Question Regarding 94/95 Stillen Q Value

[thejfed]

I am looking at purchasing a 94/95 Q45 with Stillen mods and need some advice from the experts. OwnerCS has been an amazing asset in helping me to date, but told me I should definitely enlist the help of all you Q guys.

It is a one owner car (he's now 71). Never seen salt or snow. Always garaged. Never been in a major accident (says he crunched the grille back in 96 and had it replaced). It has a 176k on the engine but mostly highway miles. ALways runs Mobile 1 oil and is volunteering to let me talk to his service manager at the Infiniti dealership where it has always been serviced. He has all the service records and I could have them if I bought it. No rips/tears or anything wrong on the interior, and paint is shiny. It has a Flowmaster dual-exahust set-up and it has Tokiko shocks and progressive springs. He's wanting $6,500. I'll have to probably ship the car at my expensive and I'm estimating that to be somewhere between $800 and $1k.

What do you guys think this car is really worth? What problems may I run into? How long do the rear diffs or transmissions last? I know it has the metal guides and 1st gear start. Just looking for some more insight from the experts. Thanks in advance for any insight you provide.

[qship96]

A $3000 dollar car, especially at that mileage, and only if it is perfect looking and no mechanical work need to be performed.

[thejfed]

Really? $3K...*sigh* my guess is this guy isn't going to deal with me and go that low...he probably figures it'll sell at some point. My guess is some guy that doesn't know what's up (not on Nico) would pay $5.5K or something. I have a friend that's willing to check it out for me tonight. In pictures, it's gorgeous and I honestly truly really want it. But not sure I can stomach double what it's worth...

If I get it, I'll probably have to over pay...but sounds like you think it's only a $3k car.

[thejfed]

Before I got a hold of the dealership he used to take it to, I told him if it checked out I would offer him $4k. He informed me for $4k he'd keep the car. I asked how he came to a $6,500 price tag and he said it's based on what he has into it (He claims approx $60k into it from time of purchase...). I informed him of the book value and he went on the defensive saying it's 17 years old and book means nothing.

I talked to the dealership he used to take it to. They haven't seen it since it hit 100k. When he did bring it there he never beat on it and it was immaculate. Said he always used synthetic fluids. They said it was overpriced with 176k on the clock. Said it was probably worth $5k-5.5k in their opinion.

I'd like to call him back and tell him what the dealer said but that sticks me at a minimum of $5k....def a very clean car. Not sure how much I'm willing to overpay..

[Infinitiguy19]

Do you mind posting pictures of the car that he sent you?

[thejfed]

I called the seller back and pretended like we haven't talked price before (ignoring our earlier disagreement) and confirmed my buddy (I live in MN and the car is on the West coast) can come look at it tonight. So I will have much much better pictures and a description of how it drives and looks from my friend later tonight. For now here are four really really crappy pictures...

[Infinitiguy19]

Looks like no IMPUL kit. Ask him if it has the Stillen rear sway bar with a Q45t/a front sway bar. Does it have the Stillen battery hold down because that may be the deal breaker?!

[qship96]

If you really like it, and it checks out to be a clean,no issue car........buy it,even knowing you are paying well over its actual cash value.

I would certainly want to have a Infiniti tech go over it from bumper to bumper and evaluate for expensive parts nearing the end of their lifespan, and any hidden previous damages before overpaying for a shiny old car though. If the owner balks,walk,no, run away.

At that age and mileage, many expensive parts are nearing the end of their lifespan,and if he cant show you a MINIMUM of $3,000 worth of parts replacement receipts in the last few years.......then you know how much you will be spending soon on top of the vehicles purchase price.

Look for things like new radiator,AC compressor,starter,alternator,knock sensors,shocks,engine/transmission mounts,Mass airflow sensor,window regulators,under plenum hoses,idler pullies ,the list goes on regarding common items needing replacing right around that mileage.

[thejfed]

It has the front Stillen bar, but not the rear. He says the battery has a bar across it but isn't sure if it's Stillen. He says he bought everything he could from Stillen at the time. Currently sitting on 17" BBS wheels with Continental tires (245/45) with half life. Car has not been his daily driver for the last eight years, but rather a toy. If I bought it I'd go buy a rear sway bar. Not a real deal breaker for me. I'm more concerned about the miles vs. price balance. I mean, honestly at 176k what's the realistic life of this car? I'm in love with it but am trying to be realistic.

[qship96]

Dont get hung up on the "stillen" parts, as in reality, they add very little to nothing to the value or performance of the car.

[thejfed]

Right, which is why it doesn't bother me much that it doesn't have the rear sway bar, as it's a simple ad. I'm more concerned with the miles and price. My gut tells me this guy is as anal as I am. It's probably been really really meticulously maintained and is in tip top shape. I definitely think he has fixed anything and everything that broken with OEM parts. I need to wait for my buddy to see it and drive it for more info.

[Infinitiguy19]

To me that car maybe clean but just because he has a Stillen spoiler on it doesn't make it a Stillen car. I would go no higher than 3K. But he is right that millage means nothing, its how its taken care of. I would not hesitate to buy Qships car IF he decides to sell it.

[goody90q45]

....At that age and mileage, many expensive parts are nearing the end of their lifespan,and if he cant show you a MINIMUM of $3,000 worth of parts replacement receipts in the last few years.......then you know how much you will be spending soon on top of the vehicles purchase price.

Look for things like new radiator,AC compressor,starter,alternator,knock sensors,shocks,engine/transmission mounts,Mass airflow sensor,window regulators,under plenum hoses,idler pullies ,the list goes on regarding common items needing replacing right around that mileage.

There's some good advice there. For the price your willing to pay I'd want to see a stack of receipts for all the work mentioned above adding fuel pump and fuel injectors to the list. If the owner can show $3000-$5000 of stealership work in the last few years then it's been well taken care of and may be worth more than the $3000 you're hearing in this thread. I got a great deal on a Q a couple of months ago but if I had to pay more than $4000-$4500 it would have made it a tough decision. High blue book for this car was only about $3600.

post6106538.html#p6106538

Here's the Craigslist ad for the Q you're looking at. He's in a pretty nice neighborhood so you're paying a bit of a premium because of the zip code. It sounds like an ECU may be part of the upgrade also?

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/cto/2537760686.html

Make sure to have your friend look under the plenum looking for replaced injectors. Not a bad idea to ohm test them if the engine isn't idling perfectly and he know's how to use a voltmeter. Inspect for clean fluids, especially transmission fluid and if it doesn't shift properly and he's not confident about the transmission's integrity then it's a $2000 Q.

[AZhitman]

All good advice.

I've never seen a Q hit 176K without major work, even if it's been babied.

[elwesso]

My Q has 183k on it and its been flogged..

I tend to agree with the above. honestly out of everything thats listed, the rear sway bar is probably the biggest performance enhancement that can be had. Shame that if the guy got an ECU from stillen, he paid $800 for the ECU and my ECU is still superior at $250 (and was cheaper years ago). For a car this age with really nothing "special" about it, I consider the modifications done as freebies.. So I analyze the car as an average clean Q with 176k on it.

Bottom line is at this point in time, its hard for "newbies" to get into the old Qs.. You either have to have had an old Q for a long time, or had one fairly recently with a lot of knowledge to justify what they are.. I will follow that up with my 94 Q is rock solid reliable and I'd drive it anywhere in its current condition. If the car truly needs nothing for the next 60k miles (hard to predict), at $4000 you will get a lot for the money. Also, I don't care how anal you are, at 176k i'd be concerned about the transmission. Usually they see 200k with marginal to good maintenance, and with proper maintenance can see MANY more miles.

On the flip side, if I were giving advice to the guy selling it, I would tell him to keep the car. Selling a Q45 of this vintage is never a money making proposition. You have to buy an older Q either for salvage parts and throw the rest away, or fix it up properly and keep it forever.

With all that being known, I test drove 3 brand new Infiniti's last week to replace my Q.. I still feel like my 94 Q is a higher quality vehicle than many of the new infiniti's. Sure they have fancier looking interiors and sleeker styling, but truly the driving experience is not the same. The newer infiniti feel nice, but I still feel "at home" in my Q.

While my Q is probably one of the best running Q out there and very reliable, although not super ultra clean, I'd never get 3000 for it..

[qship96]

Well said Wes. I have also driven almost every brand new Infiniti that has been introduced since the G50 series Q stopped being produced- and not a single one of them has that special intangible feel of the original. The m56 has alot of power and modern features, but somehow misses the mark in truly feeling like a flagship vehicle. The g37, again fast and feature laden, but feels more Accord like in quality of interior materials and overall execution than luxury like to me. shame the Audi a8 has a mediocre reliability record, as that car feels like a modern day g50 to me.

[thejfed]

Ok, so here's the deal: my buddy just called and got done looking at/driving the car. Driver side rear c-pillar has a slight dent. Front driver side turn signal is cracked due to a rock hitting it. Barely any road rash on the front. Transmission shifts smoothly and car rides/drives as it should. There is a slight squeal from the passenger side front spring (Eibachs) only at neighborhood speeds. No noises from the suspension at highway speeds. My friend said he has a stack with every maintenance item recorded in a folder. I guess I need to know what exactly has been fixed.

I clearly hear you guys saying this car is over priced..least that's what I think I'm hearing...

[maxnix]

Stillen ECU and TCU? Stillen Brembo brakes rotors? C Pillar dent not easy to correct.

Transmission is going to need replacing soon, especially if he is not running an auxiliary ATF cooler nor performed frequent mechanical fluid exchanges and used M1 ATF. This has been documented by Q45tech. No mention of fluid inspections. Age kills all rubber. If rear sub frame bushings are leaking, he pays you to take it.

[thejfed]

OK, I talked to the owner at length on the phone. He has not done anything outside of maitnence items. He did all the scheduled maitnence (60k, 120k, etc). The injectors, fuel pump, transmission, radiator, etc are all original. I explained on the phone all the big ticket items that haven't been looked at, replaced, etc. He seemed shocked, though he's 70 years old and clearly isn't a NICO member ;-)

So not sure where I'm at on this. I am beginning to think he realizes $6,500 is unrealistic. I don't think he thinks $3k is reasonable...though I'm not confirmed on that. He is leaving tomorrow morning and won't be back until Saturday. He'll be home Sat and Sun and then leaves for three weeks on Monday. He's retired, apparently when you retire you can do whatever you want, can't wait for those days.

Anyways, I left it that I am going to think about it and call him back. So the question is, with only regular (by the book) maintenance performed, what is the car really actually worth? I'm guessing you will say $3k is top dollar...

[BadQ45t]

Walk away. I live in the Bay Area so I can go look at it for you too, but sounds like you already did that. This is just WAY too much money for a car with that much mileage. The prices in the Bay Area tend to be really high and nobody gives bargains. It sounds great, but honestly you can find a 2nd Generation Q with far fewer miles and get it into shape very quickly. Just walk away...if you were on the west coast different story, but too much with too much risk. Tell him to keep your number and to call you if he changes his mind later.

[AZhitman]

I'd keep an eye out for a low-mileage one. It's worth $3k, maybe $3500 if you REALLY want it.

[elwesso]

On the note that AZ mentioned, I don't always think that G50s command extra money for low miles, I believe that it's from maintaining them properly. Low miles and maintenance commands a good price. Fact of the matter is you could buy a regular 94 for 1000 and spend 3k and be as good if not better off

[maxnix]

Transmission alone is about $3K.

[SanCarlosQ45]

Walk away. I live in the Bay Area so I can go look at it for you too, but sounds like you already did that. This is just WAY too much money for a car with that much mileage. The prices in the Bay Area tend to be really high and nobody gives bargains. It sounds great, but honestly you can find a 2nd Generation Q with far fewer miles and get it into shape very quickly. Just walk away...if you were on the west coast different story, but too much with too much risk. Tell him to keep your number and to call you if he changes his mind later.

Prices for G50s in the bay area are usually double what they are actually worth, especially considering they have 20-24" ghetto trash rims because you know those add value ; many of these have new custom paint jobs that make the car cheap looking. The average price for many third or greater owner 94' with similar mileage, rough interiors and little to no maintenance history can go from $2200 to $3300. All prices in the bay area are inflated.

[BadQ45t]

I agree, I live over the hill from you SanCarlos in Half Moon Bay. The guy 4 houses up from me had a 92' A that you could hear coming up the road squeeking and bobbing up and down. He put a sign on it asking $4,500. I was walking the dog past his house and asked about the price (it was also rusty, interior was shot, he told me "this is a rare active suspenion Q45 and he expected a bidding war". Right, dude. He ended up trading it in for $1,100 at a Jaguar dealership on a new X Type. The Bay Area in general is the worst place in the USA to buy a car price wise, people ove pay typically when they buy them new so they think they can pass that "Dealer Added Value Markup" to the next person that comes along.

[thejfed]

I'm taking all your advice. Going to let him know Saturday I just can't stomach the price knowing what will need to be done to it. If he can't sell it and decides to lower the price, call me. Thanks everyone for all the advice. Really appreciate it.

[maxnix]

I think we all believe that is the correct approach. You have more time than he does. Wait and keep looking.

[superuber]

Saying it is a "stillen" isn't true. Just because you bolt on some parts does not make it a stillen. Where is the brembo brake set up? The stillen brakes I got off a real stillen Q only had brembo's up front and z32 in the rear. I don't know if brembo made a rear set up for the G50. Also I thought the stillen Q was running the nos module?
IMO-its not worth 4K. I would be lucky to get 4k for mine!

[Rex]

Lots of GREAT advice here.

I think Wes summed it up best, though I'd add a call out about rust.

Find a non-rusted 94-95 Q45 (non-a preferably) for <$1500 and plan on putting $3500 and you'll have the best $5k car you can find.

All this is assuming you weren't planning on financing a 17 yr old car.

For those brave enough to own an active, there's a nice one in the Classifieds.