Q45 tires

[rover3l]

My 1994 Q45a has Michelin Pilots. Are these the correct tires for this model. I seem to have a road noise issue which seems to be worse after rotating the tires. They were rotated because the car was pulling slightly to the right. After rotating the car is pulling very slightly to the left but the slope in the road offsets this mostly. I have noticed however that there seems to be more road noise, like a rotating noise that is now worse. Could I have a defective tire construction?

Thanks

David

[Exar-Kun]

what size, and model pilot? how are they worn? we cant diagnose you rproblem with outa bit more info did you have your alignment checked recently?-chet

[szh]

Hi, David.

If you have had them properly balanced (like on a Hunter 9700), and have less than 7k-10k miles on them, then you may well have a defective tire. The Michelin Pilots are strong tires (although I dislike their wet weather handling immensely) and it is unusual (but not unheard of) for them to have a defect.

BTW, I assume you are talking about the Pilot XGT V4 or Pilot XGT H4. If not, then which model?

Z

[rover3l]

They are 215 /65's 15 inch XGT H4's which are about 1/3 worn. I had the alignment done on Saturday and the tires rotated. This solved a pulling to the RHS but now it pulls slightly to the left and there is this noise I mentioned which is a sort of rotation noise / road noise that was not evident before the rotation. I did not get them balanced as there was no problems with steering wheel vibration at any speed

David

[Q45tech]

215/65/15 in any Pilot version is too weak for the Q45a.Even though the original oem size was the same, the oem Sport XGTV was a re-enforced double sidewall tire........designed to wear out in 16-17,000 miles [the max time they could survive the stress]......modern tires just have harder tread compounds and surely aren't as strong inside to last as long as the tread!

Next time try the Pilot H4 in 235/60/15 size, the extra 120+ pounds [8%] of reserve works wonders.

Is you Q aligned perfectly to the center of the oem range not just in the wide acceptable range?

Even the non directional tires heel/toe feather [just takes longer] so rotations every oil change [3,750/90 days] are the desired point. The noise will go away as the feathering wears down.

Remember alignment is actually MISalignment...........a number derived sitting still that will end up correct rolling down the road at 60 mph.Unfortunately the factory assummed all parts would be near new in coming up with specs............worn deformed bushings mean the toe/camber/caster numbers have to be evaluated based on tire patterns [wear].............takes a genius to figure out.

Of all the tires out there in 15" the H4 are the quietest over their life, some others are great for 5-6k and get very loud.Pretty much after 20,000 miles all bets are off as the tuned antinoise design has worn down.

The other thing is tire/wheel balance: Assuming oem wheels you should have no more than 10 grams of weight per side [total 15 grams] per tire.............anymore that that means something is wrong..........which can turn a good tire bad or shows that internal damage has occurred in the tire!

You would be surprised at how many Q have a tire with 40-50-60 grams of weight necessary to balance.

[Grant@tirerack]

Q45Tech is correct, the noise should fade somewhat as the tires wear. If the alignment was off you likely have some uneven wear on one or more of the tires. When they rotated the tires it moved the sounds as well.

[maxnix]

Even the non directional tires heel/toe feather [just takes longer] so rotations every oil change [3,750/90 days] are the desired point. The noise will go away as the feathering wears down.

Of all the tires out there in 15" the H4 are the quietest over their life, some others are great for 5-6k and get very loud.Pretty much after 20,000 miles all bets are off as the tuned antinoise design has worn down.

I would respectfully demure here, as neither my 225/60-15 Yokohama AVS dB nor my 215/65-15 XGT V4 have either feathered or increased in noise. However, I would advocate flipping the tires on the rims at least every 5K-6K no matter which brand or design they are. I am old school and prefer my radial tires rotate in one direction only throughout their life. I am told by every tire tech this is no longer necessary nor tire manufacturer recommended.

Also, I don't drive 7-9/10ths all the time. This is a two ton luxury car, although much more capable than most. I drive it as such 98% of the time.

I do seem to be replacing the front upper links about every 20K, though. Any looseness, and they are gone.

In spite of the above, I would recommend you follow Q45tech's advice as he is much more experienced and knowledgeable than I am. Probably more perceptive, also.

[szh]

I do seem to be replacing the front upper links about every 20K, though. Any looseness, and they are gone.

Agreed! I did my upper links about every 20k to 25k miles.

Z

[rover3l]

Wow thanks for all the great education, I did not know any of this as it relates to the Q. I will wait to see if the noise disappears as the rotated tires wear. Also I am intrigued to hear that the Pilots are not really suitable for the Q. Do you think it is ok to keep on using them until they wear or should they be replaced.

Excuse my ignorance but could someone clarify the upper links comment. How can I tell if mine are worn?

[docsmile71]

Excuse my ignorance but could someone clarify the upper links comment. How can I tell if mine are worn?

You will hear a rattling sound from the front suspension as you go over bumps. At least that's how I found out I needed new upper links. I got my upper links replaced at 50K along with shocks and struts. Harsh NYC roads you know.

[Q45tech]

"I do seem to be replacing the front upper links about every 20K, though. Any looseness, and they are gone."

If they are going that fast, check your kingpin bearings/kingpins and the lower A arm. Something else is worn not controlling the movements letting the upper links wear too fast.

Took me 10 years of upper link changes [ 6 units to figure this out]............changing the KP bearings seems to have doubled the UL life so far and much less vibration in the steering wheel.

All things on the passenger side wear faster as the edge of the road/curbs are rougher!

Visualize all the joints [rubber or bearing isolated] in the suspension.

[maxnix]

Thanks Dennis, I will do that. It is happening on both cars, in different locations and with different driving habits. I have heard that the links can fail even if the car just sits. So I thought it may be related to time, rather than road wear. Not sure how time would contribute after I inspected them.

Maybe it's the bearings on the lower arm, but they seemd OK on the one that was just changed.__________________Brian1995 Q45 & Q45t & 2000 Q45

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[rover3l]

So far in 3 weeks of ownership I haven't noticed any suspension noises from the front but as mentioned in another post I do seem to have rattles from the rear over bumpy roads. So far I had assumed this might be related to the active suspension not being as active as it should be. Are there any other potential causes I should look at. One minor things is when I remove the carpet in the trunk the hardboardon top of the spare wheel doesn't seem to be tied down and I can't see any way of fixing it solidly. Should it be this way?

[maxnix]

It fits atop the plastic formed bin that covers the wheel well. If you don't have it, order from Joe. Or cruise the junk yard.__________________Brian1995 Q45 & Q45t & 2000 Q45

Discover the power of the button!

[rover3l]

Ok I have secured the hardboard spare tire cover on the plastic tray that was actually there. The rattle from the rear is there on a very rough surface so it seems that there must be another source??

On the tire issue it seems as if the recommendation is 235X15 60 Michelins. Will I notice any deterioration in ride quality due to the lower profile? Also what is the performance of this tire in the wet and snow? I am assuming it will be poor. If so what is the recommendation for a winter tire to cope with the Buffalo winters?I have read that for the Traction Control System to work correctly it is important to have the correct tire compound otherwise the system can kick in before it should do

[PalmerWMD]

Do <not> run Michelin tires in a Buffola winter.Swicth to a set of dedicated winter tires soon.

Anything else might be penny wise but pound foolish ( crash)

Fred..

PS: I totaled my last car gourgoeus near perfect Q cuz I ran my summer tires ( which are ok in KY year 'round) when visiting family up north.