R-14

[lovespeed]

Hi i am looking at the r14 conversion from full race for my friend. we are curantly deployed to afganistain and do not have a lot of time to look up info. so i have a few questions. does any one know an estimated price for this kit 2 does any one know what the kit will come with and what will need to be purchased outside of the kit. also any opinions on the kit itself how it works or any other fellins on it. thanks for your time and input.

[simmode1]

There's this cool new site out... I think it's called Google or something like that will find stuff for you if you type things like 'Full Race R14' in the search bar...

http://www.full-race.com/r14/

[Lev_96_240sx]

I'm not sure full-race even makes the kit anymore. here is the list from their site:

Self-Install Kit Conversions"Stage 1" Conversion

R14 Steel Rolling Chassis Kit - This is the entry-level R14 kit for the do-it-yourselfer. This conversion allows for anyone to embark on building their own custom Skyline GTR, but do it at your pace with a budget.

* Single-adjustable Steel KONI coilover shock absorbers. * 4" aluminum 6061-T6 Slip-yoke eliminator driveshaft. * Electronic 4wd controller + all necessary hydraulic lines. * R14 double wishbone front suspension. * R14 frame rails + subframe mounts. * R14 transmission mount.

Price: To be announced

"Stage 2" Conversion

R14 Aluminum Rolling Chassis Kit - This is the upgraded Stage 1 kit using everything form the Stage 1 kit, with the addition of...

* Remote reservoir double adjustable KONI coilover shock absorbers. * 4" aluminum 6061-T6 Slip-yoke eliminator driveshaft.

Price: To be announced

This is from their Q&A:The parts you will need are : S14 chassis (S13 conversions available late '07), and R32 clip complete with engine, suspension, front and rear differentials, axles and transmission.

They were charging 13-15000 to install the rolling chassis kit I'm assuming you could do it yourself for a lot less. Total build price would be that plus the price of an R32 front clip with all the stuff they listed. I wouldn't expect less than 15-20,000 just in parts. And also I don't think I've heard of anyone other than Full-Race themselves to ever have this kit.

Good luck though, hope this helps. Stay SAFE!

[simmode1]

^^^ Also, word is that the AWD system is not the same as the full time ATTESA ETS system from the GTR... more like some 'on demand' work around.

Edit:
Modified by simmode1 at 1:38 AM 4/6/2010

[TheBlaiant]

I think it's too much money for that.Why would you want an AWD 240sx anyways?

[Lev_96_240sx]

That's what full-race said about ATTESSA and why they took it out.

" ATTESSA is known to cause oversteer. Particularly on the early R32 GTRs, the ATTESSA system was very slow to react and would often "add" FWD too little, too late. Many Japanese and Australian race vehicles have done away with the ATTESSA system and gone to a fixed, manually controlled torque split, similar to an EVO or STI. Adjusting the torque split allows you to change the balance of the car. If the car is oversteering, add FWD. If the car is understeering, add RWD. By utilizing a fixed tq split, the driver can learn to anticipate the vehicle's handling and will not be surprised by an understeer or oversteer condition when least expected.

Follow the link below to read a great article about the problems, and remedies of the ATESSA system on the R32 GT-R's.http://autospeed.com/A_107753/cms/article.html "

If what Simmode said is true, then I'd assume their problem was that ATTESSA automatically adjusts torque split from corner to corner whereas they dialed in a set split which works great for one corner but not so much for the next.

Edit #2: I didn't see them explicitly say you couldn't use ATTESSA though. I mean after all you're buying a full GTR pretty much, you could very well use the ATTESSA controller instead of Blitz or w/e they have you buy and use with their conversion kit.
Modified by Lev_96_240sx at 5:38 AM 2/22/2010

[simmode1]

If what Simmode said is true, then I'd assume their problem was that ATTESSA automatically adjusts torque split from corner to corner whereas they dialed in a set split which works great for one corner but not so much for the next.

I'm not clear on the particulars of it since I was never really interested in it, but the info I referenced came from the old magazine article that Modified did on this car...

[Lev_96_240sx]

yea I have no idea if what I said is actually true, but from reading what they think about ATTESSA and how they proposed to remedy it, unless they didn't align the car well at all the only reason it would handle so badly is because they had the wrong torque distribution all the time instead of the original system adjusting it for each turn. Again, not sure that's right, but it's what makes sense.

[lovespeed]

thanks for your help the info was very usfull. as i said i am deployed and do not have acces to the internet every day or for long periods of time so thanks for your help.

[Lev_96_240sx]

Sorry to resurrect a dying thread, but I saw today that Geoff from Full race is actually working on converting his car into a 700+hp time attack machine. (Geoff is the owner of the pewter R14 featured in modified and pretty much the only R14 in existence that we know of) They are also supposedly working on a DIY conversion kit that he claims any competent mechanic with a 220v MIG welder could do. The work they are doing on it is actually very interesting and worth reading,.

Removed your "link" OTW

[Lev_96_240sx]

I edited the link so that it's no longer a link. If that's still not ok I PM'd Geoff and asked if he could post his build on here as well.

[simmode1]

^^^ That would rock. The FullRace guys are certified geniuses, IMO. I'd love to see the R14 come out on top.


Modified by simmode1 at 1:39 AM 4/6/2010

[Morph]

That site has shown pricing coming soon for at least a year. I wouldnt count on this ever coming to the public.

[Lev_96_240sx]

I got a response from Geoff and we are getting an epic post *soon*

[full-race geoff]

Last I heard, that thing performed terribly at the track.

that is bullsh!t. sorry, the car has been my occasional daily driver / fun car. it has not once been to the track. please dont post BS you heard from your neighbors friend's internet buddy.

I got a response from Geoff and we are getting an epic post *soon*

zerothread?id=482746

first time ever on track, next week. modified tuner shootout.

[impact240sx]

that is bullsh!t. sorry, the car has been my occasional daily driver / fun car. it has not once been to the track. please dont post BS you heard from your neighbors friend's internet buddy.

HAHA!!!!!!!! LOL,

[simmode1]

You know what? I've been looking for this dead thread to retract that statement... I haz egg on face! Full-Race is top notch for sure.

[impact240sx]

Even though you retract it, its still funny, and you should never talk negative on anything without personal experience. But in all seriousness how could an s-chassis with rb+awd perform terrible at the track.

[simmode1]

But in all seriousness how could an s-chassis with rb+awd perform terrible at the track.

Bad suspension geometry. Bad torque distribution. Bad chassis bracing. Hell, any number of things could go wrong with a frankenstien'd project like this. But obviously, thats not the case with Full Race. Yeah, an AWD S-chassis with RB26 power sounds great on paper, but it's execution is a whole other thing.

IMO, most ppl don't have the foresight or skills to duplicate the results that FullRace gets. It would take high level mechanical engineering thought processes like what you find at Full Race to anticipate everything that might not work well together. Which is why I'd prefer to stick to something that wouldn't require so much reverse engineering, like an STI or be satisfied maximizing your RWD performance. Why? Because a project like this is waaaay out of my scope and that of most other ppl too. Which is why we haven't seen it done before.

But hey, I apologized already, so drop it.

[full-race geoff]

I'd prefer to stick to something that wouldn't require so much reverse engineering, like an STI or be satisfied maximizing your RWD performance. Why? Because a project like this is waaaay out of my scope and that of most other ppl too. Which is why we haven't seen it done before. But hey, I apologized already, so drop it.

just because you cant handle this swap doesnt mean other people cant. heres my car's first day on the track (performing terribly obviously ):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rbVCuz94QY

edit: ill post up some vids from a customer of mine in the caribbean who built his own R14 using our kit with a few emails and pics from me
Modified by full-race geoff at 6:44 AM 4/6/2010

[simmode1]

Geez dude WTF. OK FullRace is the bee's knees. I recanted before. What else do you want? Want me to recant and also say the swap is perfectly feasible for the average or typical S-chassis enthusiast? Well, I'm not gonna go that far.

It's a great project and I applaud you guy's work. I've been a fan ever since I read the article years ago on that black 700hp street Civic you guys built. Genius work. Thanks for providing valuable reference material and inspiration to the community. OK? We good?

Edit: I got an idea... Ok how's this? Voila! No more disparaging remarks!
Modified by simmode1 at 1:37 AM 4/6/2010