Question about wheel and tire fitment

[bishop1]

I know Cakedaddy is running 20x9.5 with a 40 mm offset on the rear. Looks really good. I want to know could he have went with a bigger tire in the back to make the front and back fender gap more even. Also can I go with a 20x10 rim with 40mm offset on the rear without rubbing? If so what size tire would I need?

[CakeDaddy]

You guys are more than welcome to dispute my sayings if you'd like. I am always up for a debate.

Bishop,

I could have gone 20x10, but since the car is lowered with Eibachs.... If I were to have gone with 20x10 with it lowered I would rub for sure. If I had the option of a deeper offset, then maybe.

Help me understand the 1st part of you question more "could he have went with a bigger tire in the back to make the front and back fender gap more even" My only other option was a 275 in the rear, but I was talked out of that due to the car being lowered. It will be impossible to get the same height front and rear, especially with a stagged setup. My front and rear fenders have enough gap to barely hold a quarter. I think my lowering job is as good as it gets without damaging anything, cutting, rolling, modifying, adding spacers, etc.. . I consider it nice and even and “FLUSH” (whatever that means) The next best thing would have been some coilovers, but that will not happen. Hope this helps. Let me know and thanks for the props.


Modified by CakeDaddy at 7:38 AM 5/27/2008

[bishop1]

That is what I ment going bigger 275 in the rear. I also have a pair of Eibach springs that am getting ready to have installed. Since the 20x10 won't work I will have to go with 20x8.5 35mm offset front and rear. Will a 265 tire in the rear give me the best look far as fender gap? Thanks for the help.

[paperfootball]

I am dropped on TEINS with 20x10 (40mm) /275-30 and I don't rub at all. The tires are Bridgestone--some tires have a taller sidewall in the same size.

The answer to just about every fitment question is "it depends."

[CakeDaddy]

That is what I ment going bigger 275 in the rear. I also have a pair of Eibach springs that am getting ready to have installed. Since the 20x10 won't work I will have to go with 20x8.5 35mm offset front and rear. Will a 265 tire in the rear give me the best look far as fender gap? Thanks for the help.

Congrats on scoring some eibachs. Best springs out there for this car in my opinion, but anyhow.......... so you are going 20x8.5 all around? If so, the 20x8.5 rear with a 265 will probably fill the gap a little more than my rears. The 20x8.5 will be less stretched across the tire which should be a bit higher. Now, are you sure you want to use the same offset for front and rear? 34mm offset for the rear seems odd, especially for a staggered setup. My suggestion is to not play yourself short. If the rim mfg can't meet your offset and width needs, keep it moving and look for another. I'm not feeling 20x8.5 all around with a stagged tires only, especially with 34mm all around. The whole idea of stagging rims and tires is to obtain that deep look in the rears.

you want the largest rear lip possible

Question: which tire mfg are you shopping that has 265/30's? I was only able to find the BFGoodies Comp T/A at the time. Which was fine with me.


Modified by CakeDaddy at 10:06 AM 5/27/2008

[bishop1]

Congrats on scoring some eibachs. Best springs out there for this car in my opinion, but anyhow.......... so you are going 20x8.5 all around? If so, the 20x8.5 rear with a 265 will probably fill the gap a little more than my rears. The 20x8.5 will be less stretched across the tire which should be a bit higher. Now, are you sure you want to use the same offset for front and rear? 34mm offset for the rear seems odd, especially for a staggered setup. My suggestion is to not play yourself short. If the rim mfg can't meet your offset and width needs, keep it moving and look for another. I'm not feeling 20x8.5 all around with a stagged tires only, especially with 34mm all around. The whole idea of stagging rims and tires is to obtain that deep look in the rears.

Question: which tire mfg are you shopping that has 265/30's? I was only able to find the BFGoodies Comp T/A at the time. Which was fine with me.

Modified by CakeDaddy at 9:49 AM 5/27/2008

Forgive my ignorance I'm new at this. What is a stggered setup? I look threw the archives and I read the factory offset was 35mm. If this is incorrect can you give me the front and rear offsets. I have not looked at tires yet I was just asking for advice on the 265 tire on the rear.

[CakeDaddy]

Forgive my ignorance I'm new at this. What is a stggered setup? I look threw the archives and I read the factory offset was 35mm. If this is incorrect can you give me the front and rear offsets. I have not looked at tires yet I was just asking for advice on the 265 tire on the rear.

staggered setup is simply using different tire/rim size. example: I'm using a 20x8.5 with a 245/35 tire front and 20x9.5 with a 265/30 tire rear and my tires are wide in the rear to somewhat match the rim. This car has a huge a$$, so in order to fill in some of that space, staggering the wheels the way. Next time you get a chance take a look at a newer BMW 5 or 7 series front and rear tire sizes.

quote:"If you have a RWD car and would like to take it to the next level consider running a staggered wheel package. Staggering wheels involves using wheels of larger width in the rear of the vehicle for a more eye-catching look. This can also allow for a wider tire and significantly increases handling and tire grip"

Advantage- Looks Great and Handles like a dream!

The Dis - You can't rotate

Oh, I have no idea what the factory offset are, and if you going with 20's forget the factory offset. All that will change with new rims, especially 20's
Modified by CakeDaddy at 10:33 AM 5/27/2008

[THT]

Advantage- Looks Great and Handles like a dream!

The Dis - You can't rotate

Oh, I have no idea what the factory offset are, and if you going with 20's forget the factory offset. All that will change with new rims, especially 20's

Also more expensive to have different sizes. Factory offset is +35 for the Y34.

[szh]

Also more expensive to have different sizes. Factory offset is +35 for the Y34.

Yup! All those specifications are in our stickies, by the way.

Z

[maxnix]

"If you have a RWD car and would like to take it to the next level consider running a staggered wheel package. Staggering wheels involves using wheels of larger width in the rear of the vehicle for a more eye-catching look. This can also allow for a wider tire and significantly increases handling and tire grip"

Advantage- Looks Great and Handles like a dream!

The Dis - You can't rotate

The other disadvantage is that you are altering the cars dynamic balance by increasing rear traction over front in most cases, and decreasing the slip angle of the rear tires realtive to the front, which increase understeer and actually degrades handling.

The main thing is to at least meet the OEM minimum load rating specifications, and it is the front that is critical since in dyanamic wieght transfer in cornering and braking, more stress is here than on the rears. Exceeding these minimum specifications will bear benfits in cornering, braking, and wear performance, all other characteristcs being equal.

But if static looks and fender gap is paramount over wheel weight and strength and tire construction quality and strength, performance may not be a consideration.

[datsun2401972]

ROFLMAO at the magnum XL's used to measure the lip....wow....

[regtwelve]

Deep dish rims are ugly. They make the back of the car appear hollow and wimpy from most angles. They also cause the spokes of the rim to be cut short, giving the wheel an undersized dimunitive look. Rims with spokes stretched to the outer lip look more massive, and attractive.

I can't imagine why if deep dish looks so good that at least on sports car mfgr wouldn't use them. A great example is the lambo murci.. they go to great lenghts to avoid a dish look by stretching and angling the spokes in crazy ways, the previous gen rear wheel of this car had spokes stretched and twisted to the point of being ugly just to avoid the dreaded dish look. I just searched the porsche website, nope, absolutley no dish anywhere. ferrari, negative, totally dishless. Dish went out with vanilla ice's 93 911 turbo widebody, its now considered quite the eyesore.

Obviously Infiniti or lexus, and other more traditional manufactures don't use dish. Absolutley nobody does.

Maybe somoeone could pull up a link to an 08' car with a 4" rear dish? not gonna happen. dish is dead.

[jadeM45]

Deep dish rims are ugly. They make the back of the car appear hollow and wimpy from most angles. They also cause the spokes of the rim to be cut short, giving the wheel an undersized dimunitive look. Rims with spokes stretched to the outer lip look more massive, and attractive.

I can't imagine why if deep dish looks so good that at least on sports car mfgr wouldn't use them. A great example is the lambo murci.. they go to great lenghts to avoid a dish look by stretching and angling the spokes in crazy ways, the previous gen rear wheel of this car had spokes stretched and twisted to the point of being ugly just to avoid the dreaded dish look. I just searched the porsche website, nope, absolutley no dish anywhere. ferrari, negative, totally dishless. Dish went out with vanilla ice's 93 911 turbo widebody, its now considered quite the eyesore.

Obviously Infinity or lexus, and other more traditional manufactures don't use dish. Absolutley nobody does.

Maybe somoeone could pull up a link to an 08' car with a 4" rear dish? not gonna happen. dish is dead.

Everyone has a right to their own opinion, and mine is dish is not dead. Just because Manufacturers don’t use them does not mean they are out.

There are a lot of things that manufacturers don’t use, and it’s not because they aren’t cool or in, its bottom line and mass appeal. Carbon fiber is barley used in OEM, titanium is barely used in OEM.

Dished rims are more expensive to make, heavier and not something that an OEM would foot the bill for. Every major aftermarket company is using them.

I know you can say that companies like Lamborghini and Ferrari don’t worry about costs but they have other reasons for using flat face wheels.

Most of the supercars you find are not using them because they are using one piece forged rims for strength and weight savings. When you are working to make a car as fast as possible you look to reduce unsprung weight and the wheels are one of the first places to go to.

Here is one OEM offering a car with Dished rims It’s the new Porsche GT3 RSR.

Techart, Gemballa, AC Schnitzer, Brabus & Hamann all offer them.

They all offer both "dished" and flat rims, because there are a wide variety of customers with a wide difference of tastes.

[regtwelve]

Thank you for the picture of the winning Lemans race car with no AC. Funny, you say dish are too heavy and not as strong as flat faced one piece rims, yet the only example of a car with a deep dish wheel you could find is a a half million dollar race car. LOL.

dish is ugly and yes, other than to the justin timberlake chromies, its dead.

[CakeDaddy]

Thank you for the picture of the winning Lemans race car with no AC. Funny, you say dish are too heavy and not as strong as flat faced one piece rims, yet the only example of a car with a deep dish wheel you could find is a a half million dollar race car. LOL.

dish is ugly and yes, other than to the justin timberlake chromies, its dead.

“Dish is ugly” “dish is dead” chrome is for “Justin Timberlake Chromies” (whatever that means.) This is that hate a negativity I’m talking about. Try adding something useful that fits the topic next time. I respect everyone’s opinion, but DAMN!!!! Must you keep reminding us how much you hate………….

As of today (5-28-08) you have 24 post and I'll bet my Justin Timberlake CD that a 1/4 of them are geared toward what you hate or dis-like. Good Job!!

[jadeM45]

Actually that car can be purchased from Porsche for 300k. I know it’s a bad example of OEM but I thought it was funny.

In general dished rims are heavier. It’s hard to make a single piece forged rim to fit the width needed for that car. When you make them lighter they loose durability which is not acceptable to an OEM of for a street car.

I’m not a big fan of rims without a lip or dish because I feel it makes the car look less muscular. The ONLY advantage to them is that they make a small rim look bigger. You can get away with running a 18 and it could look like a 20 with dish.

I think its hard to say this car looks bad or "timberlakeish". I’m pretty sure HRE would be out of business if dish was actually dead.

[regtwelve]

nono, that car is 300,000 euros, 500,000 dollars.

http://www.edmunds.com/insidel...24772

It's purely a race car, they are going to make 35 of them. Posting a picture of Dale Jarrett's UPS car doesn't count either.

This horse is dead, but, I am going to theorize really quickly as to why the aftermarket wheel world is full of dished rims, yet the oem world has none (even the exotics).

1. OEM rims are designed for the sole purpose of fitting one application. The axle length, fender protrusion, and every other dimension is figured at the same time, allowing for the precise design of a rim to perfectly fit and look flush. They could choose to design a car and purposely have a dished rim, a one piece, with precisely the same weight and strength of a flush one piece, yet they always choose not too. They choose not too because they don't think people will like it, and ultimately less people will buy it.

This rule doesn't just apply to a chevy malibu, but also to a ferrari 599, and a bugatti veyron. Even cars with lots of carbon fibre and and 12 inch wide wheels don't have dish. It has absolutley nothing to do with cost, or strength, it has everything to do with looks.

Because aftermarket rims have to be designed to fit many different offsets, it is Cheaper to build wheels with dish. The face of the wheel is simply attached at different depths of the rim cylinder, this way only one face and one cylinder can be used to fit infinite offsets. If the mfgr was to try to build flush rims for all applications, they would need to make many different rim faces all with defferent thicknesses in order to allow for a flush look/ correct offset. That would certainly be costlier.

So as long as people measure their pimpness by the width of their dish, rather than the costlier and widely accepted good looks standard of flush rims, then people will continue taking your money so that your car can look uglier.

[datsun2401972]

Everyone has a right to their opinion.

But the FACT is, dish is here to stay.

And my friend's lotus esprit has factory wheels with a massive lip...

[bishop1]

Thanks for all the info. much appreciated.

[jadeM45]

How about this, Dish just looks better. My opinion, yours is it does not. Lets agree to disagree.

Thats why the aftermarket offers both.

[CakeDaddy]

Thanks for all the info. much appreciated.

I think you got more info than what you originally asked , buy hey…. Keep us posted on what you decide.I hope all of your questions were answered, but feel free hit me up via email if you’d like @ [email protected] if I can help fill in the blank on any other questions or just post them here if you dare LOL j/k Also, consider putting your eibachs on first.