Reseal or Swap?

[ChuckSway]

Was good Nico club. First post here or to any other forum ever. Need some words of advice. Note: I'm not the most mechanically inclined but I get the gist. My current problem is with my beloved 93 2+2 NA that I've had running smoothly just about the whole time I've owned it for the last almost 3 years. Things have gone out along the way like the MAF and the driveshaft but they've been replaced and back on the road. Currently, however, the engine is leaking and I took it into my mechanic and he laid it on me straight that it needs a complete reseal due to no one area of leakage. He quoted me 3k for the work but I withdrew for the time being. The alternator was just also recently replaced because something leaked on it over time (has yet to be fully diagnosed but my money is on the power steering). So my question is if it would be more cost effective to buy an engine from a yard, which ranges from 450-1100 in my neck of the woods, and perform a swap with a buddy of mine? Or fork out the 3k to have it done professionally? OR have my buddy help me with the reseal? My buddy is a bit more inclined than I am. I should also mention that the odo is sitting at about 170k at this point as it sits in my driveway. Thanks y'all

[nissanfreak12]

Reseal, because either way you need to reseal the "new" engine and who is to say that engine is in better shape than yours.

I would honestly pull your engine, get a 120k kit(cause you are close to 180k, unless done in a reasonable time. rear main seal, and a complete gasket kit, and reseal it yourself. BTW, dont go cheap on the seals, get oem. Cheap ones will leak, ask me how I know.

Pulling the engine will be the easiest to do everything, the oil pan is a PITA when in the car, but can be done. May as well get new mounts as well, do the coolant hoses or even the delete, EGR delete, etc.

[DCaff300ZX]

^^^^Extra, EXTRA good advice here...man knows what he's talking about.
Our engines require good seals for best operation and obviously keeping oil in them, and unfortunately it's a tough job to haul the beast out and re-seal it completely, hence the cost. $3K if with OEM everything except some upgrades for the 120K is a pretty fair bid actually, given the time and hassle...

[MrFeesLaw]

$3000!? Not sure what prices are like where you guys are, but that's more than I have into my Z, even with aftermarket parts. Pulling the engine, redoing all the seals, and gaskets, and putting the engine back in, then test driving and double checking work couldn't possibly be more than 10-12 hours in a shop. Assuming $100 per hour in labor you are looking at $1000. I bet you can get a kit with all seals and gaskets for under $100. Assume they run in to some hang-ups and they charge you a little extra for parts and you would still not even be touching $1500. Someone is trying to rob you.

(Again, shop prices may vary where I'm at since we have a ton of shops and every person in town has mechanical experience)

Like Nissanfreak12 said, if you have any inclination towards automotive work, pull your own engine and replace all the seals yourself. Or even if you have some buddies or family that know what they are doing, buy them some burgers and beer and grill out for them while they do it for you, you will save tons of money and you can make sure that everything is done right, as well as throwing in some other maintenance items while you have the engine out. I have been a technician for years and I HATE to see people ripped off. According to my labor sheet this is a 15 hour job AT MOST! And that is only after you basically tear the engine down to nuts and bolts and measure everything before reassembly, and I guarantee no shop would ever do this, because if they needed to, they would just tell you that you needed a new engine so they could avoid the work. Buying a new engine will not be cheaper, and you never know what is wrong with it. If your engine runs good, fix it. You will be much happier and feel much more comfortable with your engine that already runs good being back in working order.

Sorry for writing a book. I get frustrated when I feel people are being ripped off.

[NolimitZ32]

Working like a raped ape on cocaine just pulling the engine will take 4 hours and that's if everything comes apart as it should (not likely on a 20+ year old car). $3k is about right from a reputable trustworthy Z mechanic/builder. Additionally the OEM reseal kit is $250 and the 120k timing belt kit is $490. Adds up quick.

[MrFeesLaw]

^^^^Just looked up the timing belt kit. Found some places you can get it a little cheaper than that, but not by much. Guess I didn't know that there were so many pulleys and gaskets that needed replacing. Most of the cars I work on you just need the belt itself and the timing cover gasket. Ends up being like $30-$80. Not sure why so much needs replacing on the Z, but better to do it than to risk losing an engine. I guess I really don't know what a reseal kit costs, because I've never had to get one.

I still feel that $3k is a bit much, but as I said before, prices are really cheap for labor where I am. My shop only charges $80 per hour. To get to $3000, you would need to rack up about 30 hours in labor with the parts prices that NoLimit mentioned. CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH: This is only accurate information where I live! lol. Shop prices where you guys are I'm sure are slightly higher (To be honest the quality of work at the shops you guys are talking about is probably higher than the quality of work here. No one knows anything about working on classic JDM cars around here. All the hype is in motorcycles, but I can't really expect much else living within a couple hours drive of Sturgis, South Dakota).

[nissanfreak12]

Remember we also talked about a reputable nissan(Z) shop. Just having anyone work on these cars could very well be detrimental. All OEM stuff

Properly re-building the Z, lets take your 80/hr in consideration

Min 15 hours to pull, take apart for timing, heads, crank, block, etc $1200
120K timing $490
Engine Hone deep clean $300
Heads only resurfaced $150
Reseal kit $250
Rings, bearings, etc $120
Fluids $100
Shop fees $50
Taxes (being generous because states diff) $60
Spark plugs $50 ish


This alone is $2770, this doesnt include if they charge extra to install timing belt, time the car, anything with the clutch, if the mounts are shot, hoses went bad(bypass hoses), under plenum hoses, if valves are bad, guides are bad, cranks haft needs grinded, head bolts, etc.

Personally 15 hours, that is not enough time to rebuild an engine with taking it out and reinstall, I think it should be closer to 20-25. So 3k is very conservative number, some can get it done cheaper some will be more expensive. I think if you went to Pitstop in phx, which specializes in Z's, they quote a rebuild close to 5k with install. I talked to them a lot, they charge I think 120/hr.

You can go cheaper on parts, but don't. They don't last as long, cause issues, and sometimes do not fit. Timing stuff is the worst to go cheap on, that s the heart of the car, that is what keeps it going.

[MrFeesLaw]

^^^ All that work would definately be worth some extra money, but again, most shops would pull the engine apart, put new seals in it, and slap it back together. Maybe put a new timing belt on, but there aren't Z shops where I live, so they wouldn't think to do anything with the heads, or new pulleys or any of that maintenance to help the longevity of the engine. It would definitely be worth the extra money to have all this done, but I was thinking just to pull the engine, throw the seals in and reinstall the engine. 15 hours plus some oem seals. No pulleys, not engine cleaning. Just pull and replace what isn't working.

That being said, all of those things would definitely be worth the extra money to have done on ANY car that you care about. And if you happen to live near a Z shop that performs these rebuilds weekly and really knows their stuff then it would be well worth the money. But the way I understood it at the beginning of the conversation was that we were doing the bare minimum for $3000. ChuckSway, the author of the post, simply said that his mechanic quoted him $3000 for a reseal. He didn't specify whether this was a specialty shop, or whether anything else would be done besides the reseal. In which case, I took the post at face-value of a simple reseal for $3000, which would be outrageous! But if we are talking a specialty shop doing all the recommended maintenance and refurbishing all the internals then we start talking about the kinds of things that cost $3000 and up.

[nissanfreak12]

I think I got off track, I honestly thought we were talking about a rebuild. Duh, read the post, lol. So, after rereading it again, I have to agree maybe 3k might be excessive, but again he may be stuck where there is a shop that charges an arm and a leg for stuff. Anyway you look at it, that is what he got quoted.


OP, personally, I would reseal yourself with the help of your friend. These cars are wonderful, but you need to ask yourself, is it worth the 3k or worth the time to get to know your engine? I will promise you this, once you start taking things apart on your engine you will find things that need to be replaced, the price will go up. If you did it yourself, only goes up the price of the part and your time. Mechanic did it, well who really know what the part would cost and how much time extra he would charge. This isnt meant to scare you, but these cars are getting harder to find and to find someone competant to work on them. They are 20+ years old and most people do not want to spend the extra money on someone else working on them.