after a rough idle developed on my wife's 1990 240sx I came here and got advice on cleaning the throttle body and air intake box. After my cleaning the problem continued so I dropped it at the dealership for a check up.
The tech's at the dealer want me to pay $800 to replace all fuel injectors and patch everything up but I still think its a air temp sensor or emissions sensor causing the problem. They also told me the injectors were leaking (all of them) and that they hadn't seen that on a 240 before.
so who's crazy here??? could all 4 injectors go at the same time or is somebody financing their Christmas on my dollar???
opinions appreciated....
rough idle 1990 240sx
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bruinbear714
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Re: rough idle 1990 240sx
1990-SX wrote:after a rough idle developed on my wife's 1990 240sx I came here and got advice on cleaning the throttle body and air intake box. After my cleaning the problem continued so I dropped it at the dealership for a check up.
The tech's at the dealer want me to pay $800 to replace all fuel injectors and patch everything up but I still think its a air temp sensor or emissions sensor causing the problem. They also told me the injectors were leaking (all of them) and that they hadn't seen that on a 240 before.
so who's crazy here??? could all 4 injectors go at the same time or is somebody financing their Christmas on my dollar???
opinions appreciated....
Sounds like :bsflag :bsface to me. Try cleaning out your idle air valve in the rear of the intake manifold. While your at that, re-adjust your idle screw also. Does your car drink up gas? Do you smell gas in your engine compartment? If no, then your injectors are fine. Also replace your fuel filter.
I never have smelled fuel in or on it, mileage is the same its always been. The car only has 80k miles on it and the problem is only at idle, no stumbling under acceleration.
The techs also told me the only had one guy that was qualified to replace the injectors and he would have to heat shrink the wires to the new injectors:rolleyes what-ever, I picked the car up at lunch and paid $30.00 to get the hell outta there.
I guess I'll fix it my dayum self:moon
The techs also told me the only had one guy that was qualified to replace the injectors and he would have to heat shrink the wires to the new injectors:rolleyes what-ever, I picked the car up at lunch and paid $30.00 to get the hell outta there.
I guess I'll fix it my dayum self:moon
To check your injectors, while the car is running, gently push the electrical connector at each injector and see if fuel leaks out. If no, then they are ok and your problem is elsewhere. But he is right, if he was changing the injectors, the dealership usually replaces the engine wiring harness along with it. I got raped the first year i had my car (1994) by paying someone to do all that. Came out to over $1400!! O well, live and learn.
o.k. now I undertand what he meant when he said they were leaking, that must be how he tested them. They were going to heat shrink the connections so I didn't have to buy another harness but still......$800 for 4 fuel injectors??? dayum, I still can't believe all of them are bad. I guess I'll drive it till it breaks:ylsuper
RATS ***!!!!
The new injectors are in and it still runs like pure crap:(
Nissan wants $488.00 for a new MAS mass airflow sensor (the techs tell me this will fix it) does anybody make an aftermarket MAS for my 1990 240sx???????
I have attempted to use 2 different used MAS units but the dealer says they are bad and they want me to buy a new one:help
The new injectors are in and it still runs like pure crap:(
Nissan wants $488.00 for a new MAS mass airflow sensor (the techs tell me this will fix it) does anybody make an aftermarket MAS for my 1990 240sx???????
I have attempted to use 2 different used MAS units but the dealer says they are bad and they want me to buy a new one:help
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bruinbear714
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1990-SX wrote:RATS ***!!!!
The new injectors are in and it still runs like pure crap:(
Nissan wants $488.00 for a new MAS mass airflow sensor (the techs tell me this will fix it) does anybody make an aftermarket MAS for my 1990 240sx???????
I have attempted to use 2 different used MAS units but the dealer says they are bad and they want me to buy a new one:help
Wow, this post has been revived from the dead...
1990-Sx, did you not see my BS flag?
$488 for a mass air flow sensor is EVEN MORE BS than $800 for fuel injectors. They're just stringing you with bait to see how far they can reel you.
Ask them how much it cost just for the sensor itself. Then ask them how much it cost for labor. Then go take apart your MAF sensor and see how long it takes.
If they are so sure a new MAF will fix it, tell them if it DOESN'T fix the car, then you're not going to pay and get that IN WRITING. Simple as that. If they don't agree, then they're just talking out of their a$$.
I would check:
1) check the basics... spark plugs, distributor rotor, timing, wires, and make sure the engine is running on 4 cylinders, not 3.
2) vacuum lines going to charcoal caniser and gas tank. Open the cap on your gas tank, does it suck air in (vacuum present)? If not, then that will be one of the problems contributing to your rough idle.
3) Check your idle air valve and clean it. its located in the rear of the intake manifold by the idle screw. Also check the vacuum going to it.
4) Clean your throttle body.
Don't get shafted by the dealer again, especially with this $488 MAFS bullsh!t. Ask around at different dealers for pricing on the MAFS and do it yourself!
:pface
The dealer has inspired me to do things a little differently, I bought Venom injectors for $250 (V/s $130 ea. at the dealer) then I had them installed, plugs changed, throttle body cleaned, wires and dist. checked for about $80 by a friend that is a Toyota ASE mechanic.
After everything was finished, the Toy guy called me and said he hated to tell me too.......but he couldn't troubleshoot the problem and the rough idle was still there (its gotten worse) so I caved and went back to the dealer for diagnosis. I have taken them 2 different used MAS units and they tell me the units are bad.
I have not been raped........YET but they are trying very, very hard. The car has been at the dealer for 3 weeks now and the wife (it's actually her daily driver) is not very amused:mad: I have discussed all the components and methods we have been discussing here with the Tech at the delaership and he swears its still the MAS causing all the problems.
I'm getting on the phone now with a competent Nissan shop about an hour away.
The dealer has inspired me to do things a little differently, I bought Venom injectors for $250 (V/s $130 ea. at the dealer) then I had them installed, plugs changed, throttle body cleaned, wires and dist. checked for about $80 by a friend that is a Toyota ASE mechanic.
After everything was finished, the Toy guy called me and said he hated to tell me too.......but he couldn't troubleshoot the problem and the rough idle was still there (its gotten worse) so I caved and went back to the dealer for diagnosis. I have taken them 2 different used MAS units and they tell me the units are bad.
I have not been raped........YET but they are trying very, very hard. The car has been at the dealer for 3 weeks now and the wife (it's actually her daily driver) is not very amused:mad: I have discussed all the components and methods we have been discussing here with the Tech at the delaership and he swears its still the MAS causing all the problems.
I'm getting on the phone now with a competent Nissan shop about an hour away.
Jesus H. Christ
sorry for the Blasphemy:icesangel I called around and found the part for $463 (about $20 cheaper) and one of the other shops told me just what you said "if we install the part and it didn't fix it, its our fault and you wouldn't be charged"
So I called the Dealer to see if the latest used MAS worked and the tech thats working on my car is gone till Monday (he was supposed to call me) and the service manager has no idea if he's done or if my MAS worked. So once again I wait for somebody that knows **** from shinola to get off their fat arses and fix my freakin carAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
sorry for the Blasphemy:icesangel I called around and found the part for $463 (about $20 cheaper) and one of the other shops told me just what you said "if we install the part and it didn't fix it, its our fault and you wouldn't be charged"
So I called the Dealer to see if the latest used MAS worked and the tech thats working on my car is gone till Monday (he was supposed to call me) and the service manager has no idea if he's done or if my MAS worked. So once again I wait for somebody that knows **** from shinola to get off their fat arses and fix my freakin carAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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bruinbear714
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Changing a MAF sensor takes less than 5 minutes. It's not like replacing clutch where you have to burn-in for 500 miles. It's an immediate response sort of fix, where you replace it and will KNOW immediately if it was the problem.
Anyways, check #2 on my previous post, and then check #3.
If there's no vacuum in your tank when you open up your cap then you will get a rough idle.
Anyways, check #2 on my previous post, and then check #3.
If there's no vacuum in your tank when you open up your cap then you will get a rough idle.
you need to break down and buy a factory service manual, this is the holy grail to 240 repair. Nissan did a great job putting together a manual to troubleshoot anything wrong with the car. it has pages and pages of diagnostics you can do to eliminate the possibility of issues. You will need a multimeter and some patients, but it could save you a few grand.
Whatever you decide to do, find another dealer or shop to work from, the service you are discribing is very poor and it sounds like the tech doesnt know what he is doing. Besides, if they only have one person who can do it thats lame (and a bit sad)
Whatever you decide to do, find another dealer or shop to work from, the service you are discribing is very poor and it sounds like the tech doesnt know what he is doing. Besides, if they only have one person who can do it thats lame (and a bit sad)
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bruinbear714
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1990-SX wrote:yes, he is the ONLY one at my local dealership that is certified and as you can tell 3 weeks is not acceptable. I am tempted to go get the car today..............I know better than to trust the yahoos:mad: this is really my fault.
Yes, do that and save yourself the money... From the way you described their service, your better off asking for help on this forum, that is if your mechanically inclined to work on your car.
Truth is I'm a Landcruiser guy, I have had to learn to work on them myself from a similar expensive lesson I learned from my Toyota "SERVICE DEPARTMENT" what a joke.
hell, I can throw money at it and plug in parts till it works just as good as they can. When all this started, I thought a quick diagnosis and MAS would fix it. The fuel injectors were probably o.k. and I've wasted time and money litening to the "EXPERTS" AND GETTING CRAPPY SERVICE.
MAN AM I STEAMIN OVER HERE:mad:
hell, I can throw money at it and plug in parts till it works just as good as they can. When all this started, I thought a quick diagnosis and MAS would fix it. The fuel injectors were probably o.k. and I've wasted time and money litening to the "EXPERTS" AND GETTING CRAPPY SERVICE.
MAN AM I STEAMIN OVER HERE:mad:
It might be hard to do and time consuming. But I really suggest getting an FSM and trying to service it yourself. Worst case it will give you better insight into what and why things go wrong and what components contribute to it.
Look on ebay for a factory service manual for your year 240, shouldnt be more than 50 bucks....
good luck!!
If you have specific questions about testing a component, chances are the info is in this forum somewhere, just poke around a little.
Look on ebay for a factory service manual for your year 240, shouldnt be more than 50 bucks....
good luck!!
If you have specific questions about testing a component, chances are the info is in this forum somewhere, just poke around a little.
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bruinbear714
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Before you go and spend another dime on parts and service, please check #2 and #3, repeated here for your convenience:
2) vacuum lines going to charcoal caniser and gas tank. Open the cap on your gas tank, does it suck air in (vacuum present)? If not, then that will be one of the problems contributing to your rough idle.
3) Check your idle air valve and clean it. its located in the rear of the intake manifold by the idle screw. Also check the vacuum going to it.
Its free and takes up only a couple hours (if that) of your time.
2) vacuum lines going to charcoal caniser and gas tank. Open the cap on your gas tank, does it suck air in (vacuum present)? If not, then that will be one of the problems contributing to your rough idle.
3) Check your idle air valve and clean it. its located in the rear of the intake manifold by the idle screw. Also check the vacuum going to it.
Its free and takes up only a couple hours (if that) of your time.
EGR VALVE!!!!!! I changed so much crap on my car, and nothing fixed, I finally went out on a friends word, and disconnect & Plugged the vacuum line on the EGR valve, so far my rough idle has VANISHED!! I've spent $80-$100 trying to figure it out, with an O2 sensor and cap & Rotor, well, teh cap/rotor was good for tha sake of having new ones, my old one was ****, and the O2 sensor on my car was probably getting ready to leave me since I have a '93 240sx and it still ahd the original O2 sensor
Anyway, It's really hard to explain where the EGR valve is, so maybe someone can do it better than me, or you can just get the FSM everyones talking about
I hope that helps, it seems to have helped me,
Anyway, It's really hard to explain where the EGR valve is, so maybe someone can do it better than me, or you can just get the FSM everyones talking about
I hope that helps, it seems to have helped me,