Saleen $700,000 fine and recall for modding

[Q45tech]

http://www.arb.ca.gov/lispub/r...o=632h ... .htmAlways good to read the minutes of:http://www.arb.ca.gov/html/whatsnew.htm

[pdqwrx]

Daymmmmmmmm!

[jdshift]

Wow, Just WOW. They should have known better for sure.

[ScottJackson]

$hit, if we're so uptight about people modifying their cars due to emissions concerns, maybe we should invade China and make their factories comply with our emission standards... "Operation Atmospheric Freedom".

[sijoko]

$hit, if we're so uptight about people modifying their cars due to emissions concerns, maybe we should invade China and make their factories comply with our emission standards... "Operation Atmospheric Freedom".

Kinda sad that the government is so concerned with tailpipe emissions but turns a blind eye to the fate of our military personal that are continually exposed to depleted uranium weapons.

http://www.veteransforamerica....=7693

NEW YORK - It takes at least 10 minutes and a large glass of orange juice to wash down all the pills - morphine, methadone, a muscle relaxant, an antidepressant, a stool softener. Viagra for sexual dysfunction. And Valium for his nerves.

Four hours later, Herbert Reed will swallow another 15 mg of morphine to cut the pain clenching every part of his body. He will do it twice more before the day is done.

Since he left a bombed-out train depot in Iraq, his gums bleed. There is more blood in his urine, and still more in his stool. Bright light hurts his eyes. A tumor has been removed from his thyroid. Rashes erupt everywhere, itching so badly they seem to live inside his skin. Migraines cleave his skull. His joints ache, grating like door hinges in need of oil.

There is something massively wrong with Herbert Reed, though no one is sure what it is. He believes he knows the cause, but he cannot convince anyone caring for him that the military's new favorite weapon has made him terrifyingly sick.

In the sprawling bureaucracy of the Department of Veterans Affairs, he has many caretakers. An internist, a neurologist, a pain-management specialist, a psychologist, an orthopedic surgeon and a dermatologist.

He cannot function without his stupefying arsenal of medications, but they exact a high price.

"I'm just a zombie walking around," he says.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium

http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/....html

[audtatious]

No arguments from me on that one.

[Q45tech]

You thru your Democratic representatives passed these laws, sure cannot blame big oil or car manufacturers or other policital parties for them.

Had members bother to read these links they would have found that home air filters are about to be banned at least in the Country of California as they produce harmful OZONE.

The state/country of Left Coast is a bit different from the 49 real states.

Whats worse other states are copying many of their emission activities.

[bullittandy]

You thru your Democratic representatives passed these laws, sure cannot blame big oil or car manufacturers or other policital parties for them.

Had members bother to read these links they would have found that home air filters are about to be banned at least in the Country of California as they produce harmful OZONE.

The state/country of Left Coast is a bit different from the 49 real states.

Whats worse other states are copying many of their emission activities.

This is a double edge sword as there are instances of insane reactions to 100 cars (above) compared to the enormous environmental good that results from strict standards. I read that the new Honda Civic actually cleans the air that it ingests (at least in L.A.) Intake emissions dirtier than tailpipe emissions!!

Also, haven't you heard, ozone is bad.

[audtatious]

You thru your Democratic representatives passed these laws, sure cannot blame big oil or car manufacturers or other policital parties for them.

Who says I blame big oil or car manufacturers for anything?

Or are you jumping the "I think you are a lib" train?

BTW, you joining us at NOPI Nats?

[Unnatural1]

The US is SO concerned about tailpipe emissions and "greenhouse" gases and how detrimental they are to the environment. No one actually tells you that auto emissions make up something like 6% of the global "greenhouse" emissions produced. Of that figure, something like 2-3% is US automobiles. So say everyone trades in their SUV for an economy car and auto emissions drop by half; that's still only, at best, 1.5% of emissions produced.

What may have began in California as a legitimate effort to effect smog, has become a way for the national and state governments to legally extort citizens and businesses out of money. In the Dallas/Ft. Worth Texas metroplex, I have to spend $39.95 to get a state inspection done that used to cost $12.95 (and still does for vehicles over 25 years old). We were told this increase is to pay for an emissions dyno testing procedure that test tailpipe emissions. Well for OBDII vehicles (96 and newer) there is no dyno test. A computer is plugged in to the vehicles diagnostic port and in about 5 minutes the PCM is scanned for problems, the fuel cap is pressure checked, and you're done. So what did my $39.95 buy there? The state still gets their larger profit and penalizes me for owning a newer car! So really if I go buy a couple of inefficient 1982 or older cars to drive (I've got one already; 1978 Ford LTD II - 2 door w/ 351 V8) then I don't have to pay the state more money. What a bunch of bull****!

[ScottJackson]

Exactly. I'm all for clean air and having our cars not spewing out excessive junk, but that's not addressing the much bigger offenders. I can't help but think it's an only an attempt to misdirect the attention of the people and take their money. Kinda like the scrappage programs (did these ever come about?) that gave people credit towards a new car if they sent their older and supposedly dirtier car to the junk yard. I've HEARD that the amount of environmentally hazardous emissions a new car will produce in its lifetime is far less than the emissions created in producing that car. Yeah, let's keep looking for alternative and renewable fuel sources and give car manufacturers small incentives to produce efficient and clean cars, but I think "out of hand" is an understatement of emissions testing/fines at this point.

[lakeq45]

Also, it might seem like a minor point to the regulators, but isn't the purpose of a law supposed to be first and foremost to punish someone for their behavior. Not, as they openly claim, to deter others from blah blah blah.

"We hope that this case will serve as a deterrent to others who may be planning to profit by selling uncertified vehicles,"

Yes, punishment should be severe enough to be a reasonable deterrent, but not be made more severe just for that purpose.

[infinitinut2]

[QUOTE=Q45tech]You thru your Democratic representatives passed these laws, sure cannot blame big oil or car manufacturers or other policital parties for them.

Yeah, right! Let's elect another republican who will take us into another foreign adventure debacle purely to show he is macho and to avenge his father! Now, THBS, I voted for the rotten *** twice, seeing what the dems had to offer! No, we need Chuck Hagel to stay involved and get a credible 3rd party going in this country!

Enough friggen politics on a car lovers' forum! All pols SUCK! aLL!

[mxr662]

The state/country of Left Coast is a bit different from the 49 real states.

I'm in Cali for the nice weather, not the politics.

[Q45tech]

My point soley was that a democratic CONGRESS was in power when each and every emission law was proposed, sponsored, and passed NOTHING MORE, unfortunately republicans are less likely to push anti [business] pollution measures.

This is interesting that there are two types:

http://www.latimes.com/news/sc...=true

"Exploring the neurobiology of politics, scientists have found that liberals tolerate ambiguity and conflict better than conservatives because of how their brains work."

All the scientists [NYU and UCLA] who developed and monitored and the reporter who wrote this were democrats.................I checked their political history. So much for unbiased science!

Jusy incase the above stimulated you here is a detailed story about what your favorite web site says about YOU:

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/0,3902...0.htm

[bullittandy]

I

My point soley was that a democratic CONGRESS was in power when each and every emission law was proposed, sponsored, and passed NOTHING MORE, unfortunately republicans are less likely to push anti [business] pollution measures.

This is interesting that there are two types:

http://www.latimes.com/news/sc...=true

"Exploring the neurobiology of politics, scientists have found that liberals tolerate ambiguity and conflict better than conservatives because of how their brains work."

All the scientists [NYU and UCLA] who developed and monitored and the reporter who wrote this were democrats.................I checked their political history. So much for unbiased science!

Jusy incase the above stimulated you here is a detailed story about what your favorite web site says about YOU:

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/0,3902...0.htm

I think you're a little paranoid. Unprofessional scientists, journalists etc let their personal, political, cultural etc beliefs influence their science but professionals do not, to the extent that they can. Its similar to YOU fixing the car of the customer you hate the same as the customer you love.

Also, the research is pretty clear that there are personality differences between liberal and conservative political thinkers, liberals do tolerate ambiguity better and conservatives generally dislike change. Of course there are pros and cons to both....

[Q45tech]

One of the advantages in independent business is you can select your customers and reject the ones who don't meet your standards.

Very common when dealing with old cars and CERTAIN limited funded or car educated owners, you give them the numbers of dealers and other shops in the neighborhood.

You never reject off the bat, everyone deserves a few chances. But they must be warned if they begin to behave badly. School teachers and ministers [especially those that pay with stacks of ones and fives] get extra chances.

conservatives generally dislike change

[Unnatural1]

I tend to fall just on the conservative side of the middle. So as you can imagine I'm disappointed with both major parties. As for a Democratic controlled congress, the word Democrat is putting it lightly. Many of our Democratic congress people have crossed into the far liberal/socialist side of politics. At least this is the case with the most out spoken I suppose. Unfortunately, some of these people happen to be the congressional leaders.

I can't wait to see the ridiculous stuff that gets proposed and possibly passed in regards to pollution and emissions laws (or really anything...like immigration maybe!!!) as a result of the current state of government. (This is exactly why there was no way I was ever going to vote for Al Gore.) This is all assuming we ever get past the Iraq war and all the bickering on that. I'm really ready to absolutely fire everyone and start over without the career pollitians.

Of all people, I think Lewis Black put it best...We should just take everyone in Washington D.C. out for an afternoon of electro-shock!

[Jeff Williams]

I wonder if Wes' NICO ECU is ARB certified?

I may send mine it to be checked.

Since my car is a California model, I want to make sure it is legal to use in California before I go out there in December.

[Unnatural1]

I wonder if Wes' NICO ECU is ARB certified?

I may send mine it to be checked.

Since my car is a California model, I want to make sure it is legal to use in California before I go out there in December.

Good luck with all that!

[Romeo5k]

Dam.,,, Im not moving to Cali.. fek that

[Jesda]

Ron Paul 2008

[Q45tech]

It costs ~~$15-20-25,000 for the emission tests to achieve CARB certifications. if you pass immediately. and don't require multiple tests.

ECU which don't affect oem software below 2500 rpm and 70% >WOT are usually exempt because of the small amount of time WOT is possible.AND the fact that the extremely over rich oem WOT is actually leaned so it produces less emissions than factory..................the same exemption for factory also helps after market WOT tuners.

Careful as their are some things you can change in ecu software that might effect idle and cruise mixtures and cause a test failure.

California is tough on dyno tests and visual changes.

[ishkabibble]

I tend to fall just on the conservative side of the middle. So as you can imagine I'm disappointed with both major parties. As for a Democratic controlled congress, the word Democrat is putting it lightly. Many of our Democratic congress people have crossed into the far liberal/socialist side of politics. At least this is the case with the most out spoken I suppose. Unfortunately, some of these people happen to be the congressional leaders.

In the grand scheme of things, the two major political parties in the US are marginally different. You've just been trained to view a tiny difference as a vast divide.