rx7

[franman187]

hey whats up guys i just recently bought an 1991 rx7 fc with 122xxxmiles. Can any one tell me what are some things im going to be expecting from this car?

[themadscientist]

Broken trim pieces and switches all over the interior, rust and electrical problems, oh the electrical problems. When the stars align, though, and the fickle b**** feels like working, it's a unique and rewarding experience. Welcome to the club.



Let's see some pics!

[Bubba1]

Besides the electrical gremlins? oil consumption, less than average gas mileage, and more limited options if you break down, (because not many folks can work on them). With that many miles on it and being 23 years, you might want to find out whether the engine seals were replaced. If they were, chances are you'll be okay. But if they're original, you're on borrowed time for a big expense, (unless your dad knows how to work on rotary engines). If it was a well-maintained, unabused example, and you resist temptation to beat on it showing off for your friends until the motor is completely warmed up, they can be very fun cars.

Good luck.

[Kompresshun]

I enjoyed my 90 Turbo II quite a bit - when it was running right.

The electronics are a common issue on them as mentioned above. The fuel pump relay was an issue on mine. The rear differential support bushing wearing out is a common issue in them. If it's not already shot, it will be. If you hear a knocking near the rear when you shift gears, that will be your culprit.

The engines in them are glorious when they run right, but with that kind of mileage if it's the original engine don't plan on it lasting much longer. Not to disagree with Joel above, but most RX7 owners don't rebuild or replace the seals in rotaries - they replace them because rebuilding them is so complex and annoying that it's just easier to replace it with a reman or used lower mileage motor.

If the engine is on it's last legs, it will be hard to start at times - basically you'll have to start it for a while to get it to fire up. The best way to determine if the engine is going to last for any period of time or not is to do a compression test on it. If each housing is above 100, then you'll likely be fine for a while. If not then don't plan on the motor lasting long.

Rotaries typically don't survive past 70,000-80,000 miles unless properly maintained sadly.

Sorry to be a downer, but an RX7 was probably not the best choice for a reliable daily driver. That being said, they are a blast to drive when they're right and you can have a lot of fun with them.

Good luck!

[WDRacing]

The best thing about rotary motors is that they are pretty light. Making them easier to remove and throw directly into the dumpster.

Unless you really enjoy no low end torque and tons of maintenance. Then by all means keep the rotary in place.

I suggest reading up on all the available swaps. The FC has been around long enough to have quite a following where engine swaps are concerned. There are quite a few 302 swaps running around.

WD

[Kompresshun]

^Agreed. If you want to make it reliable and fun at the same time, I would plan on saving up for an engine swap. A non-turbo rotary is a boat anchor.

The 302(Ford 5.0L V8) is probably the cheapest swap you can do, as the motor was used in a ton of Ford vehicles - 79-95 Ford Mustang, 80's Ford Thundbird/Mercury Cougar, Ford Crown Victoria, Mercury Grand Marquis, Lincoln Town Car, ect, ect, ect. They make decent power in stock form but are very easy to modify and make stupid amounts of power.

Then there's always the small block Chevrolet V8's. They are just as easy to swap in, but personally if it's anything before the LS series motors I prefer the Ford 5.0L instead.

Both are easy to swap in, easy to work on, and easy to find parts for. You can make a quaint 300hp motor for dirt cheap or you can build it into a 500hp+ monster and spend your paycheck on gas, replacing roasted tires, and speeding tickets

[Bubba1]

FWIW, the RX7 owners I know are track guys, (primarily FD's), and they rebuild. Just curious, how much does a remanufactured/used rotary motor typically cost?

[WDRacing]

I would think the track guys stick with the rotary because of the weight distribution. Aside from that, I can't think of any reason to keep the rotary. I have always loved the FD. However, the best FD comes with a LSx attached to a 6 spd. Anything else is just pretty to look at. They sound like crap, they idle like crap, they are broke all the time and if you make any sort of power with them, the transmissions don't seem to hold together either.

The 3 and 4 rotors are decent, but only because they actually make a bit of torque before 5000 rpm.

Rotaries remind me of VTEC motors without the reliability.

There are reasons why the rotary engine doesn't come in any other vehicles. They suck.

[Kompresshun]

FWIW, the RX7 owners I know are track guys, (primarily FD's), and they rebuild. Just curious, how much does a remanufactured/used rotary motor typically cost?

Well first of all, a whole rebuild kit for DIY is around $1,000

Plus it's not as simple to rebuild as a typical engine. From what I understand there are more specialty tools required.

For $1,000 I could pay for a large portion of a V8 swap that will last much much longer.

Looks like a rebuilt rotary is around $1,400-1,700 with a warranty

A used rotary ranges from $500-1,200 depending on condition and where it comes from.

Now considering the people you know are track guys, i'm sure there are reasons they prefer the rotary and they probably have everything on hand to rebuild them with.

I honestly don't know why you'd keep a rotary aside from the ability to rev it high though. Even weight distribution like Brian mentioned shouldn't be a factor. An LS1 weighs about the same as a 13B and the other engine options aren't THAT much more. I've got plenty of friends who have RX7's and have owned a ton of them - they always say the same thing: "The best upgrade I ever made was a V8 swap."

[WDRacing]

"The best upgrade I ever made was a V8 swap."

You can damn near apply that statement across the board.

[Bubba1]

Thing is, swapping a V8 is only an upgrade depending on the model and the owner. There are many that believe it eliminates much of what makes the car special. Since the FD's are the only RX-7's that are destined to become collectible, especially the twin turbos, none of the FD owners I know would do such a swap. Having driven an FD on track, I'd leave it rotary too. They're a hoot. But on a non-collectible FC, well, that's a different story.

But bringing this back to reality and the OP, we're talking about a teen who just bought his first car. I suspect he doesn't have money to blow on a rebuilt motor much less a V8 swap if it turns out he bought one with issues.

[BusyBadger]

[sx moneypit]

[WDRacing]

But bringing this back to reality and the OP, we're talking about a teen who just bought his first car. I suspect he doesn't have money to blow on a rebuilt motor much less a V8 swap if it turns out he bought one with issues.

Did the OP get edited? I don't see anything about a first car and or him being a teen.

[numbnuts240]

what-would-be-a-good-first-car-t583722.html

[WDRacing]

Oh crap.

Hopefully it is a well taken care of example. Otherwise, plan of becoming a really good mechanic. Nothing wrong with that, so long as you know what's coming.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

Just embrace the horror and run a 2 stroke gas mixture haha.

The garage I used to work at had some neighbors that were big into rotaries. It really didn't seem that bad to replace apex seals, just pull all the junk off the front and the triangle just comes out according to them. Then the other triangle is just behind that one. Stack as many triangles as you want for more power. Seemed pretty straightforward to me

[themadscientist]

I enjoy the rotary hate. My GT-R is broken and I am driving to work and picking up parts to fix it in my three years older RX7. Oh the irony.

Rebuilding a rotary is fairly straightforward. It's just so different from a piston engine it can seem difficult. This is all there really is.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijJeUk_GqiI[/youtube]

There are tricks and techniques to learn, but you need to do that for putting together a slug motor too. Most people are inside the box lazy f***, though, and can't or don't want to understand the basics and just badmouth the design to cover it. They peddle that off as a legitimate opinion to people who don't know better which is unfortunate.

I really like rotaries, but I'll tell you straight up, at the risk of drawing unfortunate parallels, rotaries are "lifestyle" engines. Gay jokes aside, owning one forces a fundamental shift in your thinking and adjustments to the way you live. Slug engines are boringly commonplace and considered "normal." You can be anybody with one of those.

If you own a car with the spinny triangles you can expect your engine and you as a person to be treated with disrespect and ridicule as you have already seen above. Your knowledge base will be smaller and populated with a greater percentage of strange folks. Something is a little different in the heads of rotary lovers, sometimes it's a lot different. Being automotive outcasts, rotary folks tend to stick together a bit more, but there are the alpha ***holes in that camp as well.

You will often be on your own when trouble arises and it will. It's a machine and machines fail. Despite what the slug runners would have you believe, their beloved engines blow up too. Break it to them easy, though; they are really defensive and pathetic about it. "They blow apex seals!" Yes, they do. It looks like this.



It usually damages the rotors and housings. Guess what causes that? Detonation. Luckily piston engines can run just fine with detonation. Wait, no they don't. They blow their "apex seals" too. It looks like this.



It will usually damage the block and sometimes the cylinder head, BUT there may be some meat in the cylinders that will allow you to overbore the damage away, a definite good thing. Rotary housings have much less meat to play with.

"They are too thirsty!" This depends on you. Rotaries are not so efficient with their use of fuel. They drink like Irishmen no two ways about it. This will either be a deal breaker for you or it won't, but it will certainly impact your life to a degree. If it's too much, it's just too much. Be honest with yourself and you won't be sad either way.

"They are unreliable!" You know, let me tell you a little story about turbos. In the 80's Nissan had several turbo cars in the lineup and so did other manufacturers. Older more in the know guys, GREG, weigh in on this. The prevailing "wisdom" was turbo cars were unreliable. They were, but why? People weren't taking care of them and they were locking up and blowing up. It wasn't the turbos' fault, it was the users'. Ever wonder why the 240 came with a KA24 and not a CA18 or SR20? Nissan probably thought it wouldn't sell in the states with a turbo engine after a decade of Americans bitching about the unreliability of machinery they were abusing. Same thing with the rotary.

Typical piston engine conventional "wisdom" will kill a rotary. These things operate more like a two stroke motor than a piston engine. They burn oil and gas and have no valvetrain. Porting lubrication techniques are very similar. It stands to reason that my love of rotaries and 2 stroke bikes are very similarly motivated, simplicity and peaky power. 2 smokes are also lifestyle motors. You either like it or you don't. You can either keep it running or you can't. Some can, some can't. If you are one, but trying to live like you are the other you will be unhappy.

I don't get the swaps. I think the rotary folks get their panties bunched up a bit too much when somebody pulls a rotary in favor of a slug motor, but try sticking a 13B into a 240 and watch those guys whine like bishez. It's their cars, they should express themselves any way they see fit and so should you.

I hope you don't have any major drama with it, but realize you likely will. It's like going out with a crazy chick. Sure, the sex can be great, but she might stab you in your sleep.

[franman187]

yea thanks themadscientist im already liking the rotary engine and the guy who sold it to me is a family friend who says hes willing to help me with it. the only thing is idk how often im supposed to change the oil or how long I should keep it idling??

[themadscientist]

Regular oil changes like any car are in order. Remember, though, that the rotary injects oil into the rotor housing where it burns with the gas so don't use synthetic. Use the cleanest burning dino juice you can. I actually premix 2 stroke oil in my gas on top of the oil that is injected, but that is a heated debate with rotary guys. II would say do your own research on that.

As far as idling, the engine has a wax thermopellet that cuts oil delivery to, I think it's the back rotor to speed warmup. This is another big fight in the rotary community. Some say that's a bad thing, some say it's fine and even beneficial. I think the majority of people on both sides would agree that whenever possible let the engine get up to operating temperature before driving. Any engine would appreciate that, though; it's not a "rotary thing."

[MinisterofDOOM]

"The best upgrade I ever made was a V8 swap."

You can damn near apply that statement across the board.

Unless you plan ahead and buy something that CAME with the right engine in the first place.

Of course, then there's always boost.

[themadscientist]

[franman187]

aight thanks bro your really helping me out !!

[Kompresshun]

Unless you plan ahead and buy something that CAME with the right engine in the first place.

I did - multiple times. 5 times to be exact

Don't get me wrong though - I don't think I could own a V8 swapped RX7 without having a rotary powered one parked in the driveway too. I would feel wrong about it, because contrary to my comments above I am a purist when it comes to an RX7 and I love the quirks of them. I just had my last one at a time in my life that I couldn't really care for it properly. I fully intend to have another FC Turbo II at some point

Of course the next project on the list after I finish the Miata is hunting down a Volvo 240, 740, or 960 wagon and V8 swapping it. Preferably with a lightly modded 5.0L V8 backed by a 5spd.

[themadscientist]

weld up the back doors and panel the windows up and make it a hearse!

[Bubba1]

weld up the back doors and panel the windows up and make it a hearse!

Actually you guys are not going back far enough. The best Volvo wagon hands down is the P1800. Gorgeous, handles well, well made, and is going up in value.

[WDRacing]

Of course the next project on the list after I finish the Miata is hunting down a Volvo 240, 740, or 960 wagon and V8 swapping it. Preferably with a lightly modded 5.0L V8 backed by a 5spd.

I think I'd rather have the Buick Roadmaster myself. Came with the Lt1 and my kids would love the rear facing seat in the back.

[numbnuts240]

being a kid in rear facing seats is awesome. endless opportunities to mess with people behind the vehicle without your parents "seeing" what you're doing.

[WDRacing]

Agreed. My Grandmother had an old wagon with the rear seat, I always thought it was awesome back there.

[themadscientist]

Remember the crazy long side hinged doors on some of those station wagons?

My mom had a Plymouth Volare station wagon with a 318 V8. The car had some pickup!