Well there haven't been any events worth going to in a while, so I figured I'd work on my car. I've gotten a lot of stuff done in the last couple months.
I've never seen any good write-ups on Haltech's stuff on here, so I figured I'd do it. Here goes...
As many of you know, I built a Megasquirt modified to control ignition also, and have had it on my car for a few months. It was a great setup, worked very well for what it was. Long story short I talked to haltech and after a lot of thinking, I decided to try it out. I went with an E8, with a flying lead harness, and LS1 (corvette) individual coil ignition.
The build Quality is incredible. One look at the board in the ecu was all it took to convince me. There are easily 10x the number of components in the haltech than the MegaSquirt. That's how many more functions it performs, easily. Dave at Haltech actually installed the harness for me, and let me tell you, it's incredible! He heat shrunk every inch of wire to seal it better than the stock harness, and covered about 90% of it in flame retardant material. It's amazing.
I decided I wanted to run the LS1 coils because they are about the most potent mass produced coils available. They are NUTS. Getting bit by them hurts like hell! They have built in ignitiors too, so no need for another ignition module to control them. Paired with the custom MSD 8.5mm super conductor wires I made, it's pretty much the most bad arse ignition system you can get. And the haltech runs all of it. The wires only have about 40 ohms per foot of resistance, so it's performs just about identical to a coil over plug setup. You don't need to make any kind of custom trigger wheel for the ignition either like I did for my MegaSquirt. It just takes the signal from the stock distirbutor, easy as pie.
My megasquirt had an internal map sensor (on the ecu itself) which is an ok design, but requires you to run a vacuum line into the cabin to the ecu. It's just a design prone to failure. The E8 uses an external sensor which is much better than the internal design, and response is better because the vacuum signal doesn't have to travel to the ecu. My map sensor line is no more than a foot long, really cool.
Alright, enough talking, pics now!
the haltech installed. where is it? haha hid all the wires!
ran the harness under the manifold. You can see the wires all heat shrunk.
The LS1 coils and wires and whatnot. Made a cool aluminum bracket for them too.
coils up close
another...
a closeup of the map sensor, harness in its heat wrap, and distribution block
while Dave did the engine harness, I relocated my battery, slimmed down the chassis harness, and fuse block
Where else would you put the ECU? hahaha I love it!
And for ****s and giggles...
Impressions: We got it running about a week ago and I've been tuning it since. It literally fired up the first try, and held a rock solid idle with the base map! I was amazed. It is technologically light years ahead of the MegaSquirt. I'm really glad I decided to try the Haltech out. Even with it fully tuned, the MegaSquirt couldn't hold the idle under 1krpms or it would fluctuate really bad and act up. The Haltech will hold it at 500 rpms if I want it to, and purr like a kitten. And this is with no idle control valves or anything! The tuning software is very straight forward, and easy to learn. The E8 tunes by every 250 rpms, versus the 500 with MegaSquirt. This allows much finer tuning, and extraction of extra hp.
And the best thing about the E8 on a four cylinder engine is that it has enough drivers to run the fuel injection fully sequentially and the ignition direct fire. This means each injector fires by itslef, not in pairs like the MegaSquirt, and each spark plug fires seperately, not batched like the MegaSqurit. And with the right tuning, you can get each injector to fire when the intake valve is closed, so when the fuel reaches the valve it is open. This is obviously far superior to two injectors firing at tdc. More hp and tq to be had with this setup. And having each plug fire independently is much better than firing in pairs, because one doesn't need to fire when the other does, which can create problems if you have any extra fuel in the cylinder that is not supposed to be firing.
The E8 does all kinds of other stuff too. boost control, fan control (which I'm running), tach output, wideband control, and about 10 other things I can't think of, it's crazy. You can also select the type of rev limiter you want. I did spark cut on all 4 cylinders at the same time, so it's gonna sound like all hell has broken loose, with complementary fireballs! rock on!
Cliffsnotes: the E8 ROCKS! I'm REALLY stoked I got one! If you want the most from your engine, there's nothing better. Period.
I also got some JWT cam! I can tell once I get it all tuned, they are gonna make it a whole new engine. Thanks to them. I'd suggest anyone who wants cams for their ka, get JWT. I should be getting on the dyno by the end of this week, so we'll see what the new setup makes. I'll be sure to post up the dyno!
Anyone who has any questions about their ecu's or capabilities, contact Dave at Haltech USA.
[email protected]
Regards,Scott
Modified by PandaS14 at 2:15 PM 12/13/2005
Put a Haltech on my ITB KA!
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InsanityInc
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Re: (InsanityInc)
that could be the case. hopefully by the end of this week we'll know. The MS isn't so much lackluster, it's just that the Haltech is top notch. In all honesty, I've looked into motec's also, and the E8 and E11v2 are basically Motec's at half the price. It's the best stuff you can get.
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InsanityInc
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Re: (PandaS14)
No real sequential injection, no direct-fire ignition and only being able to fire two injectors simultanously sound like they could cause some problems though.PandaS14 wrote:that could be the case. hopefully by the end of this week we'll know. The MS isn't so much lackluster, it's just that the Haltech is top notch. In all honesty, I've looked into motec's also, and the E8 and E11v2 are basically Motec's at half the price. It's the best stuff you can get.
Re: (InsanityInc)
I agree completely.InsanityInc wrote:
No real sequential injection, no direct-fire ignition and only being able to fire two injectors simultanously sound like they could cause some problems though.
I never thought those things made that much of a difference, until I started it up with the Haltech for the first time. Good god it's smooth...
Re: (PandaS14)
Thats so cool! About how much did it run you Panda?
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deviousKA
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Install looks good Scott, nice work!
I see that the mega has been put in the grave in this post (i know that wasnt an intention), Ill have to agree with a few things such as idle quality which can only be obtained with sequential, but this is very minor as far as all out performance is concerned.
With your E8, if/when you go to staged injection your going to be batching them up same as the MS and you will be losing your individual drivers. Nothing wrong with this, it works great. With the megasquirt you can control each batch with seperate fuel maps at the same time, full time dual-table. I will be setting this up along with full ms2 as the winter progresses, cant wait.
Ms2 has 1us fuel resolution and 24mhz processor, thats about 6 times the resolution of a top of the line haltech and around 8 mhz faster processor. The reason the megasquirts are so simple is because the main processor controls much more than most ecus and does not require external a/d converters and the like. They use the latest and greatest processors.
The fueling table steps are user definable on the maps, the increments are only relative to how much range you want on your map and where you want this resolution concentrated (torque peak). I assume the haltech can go smaller than 250rpm steps, that is really only a interpolation factor not a resolution factor. I imagine the base rpm steps are smaller simply due to the larger table size, 32x32 right?
and btw, the megasquirts map sensor can be external
Im still with my position that megasquirt is the best hands down, but it isnt as easy to work with.
^"budget opinion"
Setup is very nice Scott, should reek havok at the next event.
Modified by deviousKA at 5:22 AM 12/14/2005
I see that the mega has been put in the grave in this post (i know that wasnt an intention), Ill have to agree with a few things such as idle quality which can only be obtained with sequential, but this is very minor as far as all out performance is concerned.
With your E8, if/when you go to staged injection your going to be batching them up same as the MS and you will be losing your individual drivers. Nothing wrong with this, it works great. With the megasquirt you can control each batch with seperate fuel maps at the same time, full time dual-table. I will be setting this up along with full ms2 as the winter progresses, cant wait.
Ms2 has 1us fuel resolution and 24mhz processor, thats about 6 times the resolution of a top of the line haltech and around 8 mhz faster processor. The reason the megasquirts are so simple is because the main processor controls much more than most ecus and does not require external a/d converters and the like. They use the latest and greatest processors.
The fueling table steps are user definable on the maps, the increments are only relative to how much range you want on your map and where you want this resolution concentrated (torque peak). I assume the haltech can go smaller than 250rpm steps, that is really only a interpolation factor not a resolution factor. I imagine the base rpm steps are smaller simply due to the larger table size, 32x32 right?
and btw, the megasquirts map sensor can be external
Im still with my position that megasquirt is the best hands down, but it isnt as easy to work with.
^"budget opinion"
Setup is very nice Scott, should reek havok at the next event.
Modified by deviousKA at 5:22 AM 12/14/2005
Re: (deviousKA)
Yeah, I wasn't trying to cast the MS in a bad light at all. It's what got me where I am now, in terms of engine management. (And I thank you Gabe for introducing me to it, and helping me with all of it!!!) It was a great setup, and MS2 would be a big upgrade from MS. Your setup is gonna be killer Gabe!
the E8 actually has a 32bit processor. Yeah, it's 32x32. There's a couple ways I could do it when I go staged, but yeah, I'll probably go batched. Or I could do an E11 and run all 8 injectors sequentially. that's a long ways down the road.
The other thing about the E8 that is nice is that it has configurable outputs already built in. So you don't have to make changes to the board to control your fan, run external map sensor, barometric correction, etc. For example the Barometric correction circuit is a standard feature, with a fully adjustable correction map. MS2 has barometric correction as an option, and is not adjustable. And if you are turbo it has built in boost maps that it controls via its own solenoid. Haltech also has a fuel correction map for low battery voltage, to keep your engine running longer, and better.
Another nice thing is that if something goes wrong with the Haltech, you have someone to send it to, call up, etc. When I was having my problems with my ignition on my MegaSquirt, I checked the forums, asked a new question, and nobody had had the same problem. Not until like 4 months later did someone have the same problem and figure it out. That cost me numerous track events and could have cost me a lot more. I enjoy figuring stuff out and building stuff (ITB's and MS as evidence), but there is definately a line where it just sucks.
Megasquirt is definately the budget option tho. No questions asked. After having worked with the Haltech I'm putting it in the #1 spot for standalones, but MS is definately #2.
It's all a matter of opinion in the end. Everyone's setup requires something different. The only constraint in the end for most of us is the $$$.
the E8 actually has a 32bit processor. Yeah, it's 32x32. There's a couple ways I could do it when I go staged, but yeah, I'll probably go batched. Or I could do an E11 and run all 8 injectors sequentially. that's a long ways down the road.
The other thing about the E8 that is nice is that it has configurable outputs already built in. So you don't have to make changes to the board to control your fan, run external map sensor, barometric correction, etc. For example the Barometric correction circuit is a standard feature, with a fully adjustable correction map. MS2 has barometric correction as an option, and is not adjustable. And if you are turbo it has built in boost maps that it controls via its own solenoid. Haltech also has a fuel correction map for low battery voltage, to keep your engine running longer, and better.
Another nice thing is that if something goes wrong with the Haltech, you have someone to send it to, call up, etc. When I was having my problems with my ignition on my MegaSquirt, I checked the forums, asked a new question, and nobody had had the same problem. Not until like 4 months later did someone have the same problem and figure it out. That cost me numerous track events and could have cost me a lot more. I enjoy figuring stuff out and building stuff (ITB's and MS as evidence), but there is definately a line where it just sucks.
Megasquirt is definately the budget option tho. No questions asked. After having worked with the Haltech I'm putting it in the #1 spot for standalones, but MS is definately #2.
It's all a matter of opinion in the end. Everyone's setup requires something different. The only constraint in the end for most of us is the $$$.
Re: (TrueSlide)
it's not fully tuned yet (still doing it) but yeah, it's damn hard too keep my foot off the floor. This setup ROCKS!
Re: (TrueSlide)
no ****! I've been meaning to do so for quite a while. I just don't have a video camera. I've got an event this weekend, so hopefully someone will get a clip or two of me.
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deviousKA
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Re: (PandaS14)
I didnt intend to sound like an *** with my comments above, sorry about that Scott. It didnt have anything to do with the topic anyways.
The haltechs do look pretty good, nice ecu enclosure and connectors also!
The haltechs do look pretty good, nice ecu enclosure and connectors also!
Re: (deviousKA)
Nah bro, no hard feelings! They're both at the top of the list for EMS, that's the bottom line.
All the connectors are GM. Almost everything they use is GM.
All the connectors are GM. Almost everything they use is GM.
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projectka-t
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Re: (jcamp89)
So do we ahve any #'s ???? sounds BAD @$$