do, not to mention nowhere to put it. Maybe under the engine with an electric fan on it or something like that. It wouldnt work too well though.

The stock bug transmission would snap like a twig under that kinda power, so we're getting a transmission built to hold the power.

Thanks,

David.

[slw240sx]

hope you have a few grand to blow for fabrication and custom parts youll endup making and breaking

[240SXer]

Yeah... We do.. Well, it's not going to be a quick project.. We've got a few years to do it. Actually we've got forever to do it. But we plan on spending a few summers working on it.

[JPRempe]

This should be interesting to see you adapt a watercooled engine into a platform that uses an aircooled engine...

EDIT- I used to run a turboed '70 Beetle, and built it up from scratch. It's not that hard to do. Heck, even N/A you can get a beetle to run mid 12's. What kind of problems is he having with his engine?

Also, the wiring harness would be a total PITA

[JPRempe]

Am I to assume that the lack of response to this thread is b/c of the aircooled to watercooled transition problem?

[MojoMan]

No. Its just the idea. Which isnt bad. But wierd. You would have to do away with the back seat, engine and transmission would go in pulleys facing towards the back, shifter linkage would be a neccesity, etc....Going from air cooled to water cooled motor wouldnt even be a problem. This is just a boring subject.

[JPRempe]

It would definitely not be real easy to do in that car just due to the lack of space. An inline 4 has a vastly different layout compared to the horizontally opposed 4 in the aircooled dub...

[MojoMan]

Well just to let you know they have been installing v8s in bugs for years. It can be done. I used to have a 77 280z with a v8. sniffle sniffle. I used to kill vettes and alot of annoying flies. I miss it.

[MainEvent212]

lmao, it'd be cool to have some MR2 style ducts coming around each fender....

that'd solve a bit of ur airflow problem...

[MojoMan]

Theres a kit for it. Also a fender kit for vents.

[JPRempe]

Well just to let you know they have been installing v8s in bugs for years. It can be done. I used to have a 77 280z with a v8. sniffle sniffle. I used to kill vettes and alot of annoying flies. I miss it.

Well, there's not much of an interior left when you install a V8 in a bug. You can get just as much performance out of a N/A VW engine (using a Pauter case and Scat split heads) as you can by doing a MUCH more expensive sr20det swap. Hell, you can get the aircooled VW to displace over 3L with that case while still maintaining a relatively small block size. I've built up enough bugs in the past 14 years, but I'm going to switch to doing an sr swap into my '92 240 b/c it's something different. It's too bad I wasn't here last year (on this board) to show you guys my turbo '70 Beetle. That thing was sick! Couldn't keep a clutch in it to save my life...still ran low 12's with the clutch slipping the entire way down the 1/4...

[240SXer]

I think the Air/fuel ratio on his engine isnt setup correctly. His exhaust supposidly sucks for his size engine too. However, it's still slow. It's a 74 superbeetle so it's heavier than most. None of the engines are reliable, especially performance engines. That's why he wants a newer more reliable engine. I don't think the watercooled will be a problem. We'll have to fab up a radiator under the car and throw some fans on it. I don't think the cooling will be a problem. Except for the intercooler. I have no clue about that.... Seems like there is no room. It needs direct airflow, which I don't think it'll get.

[nlzmo400r]

well i know(well pretty sure)the new turbo beetle has an intercooler, so you could see how they piped that one, or you could find some way to do a top mount intercooler

[240SXer]

I don't think an SR swap into a but will be that much... Hell, the current engine in the bug was like 4-5grand. It's just not reliable, it's got power, just stuff is always breaking, leaking, etc. It's a nice RACE engine, but not a street engine.

This is what we were thinking for the SR20DET swap...

Clip 2,500custom Radiator 400Transmission 800SR to VW trans adapter 500Fabrication 1000Wiring 500Misc 300

Did I miss anything? That's about 6,000

That's 6,000, for a reliable 200hp beetle. Plus if there was some way to throw an intercooler on it, we could up the boost.

[nlzmo400r]

you HAVE to have an intercooler to run boost at all, its just DUMB not to, the turbo will almost definitely blow if u dont

[240SXer]

Humm.. Okay.. I thought at 7psi it wouldnt be all that bad? I'm sure there is a spot to mount one with a fan on it or something, that'll blow though. It needs direct outside airflow. But maybe with a larger intercooler that will work.. Or just do it outside the car, i'm sure there is a way.. We wanted to try to retain the rear seats. But if not that's fine too.

[gibbo80]

well i know(well pretty sure)the new turbo beetle has an intercooler, so you could see how they piped that one, or you could find some way to do a top mount intercooler

new beetle have engines in the front and old in back. But it would be cool to do a little snorkle deal to put the air into the intercooler, like the racing nsx's use for intake

[nlzmo400r]

o yea, duh, man was i off my game there, but yea, just like the old mr2's do, with the top snorkel thingy, sounds like a good idea

[undertaker]

you could use water/alcohol injection for intercooling, reduces the hassles with pipework.

[240SXer]

Water injection would work.. Yeah.. but how is it with higher boost? Could you run like 14psi with only water injection? Can you run a little intercooler with a fan on it, AND water injection? (I guess after the intercooler). Or how about an Air to water intercooler?

[bent240LV]

give spearco a call invesigate into an air/water cooler. they are very well worth the money a car that supports up to 600 hi is about $600-$800 then you need a water tank most peopl use fuel cells for that, a pump and some hoses thats about it. you add some ice to the water and you can get some very impressive intake temps. this is what im runnin on my 240 when it is done i will post pics to show what exactly im talkin about in the mean time here is a link to a couple place

http://www.superchargersonline...water this is a link to the kits they have available

http://www.turboneticsinc.com/liquid.html breif discription and list of available cores. if you call them they can make a care for you probably cheaper since you only want to run stoock boost you wont need a big cooler

my core is good to more than 500 and is not big at all its maybe 13x10

[JPRempe]

you HAVE to have an intercooler to run boost at all, its just DUMB not to, the turbo will almost definitely blow if u dont

Not true. The turbo kit on my '70 Bug did not have an intercooler...

And I ran a full 1 BAR boost at the track.