PSA: Do yourself a favor, pop your hood once in a while

Forum for Infiniti M37, M56 M35h Hybrid and Q70 owners.
EdBwoy
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And after you pop your hood, check your oil. Pull your dipstick and look at it. Some cars have an oil level indicator, I don't know any Nissan that will tell you that you're running low.

I know that most modern engines consume oil to a certain extent. I have seen it in many different makes and models of vehicle. This post isn't to argue about how acceptable or unacceptable it is.
This is the situation we find ourselves in and have to make the best of it.

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We can all agree that a car is useless without an engine, right?
  • An engine is essentially a collection of metal parts
  • Some of these metal parts run by each other at thousands of cycles per minute in set tolerances.
  • To enable smooth motion of these metal parts, a lubricant is used between these metal parts to ensure they don't touch each other. In our case, the lubricant is automotive engine oil.
If the lubricant system fails, the metal parts don't run by each other as smoothly and might in fact rub against each other.
  • You might or might not hear these sounds as they rub against each other.
  • When most materials rub against each other, friction happens.
  • Friction eats away at parts that were supposed to be smooth which creates gaps.
  • This will affect how the engine runs, because it was designed as a relatively tight sealed unit.
Friction also creates a lot of heat.
  • Heat makes solids expand and sometimes distort.
  • When these engine metals expand and distort, they behave outside of previously predetermined patterns and paths.
  • This will cause more friction and impact with parts that previously slid against each other over a nice oil film.
  • Eventually knocking noises will start and in the end a rod is thrown or the engine locks up.
So yeah, you could say oil is the lifeblood of your vehicle. I know for a fact that most people don't check their oil. When you have a car whose engine is a known oil consumer, the situation is even more critical that you stay aware...or have someone else do the due diligence for you (shop, friend etc)
Even a relatively low maintenance engine can consume more oil at one time or another depending on driving conditions, etc. So it's best you check it.
Check it:
  • Before you buy it
  • Before you borrow it
  • Before a long trip
  • Before you drive it hard & after
  • Before your oil change & after
  • On a regular schedule, like every morning/week/month...or using the maintenance menu of your car that can be set to remind you every X miles.
It's an exercise that shouldn't cost any money, and takes up very little time.
Every bit of neglect adds up. It might all come crashing down on the poor guy that buys it when you sell it off, or something catastrophic might happen while you still own it.


EdBwoy
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The following is a quote that I've said in many different situations:

DurableOilAMSOIL wrote:
Sat Apr 07, 2018 8:54 pm

... tiers of oil 1. OE Series which is to be changed at your manufacturer specified intervals. 2. XL Series which last 12,000 miles or 1 year. 3. Signature Series which lasts 25,000 miles or one year.
...


I have no doubt oil can be engineered to last 25,000 miles. I'll tell you why this can be scary. In a lot of modern cars I've driven, and as seen in these forums, oil usage is sometimes unavoidable.
This is no blame to AMSOIL, but people generally don't maintain or attend to their cars like they should. For example, a car with a 5 qt sump might burn/consume/use half a quart of oil every 1,000 miles. If the owner takes the car to a shop for oil changes at every 3,000 miles, they will be 1.5 qt short and wouldn't know.
However, imagine this same person were to buy some extended-life oil that promises 12,000 miles. The engine consumption is still steady at half a quart per 1K miles and if you do the math, by 10,000 miles, this engine will be air-lubricated and bad things happen because 5 quarts have been consumed out of the 5 quart oil pan/ reservoir.

I have seen it a lot, and that is why I encourage people to constantly check their dipsticks* [if so equipped - I'm watching you BMW]. Again, no blame to any oil brand, but it is a caveat I like to point out whenever long-life oil is brought up.

Because as much as this quote could be true, noone will stand behind your damaged engine but you.
No other company stands behind their oil and filters like AMSOIL.

Larz
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So true ! Those brands / formulas probably DO pass testing that confirms the high mileage claim. HOWEVER, I firmly believe that since oil is the blood of any engine, and since engines costs thousands to repair, AND since most warranty or car companies are well known for finding ways not to pay .... I have my Mobil-1 and my filter changed every 3-4 months which usually accounts for maybe 3,000 miles. I use the 'high mileage' Mobil-1 and I ignore the long oil interval on the label. I am probably spending more on oil changes than I need to but guess what? If I am spending an extra $50 per year changing my oil early, I can continue to do that for 100 years before my extra spending equals replacing 1 engine.
It boils down to this: Spend an extra $50 per year because you change it early, or face a $5,000 bill because the label said you 'can' wait longer only to have the company duck and run when your claim arrives at their desk.

GMBQ70
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Excellent PSA- Thanks for the reminder. :dblthumb:

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cliffyk
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Once a week for me, for the last 35+ years; prior to that it was once a day cause with "kid's in school" and all I drove junk cars...

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armybrat
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EdBwoy wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:03 pm
...It's an exercise that shouldn't cost any money, and takes up very little time.
Every bit of neglect adds up. It might all come crashing down on the poor guy that buys it when you sell it off, or something catastrophic might happen while you still own it.
Yep. I believe the few 5.6 engine failures we've seen here on this forum, Facebook groups, etc. have happened because of letting the oil level get too low. Just because you have the car serviced regularly doesn't mean squat...it's what you do in between that counts.

I can't speak for the other make/models, but you will have to add oil to your engine in between the scheduled service maintenance if you own the 5.6 model. I'm running catch cans and still have to add some in between changes.

EdBwoy
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Good points y'all. Thanks for the input.

cliffyk wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:44 pm
Once a week for me, for the last 35+ years; prior to that it was once a day cause with "kid's in school" and all I drove junk cars...
Cliffyk, I hope you don't mind me following up. You've driven cars longer than I have been alive.
What did you find while maintaining those cars from those days? Were they any better, worse or the same at oil consumption?

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armybrat
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EdBwoy wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:31 am
Good points y'all. Thanks for the input.

cliffyk wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:44 pm
Once a week for me, for the last 35+ years; prior to that it was once a day cause with "kid's in school" and all I drove junk cars...
Cliffyk, I hope you don't mind me following up. You've driven cars longer than I have been alive.
What did you find while maintaining those cars from those days? Were they any better, worse or the same at oil consumption?
I can offer a perspective on that - I'm 55 years old, been driving since 1978. My wife is a year younger than myself; we've been together since summer 1981 when I was a freshman at Georgia Tech and she was a senior in high school. We've owned the following cars since then (in order of purchased, used unless noted):

1975 Mercury Bobcat, 2.3L manual - wife's 1st
1976 Chevy Camaro, 5.0L auto - my 1st
1976 Pontiac Sunbird, 3.8L auto - my 2nd
1978 Pontiac Sunbird hatchback, 3.8L manual - my 3rd. It ran but I eventually used it for spare parts for the '76
1981 Chevy Chevette, 1.6L auto - wife's 2nd
1985 Ford Escort, 1.6L manual - wife's 3rd; her 1st new purchase
1987 Ford Ranger, 2.9L auto - my 4th
1990 Oldsmobile Ciera, 3.3L auto - wife's 4th; her 2nd new purchase
1991 Ford Ranger, 4.0L auto - my 5th; my 1st new purchase
1998 Ford Explorer, 5.0L auto - wife's 5th; her 3rd new purchase
1999 Lincoln Continental, 4.6L auto - my 6th; new 39 month lease
2001 Mazda 626, 2.0L auto - wife's 6th; her 4th new purchase
2001 Pontiac Grand Prix, 3.1L auto - wife's 7th
2003 Mazda Tribute, 3.0L auto - wife's 8th; her 5th and last new purchase
2003 Mercury Sable, 3.0L auto - my 7th; my 2rd and last new purchase
2005 Ford Mustang, 4.0L auto - wife's 9th
2006 Honda CR-V, 2.3L auto - my 8th
2007 Acura MDX, 3.7L auto - my 9th
2009 Acura RDX, 2.3L auto - wife's 10th
2012 Acura RDX, 2.3L auto - wife's 11th and current vehicle
2012 Infiniti M56x, 5.6L auto - my 10th and current vehicle
1993 Ford F150, 5.8L auto - my 11th and current spare vehicle

I can honestly say that out of all 21 cars on this list, the M56x is the only one that uses oil on a regular basis.

kmiles
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EdBwoy - thank you for the excellent PSA! I've been a firm believe in this, too. I've always followed the Larz principle and change oil and filter at 3,000 miles. The M35x that I just sold 3 weeks ago never needed a drop added between oil changes, and I checked it weekly - even though I hated the way the oil dipstick was placed on that car. I've only had one car that I had to add oil to between oil changes - my Olds Aurora 3.5 when it reached about 150,000 miles. I end up doing it myself most of the time, as at least twice when I went to a fast lube place, they didn't put in enough oil and I had to add when I got home. Changing your own oil and filter gives you a chance while under the hood and the car to catch other problems before they get worse.

I liked seeing the history of cars owned by armybrat. I've never put together a list like that, but it might be interesting to see it all in one place.

EdBwoy
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Wow, impressive list armybrat! (Btw, I noticed the absence of Chrysler products.)

The first vehicle I owned was a Dodge Avenger. I honestly didn't know much about cars then and although I remember "checking fluids", one day I took it to a shop for a check engine light and he told me the engine was bone dry. So 50/50. I either imagined I saw good level on the dipstick... or the engine randomly made a bunch of oil disappear.

I didn't notice any excessive consumption in any of the other cars I owned. Enter my 1997 Maxima. That one didn't consume either, but I'd say I got to learn so much about cars during my ownership of this car, so I trust my memory a little more here.
I had a bunch of 5.5 gen maximas and Infiniti i35s and sure as heck, they ALLLLL burned oil. It was just a matter of how much/how fast. Good thing/bad thing is that their timing chain tensioners would struggle and the timing chain would rattle if you were running low. Add oil and the noise would go away.
Funny thing is that we had QX4s with the similar VQ35DE. One didn't eat/burn any noticeable amount of oil even at 300K miles. The other leaked from the rear main seal
I know that generally, the RWD VQs, like kmiles's M35 and my SUVs, seemed a little more sound - no rattles + less reports of oil consumption.

I also flirted with Non-Nissans for a while
- A Benz E320 - consumed about a quart per 2,000 miles. [8 quart capacity]
- Jag XJ8 - consumed a quart per 5,000 miles [6.5 qts about. just a little more capacity than the Infiniti V8s]

I still had a focus on Nissans though. A lot of Nissan V8s. I can't seem to avoid an M45. They have all consumed oil, but for some reason, I don't think they're ALLL that terrible. I typically have to add maybe 1 quart in 5,000 miles.
The worst I saw was 1 quart in 1,000 miles... but there was a direct correlation to getting a loud exhaust and driving it hard everywhere and keeping the RPMs high. Abuse it and it consumes oil fast.
Still, with none of my V8s have I had to incessantly check and top off oil like I did the Maxima/i35. They were terrible.
My M56 is on par with the M45s in consumption. I'd love to test it out more and stay ahead of the failures and catch anything that might slip our attention. I need to find a high mileage M56

It's a funny habit that I check even when I rent cars... or new cars at the dealership floor. For one, I am just curious about how they are maintained and wonder how the dipsticks of new cars look. Also I like to see how DIY-friendly a car is before ever thinking of buying it.

So, I suppose for me oil consumption is very normal (these days). I just check the dipsticks often and top up if need be.
I mark the mileage every time I do oil changes as well as record any quantities I top up with in between.
At the next oil change, I measure how much I drained out and taking into account how much I had to add, I make an oil disappeared versus mileage elapsed relation.

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armybrat
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EdBwoy wrote:
Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:41 pm
Wow, impressive list armybrat! (Btw, I noticed the absence of Chrysler products.)

The first vehicle I owned was a Dodge Avenger. I honestly didn't know much about cars then and although I remember "checking fluids", one day I took it to a shop for a check engine light and he told me the engine was bone dry. So 50/50. I either imagined I saw good level on the dipstick... or the engine randomly made a bunch of oil disappear.

I didn't notice any excessive consumption in any of the other cars I owned. Enter my 1997 Maxima. That one didn't consume either, but I'd say I got to learn so much about cars during my ownership of this car, so I trust my memory a little more here.
I had a bunch of 5.5 gen maximas and Infiniti i35s and sure as heck, they ALLLLL burned oil. It was just a matter of how much/how fast. Good thing/bad thing is that their timing chain tensioners would struggle and the timing chain would rattle if you were running low. Add oil and the noise would go away.
Funny thing is that we had QX4s with the similar VQ35DE. One didn't eat/burn any noticeable amount of oil even at 300K miles. The other leaked from the rear main seal
I know that generally, the RWD VQs, like kmiles's M35 and my SUVs, seemed a little more sound - no rattles + less reports of oil consumption.

I also flirted with Non-Nissans for a while
- A Benz E320 - consumed about a quart per 2,000 miles. [8 quart capacity]
- Jag XJ8 - consumed a quart per 5,000 miles [6.5 qts about. just a little more capacity than the Infiniti V8s]

I still had a focus on Nissans though. A lot of Nissan V8s. I can't seem to avoid an M45. They have all consumed oil, but for some reason, I don't think they're ALLL that terrible. I typically have to add maybe 1 quart in 5,000 miles.
The worst I saw was 1 quart in 1,000 miles... but there was a direct correlation to getting a loud exhaust and driving it hard everywhere and keeping the RPMs high. Abuse it and it consumes oil fast.
Still, with none of my V8s have I had to incessantly check and top off oil like I did the Maxima/i35. They were terrible.
My M56 is on par with the M45s in consumption. I'd love to test it out more and stay ahead of the failures and catch anything that might slip our attention. I need to find a high mileage M56

It's a funny habit that I check even when I rent cars... or new cars at the dealership floor. For one, I am just curious about how they are maintained and wonder how the dipsticks of new cars look. Also I like to see how DIY-friendly a car is before ever thinking of buying it.

So, I suppose for me oil consumption is very normal (these days). I just check the dipsticks often and top up if need be.
I mark the mileage every time I do oil changes as well as record any quantities I top up with in between.
At the next oil change, I measure how much I drained out and taking into account how much I had to add, I make an oil disappeared versus mileage elapsed relation.
Great perspective! In a DI engine, if you drive it hard you are forcing more oil laden air through the PCV valves, so that will increase oil consumption. For the most part, I've always been pretty conservative when it comes to driving. That may explain my good luck with oil consumption. I notice that I collect more oil in my catch cans when I drive more aggressive. It's a good way to gauge oil consumption in a DI engine.

There was a M56 with 165K miles for sale on one of the Infiniti Facebook groups, in case you're interested. I think he wants 10K for it.

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CRV_33
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If someone hasn't already done one but I hope someone will post a DIY for an oil catch can for the 5.6L

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armybrat
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CRV_33 wrote:
Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:19 am
If someone hasn't already done one but I hope someone will post a DIY for an oil catch can for the 5.6L
I ran dual cans, Ilya put my writeup on the FAQ's thread.

ArmedAviator
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I've been lucky. I drive my M37 hard. So far I've never been more than 1/2 quart lower than I started after 6,000 miles.

Maybe I am happy I went with the V6 and not the V8 afterall. Sounds like that engine has been really bad news lately on this forum.

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cliffyk
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EdBwoy wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:31 am
Good points y'all. Thanks for the input.

cliffyk wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:44 pm
Once a week for me, for the last 35+ years; prior to that it was once a day cause with "kid's in school" and all I drove junk cars...
Cliffyk, I hope you don't mind me following up. You've driven cars longer than I have been alive.
What did you find while maintaining those cars from those days? Were they any better, worse or the same at oil consumption?
mY wife and i have routinely driven car s ro 300,000+ miles; she has the record with an '89 Toyota Celica that had 389,000 when we traded it in on a '96 RAV4 that she drove to over 250k miles.


I had a 1990 MIata that had 188k when i installed a supercharger--drove it to 290k. Her 2003 Highlander we just traded had 230k; my '12 37 has 104k amd plan on driving it to at least 250k miles.

OTH my "problem child" 1998 Mercedes SL500 has 65k on it, THe engine and drivetrain may make 200k, but I'll be surprised if the crap quality plastic interior bits make it to 100k. The plastic oil crossover tubes ($320 for a set of 16, plus $35 for valve cover gaskets) in the engine (to move oil from the intake to exhaust cam bearings), and the plastic cam chain guides ($80) had to be replaced at 55k! This was a $!01k car when new!

When I got in there I found that someone had previously patched one up with epoxy!
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And then there was the overflow nipple on the radiator (56k miles--$65)"
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The headlight switch ($135) self-destructed at 53k miles, really shít quality plastics:

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So much for leaving your 30-year-old Mercedes to your grand-daughter (an old MB TV ad)--she would murder you in your sleep if you saddled her with this POS!!!

EdBwoy
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It's 2020 and we're still offering invaluable advice at 2018 prices -$Free-fifty

BUMP!

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Ilya
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lol. I've gotten slightly better at checking my oil in the past 8-10 months.

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I just dumped a 2011 Accord V6 because it was burning 1qt every 1000 miles. Car had 89k miles on it. Honda had a law suit against them for this very reason. I took it to the dealership and they said it's normal for a car to burn that much oil. My rear. I check my oil every now and then and it never burned much, then all of a sudden it started getting worse. Dipstick was dry when I checked it. I about had kittens.

I guess It's related to the Variable Cylinder Management (VCM). It's so annoying how auto makers get pressure from the government to improve fuel efficiency in their vehicles. It just results in little tweaks like VCM that reduce the cars reliability. After I got rid of it I went straight for the Q70. I knew it wasn't as efficient but now I believe that there's a trade off for it: reliability. I'm applying the same philosophy to appliances too. The old stuff runs forever but uses more energy.


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