Restrictions on welfare

[480sx]

Im not really the biggest fan of welfare.. But since its a system we have intact and with BO soon to be our president i have a simple request.

Mandatory drug tests for Welfare recipients!

[marlin29311]

Haha, I actually like the idea. I know there are some people that really need welfare, but I still believe that people really need to stop abusing the system. Guarantee that someone cries illegal and it never works though.

[HashiriyaS14]

I absolutely agree with this.

I'd love to eliminate welfare altogether, but doing so presents any number of social problems.

It isn't the able-bodied adults that I worry about, it's the families with one mom, no dad, and six kids.

Granted, 99% of these women never should have had six kids to begin with, but unfortunately they have them now and you can't very well let a five year old starve, so that's my major conundrum. I really don't have an answer to this problem, but I'd love to hear suggestions.

Anyone without underage dependents or without any disabilities should be taken off welfare immediately.

[themadscientist]

roads need buildin, bridges need fixin, fences need buildin, get a friggin job.

[audtatious]

Mandate 40 hours of community service each week for welfare or for actual job interviews (time to be subtracted from community service).

[Sil240]

I definetly agree with the drug test and putting them to work.Instead of just taking taking taking from the system.

They should not be allowed to have ANY more kids once your on welfare.If you can't support yourself, why the F&(*% are you bringing more kids into this world?

There's too many people on welfare and not striving to get out.

Everyone falls down and needs some help once in a while, but it should not be a lifestyle.It should be a band-aid.

[marlin29311]

I definetly agree with the drug test and putting them to work.Instead of just taking taking taking from the system.

They should not be allowed to have ANY more kids once your on welfare.If you can't support yourself, why the F&(*% are you bringing more kids into this world?

There's too many people on welfare and not striving to get out.

Everyone falls down and needs some help once in a while, but it should not be a lifestyle.It should be a band-aid.

Free condoms for those on welfare!

[WDRacing]

Condoms are already free from literally hundreds of places.

Drug tests would be a huge plus IMO. Coming from me that says a lot, cause I think everyone should smoke marijuana. But I also know that there's a huger difference between someone like myself that works 40+hrs a week and enjoys a toke on the weekends vs the lazy SOB that spends his welfare checks on Ramen and Meth.

I also agree with Hash, no handicap or underage dependants, no check. Sorry, life's a *****, get out and DO SOMETHING. We have programs to help people, I'd rather spend money on those then simply giving it away to lazy people.

[HashiriyaS14]

Drug tests would be a huge plus IMO. Coming from me that says a lot, cause I think everyone should smoke marijuana.

Yeah, even if marijuana was legalized, I wouldn't want welfare recipients to have it in their system. If you're spending money on weed, even if it's legal, you need to NOT be on the government dime.

I'd still like there to be NO government dime, but as I said, with little kids, that's real tough. I still can't think of a solution to that one. Anyone got any thoughts?

Maybe the solution is to sterilize anyone with an IQ lower than 110 or so at birth, lawlz. I'm kidding of course, but I'm only kidding because it would be undue government intervention in private lives.

[OriginalWheelman]

Mandatory drug tests for Welfare recipients!

Cut. Print. Make it a law. I think we can *gasp* get both sides to agree on this.

Granted, 99% of these women never should have had six kids to begin with, but unfortunately they have them now and you can't very well let a five year old starve, so that's my major conundrum. I really don't have an answer to this probem, but I'd love to hear suggestions.

Well I met a smart girl from the city. She was nice and she worked in the kiosk in from of the store I worked at so we used to talk when it was slow. I asked her what her long term plans were, and I was shocked at the answer. Her plan was to have 9 kids with different fathers and live off welfare! I did not believe she was serious, and laughed. She promptly pointed out she was serious, then went into a 15 minute explanation of ALL THE MATH! She knew exactly how much she was going to get from each child, what it would cost to raise them, and explained that having 9 of them with different, intentionally absent fathers would allow her to get enough and consolidate bills enough to come out a couple hundred ahead each month! I was so appalled I walked away and never spoke to her again.

[HashiriyaS14]

Cut. Print. Make it a law. I think we can *gasp* get both sides to agree on this.

You'd be surprised. Many on the FAR left wouldn't support such an initiative, even though it makes unassailable sense.

Few elected officials would disagree, but many represent constituencies that would disagree. They just don't want anything standing between a person and their welfare check, it would seem.

It's horrendously misguided and it's the worst kind of entitlement.

Luckily, I think those who would disagree would be in a small minority, and there may well be some hope of it passing. It would be an easy bipartisan "slam dunk" for Obama to support something like this, IMO, and I think he's bright enough to see that.

[480sx]

Mandate 40 hours of community service each week for welfare or for actual job interviews

I agree with that, maybe not so much community service, but at least 15 hours a week for every week your on welfare. If you dont get 30 hours in two weeks, your off the welfare list. This is good for the individual and good for the rest of us. I dont care who you are or what your problems are, you need to be working.

I think there would be an overwhelming amount of support for this across the board and it would have no problem passing. The biggest downside would be the cost of implementation though. I still think it would be worth it, and be good for pretty much everyone.

I dont think there should be any welfare for anyone with an able mind and body. Or maybe there should be but it should be limited.. Like idk say, no more than 6 months on govt dime every 3-5 years. Honestly, IMO your not doing the individual any favors by giving him money all the time so he doesnt have to work.

[OriginalWheelman]

Good point. Let's add the stipulation that if you don't pay taxes you don't get to vote. Problem solved.

[mattblancarte]

I absolutely agree with some of the major ideas in this thread. No drugs, minimum labor requirements, I'd say even some form of education requirements (must attend G.E.D. training classes).

Beggars can't be choosers. We should be telling these people EXACTLY what to do with our money.

[HashiriyaS14]

Mandate 40 hours of community service each week for welfare or for actual job interviews (time to be subtracted from community service).

A community service requirement for welfare is a *really* good idea.

Maybe we should start a think tank, lol.

While Wheelman's idea of "no pay taxes, no vote" probably wouldn't work because it would change depending on changes to the tax policy (i.e. under Obama plan, thousands of seniors will now owe no tax legitimately, and this could change every 4-8 years. You don't want people's voting eligibility going away through no action of their own), I DO think that people on welfare shouldn't be able to vote.

Voting should be limited to those who are contributing TO the nation, not collecting from it. Once you get off the government tit, you regain your right to vote.

Frankly, I think there should be some other restrictions on voting also. It should require a separate test that you take and pass at 18 and then each decade, demonstrating basic knowledge of how the US Government works. There are people voting for President who don't even understand what the President does versus the Congress or the Supreme Court. It's an utter disgrace.

[OriginalWheelman]

Well obviously we can't shut out people who have contributed to the county their entire lives. More over housewives / househusbands would be excluded if it were black and white like that. It was meant as a general concept. That way, the working welfare recipients can vote. Basically, if you work you pay taxes. If you are a homemaker obviously someone is earning the money to pay for the home, etc. Non working college students, disabled, there are lots of exceptions. A black and white law is seldom possible. Basically if you belong to a household that pays taxes you get to vote. I believe an age restriction to this limit would be fair. So for one to belong to a household that pays taxes, you will be less likely to get welfare. See how this works?

[Urabus GodofTraction]

workfare is a great idea!

And make the work so ****ty they'll never want to be on it again. 14 hour days of sorting recycling? Yeah, enjoy that.

This will, of course, make the lazy resort to stealing. That's why we totally legalize open and concealed carry. Then you'll have 4 choices:Find a better job that the g'bmentGet your *** worked offSteal and die.Starve and die.

I'm totally down for government employment as long as it's efficient (which it will never be...)

[WDRacing]

Hash, put this into a talking point and fwd it to everyone that can write a letter. I'll fwd it to my Senator/Governor/Pres once a month. In fact, my whole family will in all the various states they live in...EVEN better, I'll send it to everyone I know in the Military and they can fwd it on.

In reality we all know one thing. The Gov is never going to really change unless WE make it change. This idea crosses all lines and makes 100% sense. It's fiscally responsible, easily implemented, and easily controlled. Hell, we can staff it with people ON welfare.

Seriously, lets work this into a feasible plan and FORCE into action.

[HashiriyaS14]

Basically if you belong to a household that pays taxes you get to vote.

I was just trying to illustrate that not everyone who works necessarily pays taxes.

In some tax brackets, for some individuals in certain circumstances, they are given deductions and such that totally eliminate their tax obligations so that they pay nothing.

I guess maybe you could do it via people who FILE though, that might work, as if you earn an income, even if you owe no actual tax, you still have to file.

But then again, I think people on welfare still have to file, so I'm not certain that would work either.

I get your gist, I'm just trying to work out the particulars.

[Sil240]

I'm totally with the Community Service, Drug Test and the GED classes.

But the no voting thing is very iffy.....On one hand I'm for it, cause if your not doing anything and just taking then you are just a leach. (that is if your able to work and think etc....)I think if you are on welfare and doing community service then you should be able to vote. If you do NOTHING, (and are able) then you GET NOTHING.But disabled, elderly etc... people who cannot do for themselves should still be represented.

I agree we should put something together and send it out.

[WDRacing]

Can't remove the right to vote. That's just something I can't agree with.

[wingFeather]

Yeah, even if marijuana was legalized, I wouldn't want welfare recipients to have it in their system. If you're spending money on weed, even if it's legal, you need to NOT be on the government dime.

I'd still like there to be NO government dime.

I have new-found respect for you

[Urabus GodofTraction]

Can't remove the right to vote. That's just something I can't agree with.

All talk of tests, etc for polls has already been tried. I'm thinking they've been called racist/unconstitutional, etc, lol.

[OriginalWheelman]

Yeah I understand a lot of people don't actually "pay" taxes. I've fallen into that bracket myself for a year or two when I was younger. IIRC, You don't have to file taxes if you make less than $2000 a year, so you can still work and not even file. I'd say anyone over 50, legally disabled, or anyone with a W2/1099 and their dependents.

Can't remove the right to vote. That's just something I can't agree with.

Convicted felons already lose the right to vote. We've had numerous laws over the years over who can and can not vote, some less enlightened than others. At least this one has a valid purpose.

[WDRacing]

Convicted felons already lose the right to vote. We've had numerous laws over the years over who can and can not vote, some less enlightened than others. At least this one has a valid purpose.

Convicted Felons break a major law, hence the felony...no brainer dude, can't compare the two.

It's a Constitutional right to vote, you can't just remove something like this in order to enforce a side agenda. If you ever want actual Welfare reform it would have to be considered fair by the majority. I can tell you right now, they won't ever pass something that says a person can't vote while on Welfare.

Consider this, the Gov in place at the time has put our Nation in a horrible recession. Causing many normally hard working families to become recipients of Welfare. Do they now lose the right to elect an official that can better their situation?

I'd never back something like this...it's shallow. There are far better ways, that don't involve stripping a persons rights, to get people off the couch and out improving their situation.

We need to remember, NOT ALL WELFARE recipients are lazy SOBs. So you can't make blanket regulations just because SOME are.

WD

[OriginalWheelman]

It's a Constitutional right to vote, you can't just remove something like this in order to enforce a side agenda.

I've read the constitution, and I don't recall it being in there. Prove me wrong if I am. I realize that not all people on welfare are lazy SOBs, hence the working stipulation, etc. I understand how you feel about the right to vote, and honestly, I don't believe this would ever get passed either. However it is what I would like to see. IF the majority agrees with me, then it's law, if not, I concede to the majority and agree to be governed as they see fit. That's how democracy works. (for better or worse)

*Side note*I think this is the inherent flaw in Democracy, the majority rules. IT kind of flies in the face of the philosophy "What is right is not always popular and what is popular is not always right."

[WDRacing]

So the less fortunate don't get the right to Vote...that's fair to you? I'm fairly Conservative and that makes me wanna throw up. But to each his own.

BTW, Article 24http://www.law.cornell.edu/con....html

[OriginalWheelman]

So the less fortunate don't get the right to Vote...that's fair to you? I'm fairly Conservative and that makes me wanna throw up. But to each his own.

BTW, Article 24http://www.law.cornell.edu/con....html

Hmm. Looks like it doesn't fly. I suppose this argument is as old as the constitution if it was right in there eh? Thanks.

[480sx]

Im all for kicking around a draft of a proposal for new legislation between us. I think its a great idea that would fit right into an Obama presidency. Also think that it would please a majority on both sides, and has a good chance of being passed.

[Cali 2 Balti G]

Welfare recipients do pay taxes - they pay sales tax on the items they buy. In the process these consumers help the economy - because they buy items from a store etc. so that businesses stay in business. This is why this talk of redistribution is a bit of a stretch.

Another example where the benefactor may not be obvious to everyone is - Food Stamp programs. Besides low income individuals and families, food stamp programs subsidize the farming and agricultural industry. It helps to create a demand for the goods farmers produce.