Rear brakes

Discussion of Infiniti's amazing (and underrated) sport-luxury crossovers, the EX35 and EX37. For 2014, the EX series will be renamed QX50, in line with Ininfiit's new naming conventions.
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P1800
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Rear brakes

Postby P1800 » Thu May 06, 2010 10:08 am

Hello Forum,

Just took my wife 08 EX35 with 27k miles for a route service oil change; afterward the service manager told me than the rear brakes are down to 3mm and recommend a rear brake job for $400. Replace pads, hardware & resurface the rotors for $395 boy this is the first car we have that require a brake job before 30k.

Have anyone of you try to do the brake job yourself? If so any suggestion on the pads suggestions and/or pointer on DIY? I have done the pads & rotors replacement on all my other cars and I am sure I can do the same on my EX. Any feed back or comments are welcome. Thanks.


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Re: Rear breaks

Postby JB_G35 » Fri May 07, 2010 11:58 am

Hey P1800...I just went through the same thing with my dealer. Only we're at 20k miles. Personally I think this is bull and just a way for the service dept to make some money off and unsuspecting woman.
Anyway I plan on doing the brake service myself.
There is a service manual download available at the top of this forum page. It has all you'll need to do the brakes your self.
here's a couple links for places to get your brake parts...good luck

http://autoparts.infinitihelp.net/auto- ... ex35/brake

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Sat May 08, 2010 9:35 am

Just a quick word of advise I learned the hard way. DO NOT DO YOUR FIRST BRAKE JOB ON YOUR WIFES CAR.

It is not worth it. Just buy it this time and practice on our car. Brakes and steering are basic safety control devices and if something were to go wrong...

The rear brakes on many of these cars last ~30k. It's not new really, nor is it unique. In inspecting cars for the last decade these are not as bad as some of the Euros. The BREMBOS on the Range Rover Sport we had a few months back needed front pads and rotors at 11k. These at least do not typically take the rotors with them.

Now if you are set on doing this yourself read some of the tutorials available under the tech pages link about.

I would strongly suggest getting new rotors and Hawk or better pads. The Hawk pads I personally like as I have seen people use them and even with generic or stock rotors they last much longer than stock. Be sure get some quality Brake lube, the longer lasting the better for the metal to metal contact points. I personally use a high temp silicone based grease on the back of the pad and on top of the shims (note orientation and DO NOT DISCARD) These little metal shims isolate vibration and noise as well as assist in the rapid dissipation of heat.

Since you will be saving a significant amount of money on this I would suggest new rotors too. Machining them removes surface matter. If you replace them you will be starting new again instead of using a smaller surface (plus it is much less of a pita and decreases the time this job takes exponentially and improves your success rate). For the price of a dealer job your can replace pads and rotors at all four corners. There are pros and cons to this as will all forms of do it yourself maintenance.

Brakes are really straight forward but if done incorrectly they could cause some serious problems. This is not something to take too lightly.

:cheers:

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby P1800 » Tue May 11, 2010 7:12 am

Thanks JB & Steve.

SteveTheTech, thanks for your warning I am fully aware of the consequence of doing the wife’s car! I have a question for you on the rotor; is it necessary to turn or replace it every time you replace the pads? I am always concerns over this topic and of cause it never hurt replacing it with a new pairs. My past experience is to keep changing pads until the rotors worn and then replace them. Is there any harm by doing it my way?

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby jmess » Tue May 11, 2010 6:21 pm

My 2 cents.

Turning or replacing the rotors insures you get 100% optimum braking performance with the new pads along with reducing the potential for squealing.

That said If you are convinced the rotors are within wear spec new pads will work. Using different pads than stock on unturned rotors can require a longer bed-in time. Using pads made with the same friction material helps here since the old rotors already have the same brake material "film" on them.

Here is what Hawks says.

http://www.hawkperformance.com/performance/install.php

A brake job is a really good time to consider replacing the brake fluid.

For those tempted by Hawk Performance Plus pads they work really well but I had some squealing issues with them and would hesitate to use them again on a daily driver. I started out with new rotors and pads.

The TireRack has a lot of good info also:

http://www.tirerack.com/brakes/tech/tec ... ?techid=85

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Wed May 12, 2010 7:03 pm

jmess wrote:My 2 cents.

Turning or replacing the rotors insures you get 100% optimum braking performance with the new pads along with reducing the potential for squealing.

A brake job is a really good time to consider replacing the brake fluid.
:thewave:
Sage advise.

Brake fluid is a make or "brake" ( :facepalm: ) component of the hydraulic braking system, and should be replaced at when the first set is replaced and at or near 60. Another thing I strongly recommend is keeping at least part of the factory shims. I know Akebono (OE manufacturer who also makes very high quality direct replacement) has a molded shim that works well as the inner shim but the silver one should have some brake lube applied to both sides, to really ensure they are quite. This really isn't written any where just my personal technique and it has not produced any come backs since I started greasing both sides. Also remove and replace the grease on the slide pins too, just in case some contaminates get on there it is better to be safe than sorry.

Also something I learned a while back. Always rotate the rotor at least 360 degrees before torquing the wheel down. Oh and always torque the wheels with new rotors, that is one of the most common causes of brake pulsation and the EX is (internet) infamous for pulsation problems.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby googleman » Wed May 12, 2010 8:02 pm

SteveTheTech wrote:
jmess wrote:My 2 cents.

Turning or replacing the rotors insures you get 100% optimum braking performance with the new pads along with reducing the potential for squealing.

A brake job is a really good time to consider replacing the brake fluid.
:thewave:
Sage advise.

Brake fluid is a make or "brake" ( :facepalm: ) component of the hydraulic braking system, and should be replaced at when the first set is replaced and at or near 60. Another thing I strongly recommend is keeping at least part of the factory shims. I know Akebono (OE manufacturer who also makes very high quality direct replacement) has a molded shim that works well as the inner shim but the silver one should have some brake lube applied to both sides, to really ensure they are quite. This really isn't written any where just my personal technique and it has not produced any come backs since I started greasing both sides. Also remove and replace the grease on the slide pins too, just in case some contaminates get on there it is better to be safe than sorry.

Also something I learned a while back. Always rotate the rotor at least 360 degrees before torquing the wheel down. Oh and always torque the wheels with new rotors, that is one of the most common causes of brake pulsation and the EX is (internet) infamous for pulsation problems.
Before I hit the 10k mark, I had had to take my car for service twice already for wheel vibration during braking at highway speeds (first one around just 300miles). Each time they told me that it is warped rotors and they "shaved" them. I thought the rotors that came with my car were defective, but they claimed that this is normal.

How much do the dealers usually charge for installing rotors and pads? i.e., if I buy the parts myself and take it to the dealer to install them, would that be more effective cost-wise?

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Thu May 13, 2010 4:52 am

There are several causes for a pulsation in the brake pedal (or seat/floor if it is from the rear).

The most common cause is overheating. Overheating happens most commonly from one panic or hard stop and improper cooling afterwards.

With the new style lugs torque is also a factor that we common see impact the overall lateral runout of some rotors. Although at 300 miles, this would not apply.

What I think you might have had is persistent rust. The rust is a normal environmental reaction that happens while the cars sit on dealer lots or at ports. The most common repair is resurfacing. However if the problem returns the standard procedure is to replace the rotors.

Once the rotors have been resurfaced the diameter is decreased (only in increments on 1 1thousandth of an inch ) and the heat dissipation properties are not what they were when new. This is not usually enough to cause an issue but......

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby P1800 » Tue May 25, 2010 3:23 pm

Hello All, I did it! Since this is a new vehicle so I take my time to do the pads replacement (30 min or so). I did take some photos on the steps that I perform the replacement. Sorry I try posting in this forum but not sure how to attach the photo with my write-up. So, whoever care to see what I did to my rear brake job please drop me a line so maybe I can email the procedure to you. Better yet if some can show me on how to attach a file than I can just do that!
Thank you all for your help.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby NJ_EX35 » Thu Aug 05, 2010 8:33 pm

I had the vibration issue under high speed breaking and they replaced the front rotors under warranty. I had to argue with them that this is not normal and I would not pay for front rotor replacement... finally they caved in, but they got me for rear break job. Based on what I read here it seems normal for the EX to get rear brakes done at 30k (I have 28.5k)... I personally think this is crap... I ran my 06 G35 to 44k before having to get the brakes done and my driving style and commuting distance has not changed. Even if other manufacturers have the same issue at 30k it seems to be an intentional design gimmick to make the dealers some more money. FYI - I also have 2007 Denali with 35k miles on it and I was told that I have at least another 8-10k before I need brakes. I love my EX but wonder sometimes if I should have gotten the Bimmer at least they would have paid for this under their maintenance plan. :mad:

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby EXceptional » Fri Aug 06, 2010 5:33 am

P1800 wrote:So, whoever cares to see what I did to my rear brake job please drop me a line so maybe I can e-mail the procedure to you. Better yet, if some can show me on how to attach a file than I can just do that!
Send them to me... and I'll post them for you.

I sent you a PM with my e-mail address.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Fri Aug 06, 2010 2:15 pm

NJ_EX35 wrote:I had the vibration issue under high speed breaking and they replaced the front rotors under warranty. I had to argue with them that this is not normal and I would not pay for front rotor replacement... finally they caved in, but they got me for rear break job.
What is your experience with cars like Audi, Volvo, or even Range rover? Certain models tear through brakes in <20k. Recently we had a used RR sport with Brembos and factory 20" wheels, it was a pretty truck but at 11k miles it needed 4 tires and round house pads and rotors. The total for brakes, parts alone was almost $2000.

Rotor parallelism can be caused by some very routine seeming things. Uneven torque when the wheels are installed, tire shine and wheels acid will wear damage the rotors. Most people do not think twice about applying chemicals to the wheels and tires. Stopping quickly or not allowing the brakes to cool will cause them to pulsate.

I have seen many people get 45-50k out of brakes living in the DC metro area and working on commuters cars. I have also seen some get replaced at 22k. Everyone drives a little differently.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby EXceptional » Sat Aug 07, 2010 12:24 am

Moderators note... P1800 sent me an e-Mail complete with Pictures to post on his behalf, so here it is. Dean

I replaced the rear pads myself; it was piece of cake. Order the Hawk HPS rear pads from Autoanything. Check the disk; the thickness and surface looks good so I didn't touch it.

Started out by standard jacking up the rear of the car, placing jack support under both sides of the suspension, removal of the wheels (oh, I have to pick up a 21mm impact socket) for it also, remember open the brake fluid reservoir cap.

This is what you have without wheel.

Image

I started remove the top bolt holding the caliper (I think it was a 14mm socket)

Image

Be careful with the rubber booth; I gently pull it away from the lower contact point to free it from twisting.

Image

After you loosen the bolt pull it all the way out and your caliper should be free from pivoting. I swing it backward like opening a clamshell.

Image

Gently removed the old pads (I try not to use any tool if possible w/o scratching the disk.

Image

I save the old pad and use it to push back the hydraulic piston with a push back tool. (keep an eye on the brake fluid level since you are pushing back more fluid back into the reservoir)

Image

Check the new pads and make sure you know which is front and back.

Image

I use brake cleaner to clean all the brake parts before installing the new pads (not shown is that I did apply anti-squeal compound to the edges before sliding it in.

Image

Apply more anti-squeal compound in the back of each pads and then reverse the process and you’re done.

Image

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Sat Aug 07, 2010 6:38 am

Good stuff there ^^^

Inlue of brake clean on the shims I use steel wool. Having tried many things over the years I find that to require less work.

Don't forget a Torque wrench. The spec is ~80ft Lbs +1 for every inch of socket and extension.

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Picture Tutorial of replacing Rear Brake Pads.

Postby EXceptional » Sat Aug 07, 2010 7:46 am

Yes, Picture Tutorials are always worth a 1000 Words each.

Note... I didn't get the Pictures as .JPG's, so I used MS Paint to "Save as" the Pictures and send them off to PhotoBucket. For some reason, some parts of the Pictures went weird on me, like the ones that included his Fingers. Louis, if you want to send me .JPG's, I'll fix it up.

Good job on creating this Tutorial! We need more of these.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby SteveTheTech » Sat Aug 07, 2010 8:10 pm

Try Infraview or something like that to retain the original properties.
http://www.irfanview.com/
It does batch conversion, which saves a bunch of time. I used this all the time when I first joined the staff as an articles manager and had to rewrite and repicture how toos.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby NJ_EX35 » Sun Aug 08, 2010 9:00 am

The brakes are making a squeaking noise under very light braking. When I put my foot down it goes away, I assume this is normal, but how long should I wait before I give the dealer a call to complain? Please advise.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby seldomseen » Fri Aug 20, 2010 7:47 am

The reality of the matter is Infiniti brakes are garbage! If you do an online search you will see that MANY people experience premature wear and frequent rotor warping just from normal driving and without high speed braking.

You will probably get better quality brakes if you get them from Midas, Meineke or from a small auto garage to be quite frank. Infiniti will just tell you that all the brake problems you have is normal or blame you for braking at high speeds, etc., which is complete BS. :tisk: I had brakes put on my Eclipse from Meineke and put well over 40k miles on them without ANY issues to date. :)

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby RedwinGV » Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:37 pm

Just keep in mind that a lot of time, the brakes that are better at stopping are much softer and wear quickly.
On my G35, they even extended the warranty to break wear for them going out at about 12-18k. It wasn't an issue for me, but I didn't use them hard.
The lifetime breaks from the shops are usually harder and although they will last, one may loose stopping distances- really GAIN stopping distances as it make take more feet to stop a vehicle.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby Pinspector » Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:22 am

Following is a post I did for my 2008 Infiniti M35x.

Just as info. We all know about brake judder, or some call it brake shudder. This happens when you brake from 60+. Braking is hard, but not real hard; no ABS activation. The whole car shutters, even the shifter shutters. We have an 08 M35x with just over 28000 miles on it. I took it to Ray Catena in Edison and got an EX35 as a loaner (another topic!!). Service rep told me they would take a look at it, but if the brakes were worn down, it would be my dime. At the end of the day I picked up the nicely washed and detailed car with four (4) new (not turned-new) discs and new brake pads all around. At a dealer, this had to have been a $1200 job. All covered under warranty.
So, FYI, if this is happening to you and your car is under the standard, regular warranty, take it back to the dealer and tell them about it. When I dropped the car off I left them with a fairly verbose, detailed explanation of what was happening. All around, a good experience.


I will be picking up my new, 2010 EX35 this afternoon (9/13). I will keep an eye (or foot) on the brakes on the EX35. Hopefully I will not have any problems, but if I do I know that my dealer is good.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby jmess » Mon Sep 13, 2010 8:38 pm

One of the reason the rear brakes wear out faster is the traction control uses the rear brakes and fuel cutoff to try and stop/control wheel spin. Having spent a lot of time driving cars with real limited slip differentials I am no fan of brake based trac systems. I have found the EX (at least my 2wd version) will let you keep your foot down a little more (doesn't cut off fuel as much) than most brake based systems that I have experienced in other cars. If you go through a long winter with a lot of slick driving your rear brakes are going to have a higher wear rate.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby EXceptional » Sat Jun 25, 2011 5:44 am

SteveTheTech wrote:Also something I learned a while back. Always rotate the rotor at least 360 degrees before torquing the wheel down.
Steve, do you mean just spin the Rotor one full rotation, first ?

What does this do ?

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby Tasman » Sat Jun 25, 2011 4:01 pm

Old thread. One thing I will say is that when I had the rotors turned in the past on my prior G35, the mechanic (not Infiniti but a well trusted independent shop) said that my rotors were well within specs for the first turn but he never gets that on BMW or Mercedes. FWIW.

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby EXceptional » Sun Jun 26, 2011 12:48 am

Tasman wrote:Old thread.
So?

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby Wally26 » Tue Jan 10, 2012 12:35 pm

EXceptional, Thanks for the tutorial :dblthumb: . I have never done brakes on any of my cars, never had too. But since this one seems to blow thru brakes quick, and being pretty handy, I thought I'd give it a try. I picked up some Hawks HPS pads off ebay..$66 w/shipping, as my local supplier wanted $89. Bought a 8 in 1 socket wrench at Harbor Freight for $10 for the caliper bolts, and some brake cleaner $4. Otherwise, I just used the jack that came with the car. FYI, my rear breaks went before my front brakes as well. It took me all of 1.5 hr to do. It couldn't have gone smoother, and much time was spend just getting set up, and getting familiar with everything. The only concern I might have, is the tightening of all bolts and lugs. I couldn't have tightened them anymore, and suppose I could always pop by a local shop and have them checked out if it bothers me that much. I did speak with a few people who have worked on brakes, and they all said I should be fine..LOL..I'll update if a wheel pops off! First drive feels as good as new.:biggrin:

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby AWGD8 » Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:42 pm

seldomseen wrote:The reality of the matter is Infiniti brakes are garbage! If you do an online search you will see that MANY people experience premature wear and frequent rotor warping just from normal driving and without high speed braking.

You will probably get better quality brakes if you get them from Midas, Meineke or from a small auto garage to be quite frank. Infiniti will just tell you that all the brake problems you have is normal or blame you for braking at high speeds, etc., which is complete BS. :tisk: I had brakes put on my Eclipse from Meineke and put well over 40k miles on them without ANY issues to date. :)
I think it all comes down to driving habits. I am a bit of an aggressive driver, but when I am coming to a stop, I calculate my speed and don`t brake the last minute....My problem is I am more on gas and smooth on brakes..... :biggrin:

I currently passed 42K miles on my original brakes (2008 EX35 AWD)

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby NJGuy » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:57 am

EXceptional wrote:
SteveTheTech wrote:Also something I learned a while back. Always rotate the rotor at least 360 degrees before torquing the wheel down.
Steve, do you mean just spin the Rotor one full rotation, first ?

What does this do ?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that doing this gets the rotor aligned properly and parallel to the hub. On my EX, I don't recall seeing alignment screws (typically installed during the car's assembly) holding the rotor to the hub. I guess with some cars or brake rotors that don't have these screws, it's possible to have the rotors misaligned when installing them? :gotme

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby AWGD8 » Sun May 13, 2012 4:25 pm

I just had a front and rear brake pads replaced by my dealer.

Car is already 43.5k miles and this was the first time break job was done.

I went home and curiously decided to check those pads. The front pads are gray in color and much thicker than the rear pads. The rear pads has this bluish color in it and seems to be about 5-6mm thinner than the front pads.

Is it possible that the original front pads were just moved to the rear? And the front pads were replaced by a newer one? But I do not think the original front pads could survive that long (43.5K ) . So if they moved the front to rear, there is no way the rear pads still look like around 8-9mm thick. But I am a bit confused bec. The new front Pads are way thicker than the new Rear pads. About 6mm difference.

Any idea?

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby CDNicecube » Fri Nov 22, 2013 9:23 pm

Sort to hijack this tread but will be changing my rear pads and rotors and have a question. Are their screws holding the rotors to the hub like in Hondas? If so, what is the trick to remove rusted ones?

Thank you

Ice

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Re: Rear brakes

Postby EXceptional » Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:11 am



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