RB20 Engine Management Options?

[wga240]

I've been looking around for quite some time on my engine management options and am at a stand-still. I'm looking for anyone that can provide some insight and/or personal experiences with any of the following setups. My eventual goal is around 400 whp for the strip and as little as 300 for the street (300 seems like a good balance between reliability and fun). The mods will be the usual stuff plus a few extras like alcohol injection and toluene to ward off detonation.

The current setups I'm debating are as follows:

• A.P. Engineering PowerFCPowerFC Boost Control KitPowerFC DataLogitPowerFC Hand Commander

• Greddy E-ManageE-Manage Ignition HarnessE-Manage Injection HarnessProfec E-01

• Microtech LT12 RB20DET Plug-In Harness AdapterLaptop Adapter

• Link ECU

PowerFC Pros:

• Well proven, fairly easy to tune system. I know several people with one that could help me tune if needed

Cons:

• The A.P. Engineering version is quite hard to find. Also it can only work with low impedence injectors, so it would be impossible to run this setup on stock injectors like I originally planned to do while I figured out which turbo I wanted to go with

E-Manage Pros:

• The cheapest of the bunch, although the only one that's a piggyback. However with 16x16 fuel/ignition maps and boost control provided with the Profec it appears to be a competent systemAlso the E-Manage can automatically switch over to using a pressure sensor when the AFM runs out of steam. This would keep me from having to source a larger AFM. However I'm not sure if you can completely remove the AFM (or if I'd want to) with this setup.

E-Manage Cons:

• I've heard mixed reviews about this thing. My power goals are very realistic and I will have the alcohol injection and toluene as a safety margin. Would this thing be able to handle what I want to do? I know I could get by with just a regular air/fuel controller if I just wanted 300 hp, but I want to aim a bit higher and don't want to get stuck with something that can't handle it. I'd LOVE to hear any personal experiences with this product

Microtech and Link

• I'm finding it hard to get information on both of these products. Several of the skyline guys swear by these things, but like every option many also don't like them
  
  Update: I've found out that Microtech USA offers the plug-in harness adapter for RB20DET engines. The microtech unit sounds to me to be the best option of standalones I've considered so far, if I go that route.

[Carl H]

ive got the emanage and e01 on my car.on the emanage yahoo group one of the supra guys has 640whp on the stock ecu and maf using the emanage.

[wga240]

Could you elaborate a bit more on your setup and impressions please? Did you tune it yourself or have someone else tune it? What kind of power levels are you putting out? From what you've seen of the system so far, is this something you'd trust to keep your 1st born son safe in a mine field? My car is like a child to me and the minefield is everything that could go wrong and blow up the motor

[wga240]

Oh I forgot to add, if you have any other suggestions by all means make them. If you think all this is way overkill for 400 whp then PLEASE say so, so I can save some money I just want a setup that I can tune myself with a wideband and a knock sensor. I absolutely need fuel and boost control, but ignition control may or may not be a big deal with the fuel setup I plan on running.

[goofynick6]

Yeah, I was wondering if emanage was slight overkill for a goal of 350whp, or if an safc2 would be plenty if tuned with a wideband.

Nick

[Phixius]

Has anyone ever used or thought about using the MegaSquirt? There is a turbo'd BMW around here that uses one of these, has 300 WHP.

Link - http://www.bgsoflex.com/megasquirt.html

[Red_Liner]

lots of Volvo guys use Megasquirt....its mega cheap and there are guys running 300 whp on their Megasquirt (could be more but stock internals)

i would go with the Microtech cuz its pretty much plug and play...it already comes preset for the sr/rb/ca engines and u cant pick it up from there....remember, hardest stuff is tuning the ECU properly....u would save yourself hundreds of dollars of Dyno Time if u have a basic setup that u can take from there

[93RPS13]

is megasquirt hard to tune?? thanks

[sil820]

i plan on going with the emanage setup..b/c its a lot more affordable..but my goal is only 300-400 hp

[wga240]

The more I look at the Microtech system the more I fall in love with it. I've seen several references to people with RB20DETs controlling their engine with the Microtech LT8, which only has 4 ignition outputs....I guess they use a wasted spark setup? On the contrary, I can't find any references to someone using the Microtech LT12 or LTX12 to control their RB20DET, so going LT8 + wasted spark must be the thing to do.

The total LT8 setup would set me back:LT8: 899.993 Bar Map Config: $58.99Plug-In Harness Adapter: $174.99Laptop Adapter: $108.993 Bar Map Sensor: $124.99

=$1367.95 total, or about the same as a PowerFC + Hand Controller. Both units are pretty much plug and play (at least it should run without any extra tuning, but definitely shouldn't boost it on the standard maps).

The only problem is I still wouldn't have boost control, but luckily I can probably pull a few strings with the great guys at Power Digger and get a well priced EBC

[Yellow4g63]

They have the LT8S now and LT12S. They cost more now but it's a 32bit vs 16bit. Comes with a 3.4 bar map sensor now too. They have a forum. The APC E PFC can be bought at Greenline motor sport. I think it's $1200 shipped with paypal.

http://microtechefi.com/html/LT.htmhttp ... lo...ke=FI

[Yellow4g63]

Cons:

• The A.P. Engineering version is quite hard to find. Also it can only work with low impedence injectors, so it would be impossible to run this setup on stock injectors like I originally planned to do while I figured out which turbo I wanted to go with

Are you sure about the Low imedence thing?

[wga240]

I'm not positive, but look at that Greenline Motorsports link you posted.

"A.P. Engineering Special. Manual transmission only. Only compatible with low impedence injectors."

[Yellow4g63]

I'm not positive, but look at that Greenline Motorsports link you posted.

"A.P. Engineering Special. Manual transmission only. Only compatible with low impedence injectors."

Hmm it's looking better already. Thats one of the things that I was holding back on about the pfc. I think it's a GTR PFC reprogramed and repined maybe.

[meggala]

have you guys considered remapping the stock ecu we do this quite a bit in OZ not that hard for some one to learn .you need a n eprom burner and the software.my sr 20 runs a remapped ecu 550 injectors, z32 maf,my r32 used to run z32 mafmeggala

[goofynick6]

My buddy actually burns his own eproms for his SR20 and said he could do it for my ecu...I'm just afraid to let him..haha.

Nick

[meggala]

well check out 925style.com they have most of the stuff there

[apex_7]

wga240: What turbo are you running? That is basically what methods of fuel management I was thinking of going with.

Has anyone tried a Garret GT30R turbo on an RB20DET? I hear a lot of talk about people reaching 400+hp on stock internals... but who are these people? And what are there setups? Everyone seems to know what turbo to go with and everything but how many people have actually done it?

[apex_7]

I have a friend w/ an SR 240 that's running a PLX Wideband, larger injectors, E-manage, T3/T4 50-trim and making 350 hp. We tuned it on the street. He has crazy boost lag though. I'm wanting to go w/ a ball-bearing turbo on my rb20 because of his car. There is also a local 300zx running that megasquirt system. It's a VG30ET running low 12s on street tires. I can give you his email address if you have any questions about that system.

[wga240]

wga240: What turbo are you running? That is basically what methods of fuel management I was thinking of going with.

Right now I'm running the stock turbo. I'm probably going to try and find a used RB25DET turbo to upgrade to until I can figure out what I really want to end up with. There's so many options it's almost overwhelming. I figure with the RB25 turbo running ~15 psi and some decent tuning I should see 11s at the strip. I think this is a reasonable estimate, since I see myself running 12.7 or lower on the stock RB20 turbo at stock boost now that I've got my drag radials and gotten rid of the stock cat and downpipe

[apex_7]

12.7? Damn. You must know something I don't. I can barely get high 13's out of mine.

[wga240]

Well I got a 13.4 last time out. I'm pretty certain I can drop my 60' down by 3 tenths, so that alone should be about 12.8 or so hopefully. Then I figure getting rid of stock downpipe, adding a 3" test pipe, a lightweight flywheel, and a new clutch should get that other tenth

[apex_7]

wow. Do you have an LSD?

[wga240]

Of course. I used the one that came with my RB20 clip. 4.36 ratio helps a bit also

[vududoc]

i am looking into another one that is relatively cheap. Plugs into your data port yet requires a laptop to drive it.

I have access to the Link ecu's just not many test cars to run it on to recommend it.

power FC has been noted to lack aac control or a glitch that induced stall......have to read more into that whether fact or fiction.

the greddy setup is pretty cool IMO