RB...DET vs VG30DETT........

Post by **DarkParadigm1** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Hey yallz, im new to this forum, and actually i dont even own a nissan...yet. im looking at a local 300zxtt. also was looking at some 240s'. a friend of mine has one, and its sweeeet (still not as fast as my corrado vr6 tho :P ). anywayz, to my question. i know its kinda odd, but i hear tons of stuff about sr20de/ts' and rb20/25/26de/t/tts' and such. but where does the vg30dett stand in comparison to them?? i know its the oddball of the groub, being a v6 instead of an inline 4/6. how does it compare to the rest of them? odd Q, i know, and any/all answers appreciated. (except the ones that insult my intelligence...unless they are real good, then props to the poster :P ).

ps which car is better in the long run? 240 (has to get some sorta engine swap) or a 300zxtt?? <--lookin for opinions, TIA

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

The VG is a true pain in the A.S.S to work on. You need to pull the engine for just about every mod. I'll never own one.

WD

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

I hate those things. When I popped the hood on the new Z and saw the VQ V-6 I screamed "whyyyyyyyyyyy"?!!!

Post by **mattback** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

however when you go for power the vg will destroy them.

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

VG30dett vs an RB26DETT, I'm quite sure your wrong.Even the RB25 is better then the VG30. By the time you get done buying twice the amount of parts I need to build your VG I'll have twice as many more already installed on my RB.

WD

Post by **mattback** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

twic ethe amount of parts.surely youre wrong.

e11 160072 lb injectors 70 eachcustom fuel rails 40 bucks88mm pistons 500rods 500cams 600(you have to get all that anyways on an rb also to compete)twin t04e 46s 1000wastegates 500

private-tune - free

you lose trust me. since when will 2.6 beat a 3.0 when they are both 24 valve dohc very high flowing setups. never. yes they are harder to work on, but ive worked on them for hte past 4 years. so they are quite the gentle giant.

lets go $ for $ and i bet i can build a VG cheaper than you can build an RB.

Post by **Lavondyss** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Time after time, I've seen the rb26dett produce more horsepower per dollar than a vg30 could ever dream of.

Now... here's something to consider. I like the I6 Nissan motors, and 3liters is nice... why not the hybrid rb30det? Yikes... brings back all sorts of LS/VTEC flashbacks... Blah, yuk, eww...

Thanks,Charles Weller

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

I don't know where you got your prices from, but I've never seen anything like it. Twin TO4E's for 1000...

The RB is better, I don't care what you say. You've never built one. You've probably never seen one. The VG is a strong motor. But The RB26DETT is better.

I'm not arguing this anymore, so don't expect any replies. Its a silly thread.

Post by **DarkParadigm1** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

well, i would think that here in the US, the vg would be easier/cheaper to work on, seeing as its in a production vehicle sold in the US. Whereas the rb series can only be imported, which can get quite expensive. So id think, in the US, dollar for dollar, the vg would be better. Especially if you only plan to go for 600 hp or so. just my .02

Post by **Lavondyss** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Believe it or not, after many months of research, the rb series motors dollar for dollar, are less expensive to work on. Unless you do the labor 100% yourself. The reason, people charge alot more to work on the vg series motors, because they are so incredibly hard to work with. Call SGP in Houston sometime. They'll explain to you why they love and hate the vg motors.

Thanks,Charles Weller

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Don't get me wrong, the VG is powerful. But the RB26 can make so much power with just simple bolt ons. I'm sure you've all seen the car BIGBIRD from F&F part 1. Its the yellow R33. It ran a 10.6 with exhaust,2530 turbines and a simple N2O kit. That aint bad for a stock RB26 block. You won't find any 300Z's doin that.

WD

Post by **-Spool-** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

from my experience with friends 300's...... the VG's are a royal pain in the ***... sure, they can make good power for the dollar, but not the install dollar. My god, u gotta pull that thing out for the smallest things.

Something interesting I saw a few days back in a site I can no longer find. A new 350Z with an RB26DETT..... It was a japanese site. Man, that would be one sweet car.

Ill try to find it again and show you all.

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

mattback wrote:
you lose trust me. since when will 2.6 beat a 3.0 when they are both 24 valve dohc very high flowing setups. never.

Maybee in the great white north but around here there has yet to be the Z that could escape an equally tuned CA18 for cripe's sakes. Arbitrary blanket thinking like that won't save you from the fact that a race doesn't consist of pulling up to the tree and having your engine CCdThe Z is a heavy pig, the motor is capable but twice as expensive and saddled by the battlecruiser of a car it's bolted in.

Post by **boileralum00** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

As a VG30DETT owner who does all the work on his own car, I can vouch that the motor is not exactly fun to work on. I pulled mine this summer to install a pair of Garrett GT25BB turbos, as well as upgrade the injectors & intercoolers. However, if you are going to do a dollar for dollar comparison, of say a 240sx w/ an RB26 swap (which to my knowledge hasn't been done more than a handful of times in the US) vs. a Z32 TT, you can much more easily buy a Z32 that already has the twinturbo motor in it and make it faster for the same amount of money that it would cost to buy a 240, swap in the RB, and then start modifying it. Granted, your status won't be as high when considering the "unique car" status, but it's not as if there are all that many Z32 TTs running around.

Post by **SSDwellah** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Lavondyss wrote:Time after time, I've seen the rb26dett produce more horsepower per dollar than a vg30 could ever dream of.

Now... here's something to consider. I like the I6 Nissan motors, and 3liters is nice... why not the hybrid rb30det? Yikes... brings back all sorts of LS/VTEC flashbacks... Blah, yuk, eww...

Thanks,Charles Weller

There is an RB30DE but I don't know how many parts are interchangeable with other RBs. Cams? Manifolds? Anything?!?

Post by **sapix @ RHIT** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

themadscientist wrote:I hate those things. When I popped the hood on the new Z and saw the VQ V-6 I screamed "whyyyyyyyyyyy"?!!!

When I poped the hood of the 350Z I didn't even see an engine. I saw a big plastic piece of crap. Why do all companies insist on showing less and less of the engine. The engine is the most atractive part of the car

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

RB30ET short block with an RB25 head, been done. It's scweet.

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

TRUE...

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

YOU IN OKI WD?

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

Yep...I'm on Kadena. Where the hell is Spooky Mountain...lol.

Post by **LarryStooge** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

How old are you? 15? If you'r 15, the VG30DETT sucks. If you'r NOT 15, then I feel bad for you, and the VG STILL sucks. Hope this helps. Oh yeah, the 240sx is a better car and capable of WAY more than the 300zx in just about every possible way.

Post by **WDRacing** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

StephNic wrote:How old are you? 15? If you'r 15, the VG30DETT sucks. If you'r NOT 15, then I feel bad for you, and the VG STILL sucks. Hope this helps. Oh yeah, the 240sx is a better car and capable of WAY more than the 300zx in just about every possible way.

Who the hell are you talking too???

Post by **LarryStooge** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

WDRacing wrote:Who the hell are you talking too???

DarkParadigm1

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

stock for stock and retaining the same engine as originally equipped I would take issue with that statement. The Silvia with an SR would accord itself well versus the Z but not best it in a cumulative test of all possible measures of performance. 1/4 mile, 0-60, 60-0, top speed, skid pad G, I am very confident the Z would edge the Silvia out in every category except maybe 60' time on the strip. Is everything equal? no but although the Z is a barge and the VG is a major pain to work on it is still a capable package. Would I own one? no, do I take every Z I step up to seriously? yes. Thinking like that will get you stung on the street or at the strip or circuit.

Post by **LarryStooge** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

themadscientist wrote:stock for stock and retaining the same engine as originally equipped I would take issue with that statement. The Silvia with an SR would accord itself well versus the Z but not best it in a cumulative test of all possible measures of performance. 1/4 mile, 0-60, 60-0, top speed, skid pad G, I am very confident the Z would edge the Silvia out in every category except maybe 60' time on the strip. Is everything equal? no but although the Z is a barge and the VG is a major pain to work on it is still a capable package. Would I own one? no, do I take every Z I step up to seriously? yes. Thinking like that will get you stung on the street or at the strip or circuit.

car for car, the 240 is WAY more capable than the 300zx. Because of weight and power capability reasons.

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

and you base that on what? Show me data where a S13 Silvia outperforms a Z in the 1/4 mile, 0-60, 60-0, skid pad Gs and top speed. Just because you want it to be true doesn't mean it is, show me hard numbers.

Post by **themadscientist** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

I love that power to weight thing, it reminds me of the hp per liter thing Honda guys preach. Power is good, less weight is good however cars are not judged by these two factors alone but how they work together. By your reasoning a 135hp hachiroku should easily walk away from my 145hp Silvia because it's lighter, It didn't. A car is not a collection of whole numbers compared line by line but a complex equasion whose totals are compared. The Z will outperform the Silvia in most every category a car's performance stock for stock. The minute you start tweaking either car and all bets are off it could go either way.

Post by **DarkParadigm1** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

so far all i hear is ppl saying that the VG sucks and its not that good of an engine blah blah blah (except for themadscientist). but the only specifics i hear is that its hard to work on. i dont give a shiot how hard it is to work on. im not interested in how hard it is to work on. being hard to work on doesnt effect its overall performance. it just makes it HARD TO WORK ON. now that we're past that, ill try restating my question in a way that everyone MAY understand. cost for cost, is it better to get a 300zxtt and mod it, or get a 240sx for slightly less, and swap a different engine in it, then start modifying it? and i dont want to hear power to weight preaching either. i dont care about that. that can be gotten around. (this if for atuoX btw). oh, and to StephNic, if i was 15 i would probably not be looking at car forums and such. actually, id probably be spankin it in the corner somewhere. so get a life.

::insert >>>intelligent replies only please<<< somewhere in the middle of that post...

Post by **LarryStooge** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

themadscientist wrote:I love that power to weight thing, it reminds me of the hp per liter thing Honda guys preach. Power is good, less weight is good however cars are not judged by these two factors alone but how they work together. By your reasoning a 135hp hachiroku should easily walk away from my 145hp Silvia because it's lighter, It didn't. A car is not a collection of whole numbers compared line by line but a complex equasion whose totals are compared. The Z will outperform the Silvia in most every category a car's performance stock for stock. The minute you start tweaking either car and all bets are off it could go either way.

learn how to read english, i said CAPABLE of more. I never said anything about stock. As far as hard numbers, go to JUN's website, theyve got an 8.8 s14, when you can show me a unibody (not that escort Z thats a bunch of tubes with a peice of fiberglass that LOOKs like a car)Z that runs anywhere close to that, then I'll change my mind. The JUN hyper lemon s15 has multiple track records, show me one track record that a Z holds. OK, I hope that satisfies what you wanted, try and read correctly next time, I didn't say a damn thing about stock.

Post by **LarryStooge** » Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:36 am

DarkParadigm1 wrote:so far all i hear is ppl saying that the VG sucks and its not that good of an engine blah blah blah (except for themadscientist). but the only specifics i hear is that its hard to work on. i dont give a shiot how hard it is to work on. im not interested in how hard it is to work on. being hard to work on doesnt effect its overall performance. it just makes it HARD TO WORK ON. now that we're past that, ill try restating my question in a way that everyone MAY understand. cost for cost, is it better to get a 300zxtt and mod it, or get a 240sx for slightly less, and swap a different engine in it, then start modifying it? and i dont want to hear power to weight preaching either. i dont care about that. that can be gotten around. (this if for atuoX btw). oh, and to StephNic, if i was 15 i would probably not be looking at car forums and such. actually, id probably be spankin it in the corner somewhere. so get a life.

::insert >>>intelligent replies only please<<< somewhere in the middle of that post...

the vg30 engine sucks. It's large and bulky. 90% of Zs couldn't take out a newer Z28 if the drivers life depended on it. The Z is way too heavy and the engien has proved time and time again that it's capable of 600hp, anything past that is close to impossible unless you dump over 6 figures in the car. The 600hp mark for them is considered a gods mark too, and usually comes with huge laggy turbos (huge for the Zs tiny space). As far as the you being 15 remark, theres alot of troll 15 year old people that post stupid questions in stupid places. The reason this question is stupid is because it's regarding a VG engine and what the Z is capable of, but your posting i here, in a 240sx rb forum. Don't do stupid **** and you won't get stupid replies.

RB...DET vs VG30DETT........

RB...DET vs VG30DETT........

friggin boomerang engines

Dollar for Dollar...

Actually...

Re: Dollar for Dollar...

Re: friggin boomerang engines

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