s13KA vs S14KA?

[RFcool]

Im looking to get a SR motor soon however was curious if there was a horsepower difference between a s13ka and a s14ka. If so how much and would it be worth taking a s14 motor over a s13 motor in the meantime? Thanks

[dickie]

nope. that was easy! dont spend a single dime on your ka unless its to keep it running until you swap.

[DjPantsSpecR]

well actually, no thats wrong

an s14 with s13 cams will make the most power

an s13 with s14 cams will make the least power

an s13 with an s14 motor and s13 cams is the same car, and vice versa.

however, a coupe with 248/232 is the quickest.... alright i made that up, but its alotta fun

[RFcool]

well actually, no thats wrong

an s14 with s13 cams will make the most power

an s13 with s14 cams will make the least power

an s13 with an s14 motor and s13 cams is the same car, and vice versa.

however, a coupe with 248/232 is the quickest.... alright i made that up, but its alotta fun

So is it a minor amount of horsepower? or is a like a 10HP gain and minor Torque gain?

[Kenrik]

Forget about anything d!ck says he does not know what the hell he's talking about

[RFcool]

thanks mang!

[Dark-Hawk]

Forget about anything d!ck says he does not know what the hell he's talking about

Agreed. The KA has proven itself to be able to make great power time and time again.

[dickie]

man fizzuk yall!!!1 , his question was is there a noticeable power difference between the s13 and s14 ka, which for his purposes, there isnt. i seriously doubt hes going to be cam-swapping anytime in the near future.

and im not knocking the ka, he said himself he was saving for an sr swap, so why have him waste his money modding the ka when he already has a plan? he will be one of those guys that just sits the sr in his garage because he doesnt have the moneey to install it b/c of all the money he wasted on parts that are non-transferrable. now what bisches?

[DjPantsSpecR]

well....

248/248 makes at most 4 to 5 horse at the wheels, all top end, that is over 240/248, which is stock for s13

248/232 makes 4 ft/lbs over 248/248, however this is based on a fresh alloy dyno chart that is almost impossible to find.

i felt like a fool for having 248/248 when 248/232 felt so much better, and the proven loss is only 1-2 horsepower in the top end over 248/248

both of these swaps are better than 240/248

still havent tried 248/240

240/240 is nice in the automatic, and ive never used 232/232

either or, it still depends on what chassis, but i recommend one s13 exhaust adn one s13 exhaust, or on the real cheap, i would do just s13 cams

but like i said the s14 with an s13 exhaust cam rotated to work on the intake will make more power than an s13 with the same cam swap, it all depends on the platform you are starting from...

sorry this discussion is even still continuing, but i would say for 50 bucks the cam swap is entirely worth it

[dickie]

mine was free, but im thinking that it still wont help him very much.

in order to clarify, i want to ask why does it matter? do you have an s13 engine and youre looking at buying an s14 engine to swap in? do you already have both engines sitting? do you have a shell for an sr you need to get running in the meantime? please elaborate.

[s14 2510's]

I have a s14 ka swaped in a s13 with s13 cams and wiring harness. I have a stage 3 clutch It pulls good to 6.5 then shift. Fun combo so far. It is still slow to me but quickly maxes the speed limiter.

[RFcool]

mine was free, but im thinking that it still wont help him very much.

in order to clarify, i want to ask why does it matter? do you have an s13 engine and youre looking at buying an s14 engine to swap in? do you already have both engines sitting? do you have a shell for an sr you need to get running in the meantime? please elaborate.

Yes I do own an 92 240sx and it has the s13. I was considering getting alittle bit more muscle out of the car by doing a simple ka swap since you can pick them up for only a couple hundred. Thats why the question was asked. I was just curious, but now I know that by throwing s13 cams on an s14 you can get a little more power it is being very much so considered. If yall have anymore input please elaborate.

[DjPantsSpecR]

so you have not much to gain by swapping, unless your current motor is in need of some help.

[RFcool]

yeah there isnt much to gain but I have to do something. Im sitting on 194,000 miles. And Im going to swap to an sr motor like stated but needed something more reliable in the meantime. Iwas hoping to learn about simple bolt on horsepower or possible increased horsepower with newer motor.

[Bigvinnie]

well actually, no thats wrong

an s14 with s13 cams will make the most power

an s13 with s14 cams will make the least power

an s13 with an s14 motor and s13 cams is the same car, and vice versa.

however, a coupe with 248/232 is the quickest.... alright i made that up, but its alotta fun

Correction......The s13KA24de 1991-93 actually makes the most top end power after the removal of the secondary butterfly's (swirl valve's), the engine makes a 6hp gain in top end power. That is alot easier than swapping cams to the 95-98 KA's. OBD1 can utilize the hot cam swap, but can utilize it better with an ecu tune.94-early95 OBD1 production KA's make the least amount of power with less aggressive cams than any of the OBD1.The only thing that makes great midrange power on the OBD 2 s14 KA's is the preatty cheap HOT cam swap. You forgot one minor problem with OBD2 it has a highly restrictive cat after the manifold, and uses 2 sensors. OBD1 is much easier to make power on any level with less smog restrictions.OBD2 ecu's have an advantage to using higher grade fuels more effectively, and a better aggressive ecu tune for stock OEM. That still doesn't mean that the OBD1's can't make more power. Overall it would be a toss up as far as free mods and power level is concerned with the KA. But if it comes to affording bolt ons, OBD1 91-93Ka's all the way IMO.


Modified by Bigvinnie at 9:55 PM 11/25/2005

[DjPantsSpecR]

you're right i made a lot of assumprions i didnt point out when i made those statements

S14 has the advantage in its more aggressive ecu tune, slightly larger MAF, and no swirl control valve

but the cams and exhaust manifold (at least the cat portions) are the clear disadvantage

i agree with if you are affording bolts ons go with 91-93 or early 94, but the later KAs have a slightly greater power potential

but if you are going to do a bunch of stuff anyways it really doesnt matter what platform you start out from, as its best to utilize KA parts from all three generations of KA to make a nice hybrid

89-90 E pistons s13 DE exhaust cam s14 DE exhaust cam, s14 upper intake manifold, s13 exhaust manifold, no fan clutch.

its a nice little set up, and it uses nissan parts. its not gonna break the bank in power,but if you got a lot of KA parts lieing around...

Bigvinnie, i knew about removing the SCV, but only because you told me too a few months back. definately worth it for s13s to swap to an s14 upper intake manifold, but the cam swap is entirely necessary too

[slipnfall]

This is the second time I'v heard about using the S14 intake mani... without lookin at some pictures, are the runners configured differently(ie shorter or different volume)? Would you say this is a worth-while swap to do for an 'DE S13?(considering cost of the mani, how much of a pain it is to get off, etc).

Cheers,'slip

[dickie]

im wondering at this point whether his mention of sr20 swap is serious, or whether its just a possibility hes considered. seriously-- if hes firm about the swap he should save his time and money.

[DjPantsSpecR]

they're identical, the S intake manifolds, the only difference is the absence of the swirl control valve in the S14 upper manifold

if i didnt have an s14 intake manifold lieing around, or two for that matter, i would just pull the secondary butterflies out and seal up the hole where the shaft sits in. the power isnt worth the money a new manifold would cost. plus its all top end, so i hope you have 248/248 or a similar cam swap

i'm all about finding free all motor power, so i say its a worthwhile thing to do. however, ona daily driver the secondary butterflies are nice for the low end, part throttle torque increases

it is a pain to take off too... but ive taken mine off like 14 million times, so its no big dealio... i even make my own gaskets i do it so often

[slipnfall]

Oh is that the only difference? I already removed my butterfly's from my S13. BTW if you don't want to seal up the holes, just do what I did: leave that rod in, and remove the 'flaps' in each runner. They're held on with two philips screws... Sure it's a miniscule restriction in air flow, but nothing you would ever notice.

Jamie

[xTearsFallForeverx]

dont go sr. its a waste in my opinion. if you are looking for 300+ rwhp with an SR, you are going to have to buy everything that you would to make a KA 300+ rwhp + 2500-4000 for an SR swap. Just turbo your KA. Pick you one up for like a hundred bucks, tear it down, build it, and turbo it.

[Bigvinnie]

If you decide to go KA-T remember to get a T28, not the average T25 that comes on the PU$$Y 2.0 litre displacement SR....LOL

[xTearsFallForeverx]

go with a t3/t04e or something such. thats what a lot of ka guys are using.

[RFcool]

About how much of a horsepower increase does a t28 add to a ka motor? That is starting to sound like more cash than what I was wanting to do....However it seems to me that ka motors are more common place than sr motor. But it seems as though right off the bat that the sr motor has more power potential just by find tuning it. So even if I was to get another ka motor and add a couple of "bolt ons" in the near future by the time i did the add ons I would finally reach the power an SR has, correct? Sorry not trying to cause debate but just clarify somethings for myself, Ive read many different topics and that's why I was posting this was to get more info...Thanks for all the advice.

[RFcool]

Bigvinnie,

What in the world is a butterfly swirl valve and is it easy to do what your talking about? also what is an OBD?

[Bigvinnie]

Bigvinnie,

What in the world is a butterfly swirl valve and is it easy to do what your talking about? also what is an OBD?

Go to the search button, type in SCV or secondary butterfly's.

About how much of a horsepower increase does a t28 add to a ka motor?

Can't give you direct HP numbers.The T28 has a larger CFM flow rate than a T25 so during spooling it will run cooler and more efficent than the T25. The displacement of the KA is larger than the SR so it needs a better CFM to make power. T25 is the gayest turbo you can start with for the KA.

[RFcool]

Ill get back to ya Bigvinnie after I search. Thanks

[Reno]

i vote s13 bia