scraping noise when car starts

[vancouverbc]

momentary scraping noise as 1991 240sx starts. i have new battery but it does not seem to start right away. this is a new car for me. twice now i was not able to start after parking for few minutes after long drive. always starts ok in morning. headlights were good etc. i did not hear any clicking sound. should i just replace starter and alternator if they are original after 160000 miles? i have had bad alternators before and still was able to start even when really bad.

[vancouverbc]

battery has lots of juice according to volt meter even when cranking for 15 seconds. there is a small click but i don't think it is the starter solenoid b/c the click happens when i disconnected the small wire that goes to solenoid.

if I disconnect battery cables can i hook up battery to solenoid to see how it sounds?

[gabossie]

The soleniod is a pretty loud click. It sounds like the starter to me though, might just be a bad connection. That's what happened to mine earlier this week. Try hitting it with a hammer a couple times (I know, it sounds horrible, but that's what seems to work). That's something a mechanic buddy of mine taught me awhile back and hasn't failed me since

[gabossie]

try to check for voltage drop at the starter, this would be caused by a bad connection, or a partially cut wire, etc. and would make it difficult for the starter to go.

[vancouverbc]

The starter motor is pretty inaccessable to a hammer. I tried hitting it with a tire iron but probably not hard enough.

I seem to hear a relay clicking and not the solenoid which would suggest something is wrong with wiring or solenoid after relay.

[NISTECH]

hit the starter from the bottom while some one holds it in the start position. but this sounds like a bad starter.

[vancouverbc]

shouldn't i hear the solenoid snapping when I turn key?

[NISTECH]

not nessesarily if the connection problem is in the solenoid. get a cheap test light from the parts store and check for power to the smaller wire going to the solenoid when in the crank position. if it has power your starters toast. if it dosent have power something else is wrong in the starter circuit.

[vancouverbc]

isn't the solenoid self-contained and replaceable without replacing starter motor? if you hook up positive terminal of battery to small wire going to solenoid , the solenoid should snap, right? the solenoid , i assume , is grounded by being connected to the car metal which is ground? thanks.

[vancouverbc]

It happened again today. I disconnected the small wire at the connector about a foot from solenoid. I stuck a small screw driver in battery side of connection and connected batter cable to screw driver and put other side of cable on the passenger seat and connected a multimeter to cable and ground and got 12.4 volts each time i turned key. I reconnected wire and retried to start car . It would not start; so, I took a tire iron to starter motor and the car started. The solenoid did not make any noise. I will have to replace both, i guess.

[NISTECH]

it usually only comes as one unit any how not 2 peices.