Question for people with 300zx brakes.

[slipstream_pnoy]

I've been reading a lot on this topic and pretty much know how to do it. Putting the 300zx front calipers together doesnt concern me, Its the brake cylinder that worries me. Do i need the 300zx Brake Cylinder? I really dont have the proper tools to be cutting or customizing the Brake Cylinder so it can fit on the 240. So basicly what im asking you guys is that, Is it ok to use the stock 240 brake cylinder for the 300zx calipers, if so, is there any defects or do i have pump hard for the brakes to acutally work??? And also what is the differences in braking power when it comes to using the 300zx and the 240 brake cylinder? Thanks in advance.

[ILikeMy240sx]

I have 300zx calipers up front and stock caliipers at the rear.

First I was running stock M/C. Honestly, I didnt think the pedal feel was bad at all. Yes, it felt a bit spongy but Ive felt much worse brakes.

Then I switched over to 300zx 1 1/16 MC and holy chit. The difference is night and day. The pedal feel is much more firm and pedal travel decreased which actually helps me when I heel toe. The difference is so dramatic that even my GF can tell the difference when she drives it.

Anyways, it was a direct swap for my S14... I didnt have to cut any lines or bend anything...

[slipstream_pnoy]

I have 300zx calipers up front and stock caliipers at the rear.

First I was running stock M/C. Honestly, I didnt think the pedal feel was bad at all. Yes, it felt a bit spongy but Ive felt much worse brakes.

Then I switched over to 300zx 1 1/16 MC and holy chit. The difference is night and day. The pedal feel is much more firm and pedal travel decreased which actually helps me when I heel toe. The difference is so dramatic that even my GF can tell the difference when she drives it.

Anyways, it was a direct swap for my S14... I didnt have to cut any lines or bend anything...

Thank you very much bro, now i can do it with confidence.

[dickie]

moved to wheels tires BRAKES suspension.

[redtop91]

The brake bias will be off if you don't use the BMC and I've heard under extreme braking, the upset of balance is enough to cause the rears to lock up before the front wheels.

[Fla240sx]

is it a bolton operation on the S13 as well?

I found some reman'd calipers for a good deal I'm gonna jump on here in a few months when I need new brakes...

I'll try to get a Master Cylinder too.. I never see z32's in junkyards so I'm gonna have to get it new

are all z32 master cylinders the same?

also I don't track my car so I'm going to go with the smaller older Aluminum calipers if it makes any difference

[EstoMax]

for ABS cars, the 300zx MC is a direct bolton. I dont have ABS, so i need to modify a flare fitting according to the definitive guide (http://importnut.net/300zxbrakeswap.htm#MC)

Now the question for me is, my remanufactured MC seems to have that flare fitting in place already, after i remove the nut...pic:

i guess if you get the right remanufactured MC, you dont need to modify for non-abs cars also

Marko

[Fla240sx]

where did u get yours from? or what brand is it

[EstoMax]

cardone from schucks: http://www.partsamerica.com/Pr...Set=A

[vvaffle]

crazy, im pretty sure i got the same part number but mine did not come with the fitting in there.

[94_240sx]

crazy, im pretty sure i got the same part number but mine did not come with the fitting in there.

I got mine from reputable ebay seller and it has a 3rd fitting already installed. It's Tokico 17/16. Tokico and Nabco made several variations and sizes of BMC, so you should be careful when you buy it.

[vvaffle]

do you have a link to that seller? i can probably still return mine to advance auto parts.

[positron1]

I got mine from reputable ebay seller and it has a 3rd fitting already installed. It's Tokico 17/16. Tokico and Nabco made several variations and sizes of BMC, so you should be careful when you buy it.

So some of those Z32 master cylinders that you see on eBay don't have the middle flare fitting for those of us without ABS?

[[email protected]]

Your best bet would be to keep your stock master cylinder which is 7/8 inch bore. After installing the calipers, you will have an overall upgrade of about 10% (there are other improvements associated with multi-piston calipers too). You will also have a 10% increase in the pedal travel and a 10% decrease in effort to apply the same amount of pressure to the rotor. If you put a 300ZX master cylinder in the system, which would either have a 1" or a 1-1/16" bore, you would actually be downgrading your brakes from a pedal effort point of view. The bigger cylinder might seem preferable to you, but just know that you will have to apply 25.5% more effort to the pedal, and you will have a 25.5% decrease in pedal travel for the same brake effect while driving.

I hope I was of assistance

[gumby74]

Isn't that kinda' the point of upgrading the M/C? Firmer pedal with less travel, and less slop? Not being sarcastic at all, but I am confident the Nissan engineers had a reason for using the bigger master cylinders with the appropriate front to rear bias. It only makes sense to use as much of the factory system to insure a consistent, SAFE level of performance. Again, no sarcasm or disrespect intended. If I am mistaken, I will gladly own it. I went from the stock m/c, to the 1" unit (for about 4 years) to just recently the 1 1/16 unit. The difference feels like almost 100 ft shorter stopping distances from stock to 1 1/16. Though its probably closer to 20.Having the rear brakes lock up first is not a good thing. Especially during a hard or panic stop. The tail will pitch out, and as the nose is diving, the braking power is actually decreased. That equals nasty lock up and a nasty slide.You can get a re-man'frd master cylinder for about $50 after the core charge. (about $120 without a core) There is really no reason not to use the correct master cylinder for the brake calipers.As for the fitting, all you need is a couple of drill buts to get the flare fitting out. There is a thread on it somewhere here. Basically, you drill a 1/4" hole on the opposite side of the flare fitting, and using a smaller (about 1/8?)drill bit or small punch to hammer that bad boy out from the inside.Here are a couple of p/n for you. Cardone 11-2560 (this is a Tokico)Cardone 11-2459 (I've heard this is Nabco)These are from O'Reilly's. Either way, the m/c should have BM-57 on the side. The BM-50 is the 1" unit.As for the 3rd flare, I have found that that is hit or miss. You may luck out, but honestly be prepared to install the flare fitting yourself.

[[email protected]]

First, master cylinder basics considering a given amount of effort at the brake pedal; the bigger the cylinder bore, the GREATER the volume delivered and the LOWER the pressure. The smaller the master cylinder bore, the LOWER the volume delivered and the GREATER the system PRESSURE. After the pistons have moved the pads into contact with the rotors (consuming the required volume), the pressure is what does the work. The brake pedal is a lever which increases the driver’s mechanical advantage over the hydraulic system. The greater the pedal ratio the greater the advantage (or leverage) and so the driver is able to apply more force to the master cylinder. This force, via the master cylinder, has a direct relationship to hydraulic system pressure. In addition to this, the booster adds assistance. The booster does not compound the pressure, it just adds. It’s kind of like having the passenger lean over and help with his foot on top of the driver’s (in a manual / non booster system). The effect of the booster has to do with it’s diameter and the engine’s ability to provide vacuum (for the sake of explanation as we all know that vacuum is just a reduction in atmospheric pressure). So, really, we need to factor in the pedal ratio and the boost effect from the booster to have an accurate assessment of the upgrade / downgrade / change. Do both cars produce the same manifold vacuum? And in what state of tune? The more radical the cam shaft the less vacuum generally available to the booster, another factor to consider in the calculation. If someone has the time to take the measurements or otherwise find the data, I can hand it off to an engineer here to do the calculations. In the absence of these data, we can’t really make a good comparison of brake performance, one car to another.

Lets look at brake bias and the need to imagine that Nissan knew what they were doing in the first place (just kidding, I’m a Nissan fan and drive a 300ZX). No one has mentioned making any changes to the rear brakes. If you increase the master cylinder bore size, one of the side effects is a reduction in pressure. Without changes to the rear, the rear brakes will be less effective (for a given system pressure) with this bigger cylinder. This does not maintain the Nissan bias either. So if one thinks one is improving the front end with the big master cylinder (which is not our point of view) while degrading the rear, Nissan’s bias is really out the window.

From a brake upgrade provider’s point of view (which we are) it is always better to match the calipers to the vehicle hydraulic system. In the case of 300ZX calipers on a 240, the factory master cylinder is well within range and requires minimal effort for the installer (no modifications to important components). Also, the rear brake system is still as effective as it was and not degraded by reducing pressure with a bigger cylinder. Because the installer probably doesn’t know the difference in pedal ratios or booster sizes, it’s a better bet to look directly at the effects of the “upgraded” calipers on the existing vehicle system and see if that picture is appealing. We think it is.

BTW, the 300 calipers in question are about 10% bigger (in piston area) than those on the 240, the increase in volume requirement is 10%, the increase in pedal travel is therefore 10% (not considering system flex). From a driver’s point of view, 10% more pedal travel is not that noticeable, but a 10% reduction in pedal effort for a give brake effect is very noticeable. We’d recommend replacing the factory rubber type flex hoses with stainless steel braided hoses too.