Project Road Terror Z

[npez]

Perana,

That looks awesome. You did a real nice job on the plumbing for the FMIC! I look forward to seeing the pics for the exhaust mani you made.

Thanks for your feedaback!

Nick.
Modified by npez at 1:27 PM 5/17/2008

[npez]

Craig,

I posted the turbo #s that I have. I have asked for additional info and will post once I have it.

I think the logistics will work out well with the trip. I mentioned it to my wife (taking the long way home) and it may be doable. I'll let you know. The measurements we took involved the middle of the motor clearance to the strut tower, the crank to front radiator support, as well as front of engine to upper radiator support. I marked everything up with a sharpie. Yes I agree it's tight - but workable!

Thanks,Nick.

[perana]

yo,my cars RHD so the parts may be diffrent for for your swap.allso theres a few things that i could have done better if i had more time,help and a better thought out design.heres what was wrong:(1)manifolds could not fit once motor was in:(2)oil supply and drainage was to slow,needed a external pump:(3)turbos were to far back:(4)vg30dett sump section was in the way of the left turbo so it was boiling the oil. theres some more things but i cant think of them now.cheers

[qsiguy]

Nick,

Those turbo's look pretty good for a front mount in my opinion. If people are using it for the KA's then I'm sure it will work. What HP are they making with them? Double that and you have your approx. number. The turbine A/R is good for a front mount but for a rear it would need to be smaller. The turbine a/r on mine is .68 and the STS turbo's all have very small a/r's on the turbine. This is why the STS kits have very little lag. I looked at the corvette twin turbo kit at the SEMA show last year and they use two tiny turbo's. I have a photo of it somewhere they had two turbo's with turbine a/r's in the 30's I think.

EDIT:Found the photos, they have .36 a/r.

[T45]

I wasn't able to get on it real hard, my oil pressure was erratic, presumably from an under-tightened crank pulley bolt. Between the oil pressure and just breaking it in I never really got above 4k except for one time, and then I wasn't at full throttle, somewhere between 1/2 and 3/4 and once it got above 4k it really came alive. Sounded so sinister.

The NA radiator isnt big enough, temps above 200 except when idling. I hope to have a bigger radiator this week and fix the oil issue and along with tmo's injectors have a better running engine. I am going to go get an adapter tonight so I can run the consult to see if I have any injectors stuck or brokeded.

[T45]

Oh yeah, prepare to get a lot of stares! A Z with an engine sticking out of the hood combined with the exhaust note of the VH makes for a truly wicked ride!

[perana]

hey t45 i was the one who said a n/a radiator works but thats incorrect my n/a has a nissan stagea (awd rb26dett wagon) radiator.this is how i got it and thought it was stock. allso i must caution you,the vh easily eats bearings when oil pressures low and the motors hot.hope this helps its a awsome ride when you launch it of the rev limmiter on m/t et streets.cheers

[craigztoyz]

Oh yeah, prepare to get a lot of stares! A Z with an engine sticking out of the hood combined with the exhaust note of the VH makes for a truly wicked ride!

I hope to not have a hole in hood. I used a front sump, so I may be a lil lower, on overall height. Either way, I had hood on and was within an inch all around, so Plan to take out hood support and then bulge it as needbe.

hope the oil issue gets worked out. I am planning on using an impact to make sure crankpulley is tight as hell.

[tmorgan4]

hope the oil issue gets worked out. I am planning on using an impact to make sure crankpulley is tight as hell.

DON'T DO IT. 270 ft-lbs...torque it. Did you notice that the sprocket on the crank for the oil pump is sandwiched between the two timing chain sprockets that are keyed? It's meant to slip when the oil is cold and the engine gets revved. Over torquing is just as bad as under torquing in this case.

[craigztoyz]

Good point. Forgot about it not being Keyed, But I could see that it's keyimpression on the back sprocket(while doing guides) was in one spot, for a very long time, if not ever. Seemed like it should be pinned, to keep it locked. I even thought of drilling and putting in a pin. Now I need to research this.

I do not think though that the oil chain's sprocket can ever turn at a slower speed then crank.

Hope for info on that one. How do you recommend tightening crank?

[T45]

Good tip TMO. I think I remember a good post by Q45tech about this somewhere now that you mention it.

[Chrispy300]

How do you recommend tightening crank?

Remove the starter, lock the ring gear with a big screwdriver and torque away Or convert to manual, stick it in 5th with the hand brake on

[craigztoyz]

It is 5spd now, but don't want to break anything, ordamage my new clutch. How have those who have done their guides, tightened it up?

Remove the starter, lock the ring gear with a big screwdriver and torque away Or convert to manual, stick it in 5th with the hand brake on

[robb1971]

I found I could lock up the crank by using a drive belt wraped around the harmonic balancer with a g-clamp tightened up on the belt next to the balancer , this created a loop that i tied off to my engine cradle.. I hung 30 kilos off a 4 foot breaker bar, by my thinking i got 66 pounds on a 4 foot bar, wich works out to be 264 foot pounds... tell me if im off base on this one ok. My engine is sitting in a cradle at the moment so i can get the wiring sorted and engine running before i put it into the car . I dont want to find leaks etc after its installed man those pipes are brittle when you start moving them

[tmorgan4]

The only problem I had with a 4 foot bar is that it was too long to be flat since it would hit the frame rails. Just make sure you've got the bar horizontal if you're hanging weight on it. Physics.....

[npez]

Shane,

Thanks a bunch for the help. Those vette turbos look sweet BTW - they are tiny! The workmanship of the overall package is awesome.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Thanks,Nick.

[npez]

Nick, as we spoke on phone and I measured, yeah, I think that will clear quite well. I like the pics of how you cut it. Wife n girl must love the Sawzall n its delicate sounds. I had tried to flip them over before but due to ubstruction, dropped it. Glad to see you have made it work. Best spot is going to be in front of radiator, with i/c on outside, or viceversa, turbos out though may be too much heat in the space in front of tires, and melt the bumper n such.

I am so glad they'll clear. Luckily with the garage being detached, I don't think the wife and kids even hear the compressor kicking on. Pretty fortunate I guess. I think I will be doing the turbos in the nose where the airbox used to be and then run to the factory ICs. This will allow me to recycle the rest of the plubling openings to get to the throttle body. I was actually surprised at how thick the wall of the tubing is. Pretty stout.

So much for stage 1. or plan a, I mean.

The beauty about redoing the header is I'm going to add flanges in the appropriate locations to have removable downpipes with wastegates and another set that's straight through. If done right I should be able to set the car up to run normally aspirated to start with and then add the rest of the plumbing for the turbos and swap the downpipes with the wastegates on them. I also researched it a bit more and 38mm wastegates should do the job 60mm would be overkill.

I can't wait to weld in that a/c garage. I got a lot of pics to come, and oh yeah.

check out this pic. this is with the motor in the car, intake on, and everything except piping from the tb. the hood comes within an inch all around, take out 1/2 of hood support, and bulge it a bit. Next one, I am dropping the rack an inch or so, and using different endlinks to make it up. But this is almost under the hood, A heck of a lot more then I thought it would.

That's awesome. I will probably take the hood to a customizer and have a bugle added to it and then have the hood repainted. Similar to the so called "power bulge" on the M3 - it'll look stockish this way like the bulge was always there. It's fantastic that you got the motor sitting as low as you did. Great job! I can't wait to get mine in there.

Thanks,Nick.

[craigztoyz]

I can't wait to get mine in there.

Thanks,Nick.

Nick7 Days and counting. Next Mondany, end of 3 day weekend, thats the plan. gimme a ring when back, let me know whats up with swinging by. Craig

[npez]

I took the exhaust mani to the friend with the muffler shop - didn't seem too excited about doing the job and a lot of obstacles - "need to have the car here", etc. So I went to the other guy - saw his work and was pretty impressed as what he can do with a TIG.

Long story short, he can get the manifolds put together (Craig BTW the pipes cannot be heated and bent) for between $300-400USD (sounded reasonable anyone have any thoughts on the price?). This includes:- Shortening the runners to move the "log" in by an inch (this way it'll only require 2-1/2 inches clearance)- Reconnect all the runners and the runner I cut back onto the log- Extend the log with mandrel bends to a flange to be located in the front part of the log extension in front of the valve cover (the idea being that there will be a pipe that connects to that flange and goes to each turbo) hence making easier to take the manifolds off as it'll be a 2 piece design.- Use of 14 gauge 304 stainless.- He also gave me a price to coat (Jet hot) the headers inside and outside for an additional $350 - anyone have any experience with coating pricing - wasn't sure if this was a good deal or not?

He said that the manifold is pretty stout - 14 gauge stainless and that the welds look pretty good for robotic MIG. He agreed to tack the manifold together so I can check it for fitment and if everything looks good to me he'll permanently TIG the rest.

I'm going to try to get the RH heatshields, etc. off and cut the RH manifold this evening, so I can hopefully drop it off tomorrow afternoon. He said it'll be about a 1 week turn-around.

I'll cross my fingers I can get everything done in time before I go on our mini vacation.

Nick.

[tmorgan4]

That sounds like a very good price to me considering the amount of work involved and the fact that he's going to TIG it all. A friend of mine at a race shop I met during this project charges $150 an hour for all his TIG work, and more if he's fabricating too. As long as the guy seems to know what he's doing I'd jump on that.

[npez]

That sounds like a very good price to me considering the amount of work involved and the fact that he's going to TIG it all. A friend of mine at a race shop I met during this project charges $150 an hour for all his TIG work, and more if he's fabricating too. As long as the guy seems to know what he's doing I'd jump on that.

Thanks for the feedback. I've got the manifold off and hopefully I'll be able to drill out the spot welds and cut it like the other one to drop off tomorrow.....

Thanks again,Nick.

[npez]

If you can do front mounts that's probably what I'd do. Although it could end up being as much work, or more, as the rears tho with all of the modifying you must do. I'd like to see a complete photo of the bottom of your 300z. Curious what plumbing routes are available.

Shane,

Sorry it took a little bit to get the photos but I just got around to bringing the camera back out to the garage. Here you go - there are some shadows but hopefully you can discern the nuances of layout from the photos. There's plenty of space where the mufflers are but there a major constraint around the rear subframe, and the bottom is pretty flat all and all.

Thanks,Nick.

[qsiguy]

Thanks. It's tight but certainly doable. I think If I was going to do a twin setup in the rear I would pull those two oil lines and run my own like I did. I would run the compressor plumbing where those tubes are currently and on the opposite side. 2" pipe would fit in there ok without loosing much clearance. Looks very similar to what I had to do.

Sounds like your front mount method will work great tho. If I get my 300ZX some day I guess I'll have to do the rear mount. Maybe I'll just find a cheap NA model and turbo it with twins in the rear.

[npez]

Putting out a "feeler" out there. When I got my motor it didn't have a water pump pulley - I got one from a 92 from my friend with the junkyard but they're not the same - the pulleys don't line up - looks like the waterpump on the 94 causes the pulley to come out about 1/4 inch or so further out.

Does anyone have one from a 94 that they'd be willing to part with cheap? I don't want to pay $60 to get a new one from infiniti. I can also swap the 92 one I've got if anyone needs one.

Please advise.

Thanks,Nick.

[craigztoyz]

Wow that is a clean garage!

Those prices sound great. If you had access, you should take him the motor, so he could build around it. Sounds great.

I still think that rear turbo is very doable. Hope to one day, but for now, see what she has with this.

[konatown]

That IS a clean garage, and a nice lift.

We have 36 (42 if I include Lexus) in our shop.



The header work is at a great price, in my opinion.

[npez]

Wow that is a clean garage!

Yeah I put all the parts up in the attic.

Those prices sound great. If you had access, you should take him the motor, so he could build around it. Sounds great.

I dropped off the manifolds this morning. We'll see the progress after I get back from vacation. I'm waiting on a quote for the turbos, flanges, oil lines, etc. and once I receive those and purchase, then I will finalize the layout in the engine bay and have him permanently weld.

I still think that rear turbo is very doable. Hope to one day, but for now, see what she has with this.

It'll be great! I'm sure of it.

Thanks,Nick.

[npez]

ok - so I'm sitting here ordering the turbo setup. With any luck I'll have everything here before craigztoyz gets here. I'm getting the twins, stainless steel flanges & gaskets, oil lines/fittings, [2] 38mm wastegates, and extra 2.5" aluminum pipe and bends (to supplement what I have for intercooler and charge side plubling).

When we get the motor put in we can play around with various options and try to determine where the turbos will ultimately end up. I'll take pictures with the various scenarios we come up with.....

All I need to do now is buy 2 more Nismo 555cc injectors to complete the set as I already have the 6 in their boxes that I bought for the VG motor. I hope to get the engine management software/hardware as well later in the week (Anyone know if I can just use the Conzult cable that came with the Conzult software?) - Also I think I'll go down Shane's route with the exception of adding the Ostrich 2.0 emulator. I think this will be a good start and maybe get Nistune after I have some experience under my belt.

That's all for now. Going on vacation starting tomorrow, then coming back refreshed as there is a lot of work to be done before Craig gets here.

Thanks,Nick.

[qsiguy]

I'm not sure what you get with the Conzult. Mine has a Consult plug on one end, goes to a small circuit board, then has a USB cable that goes to the laptop. This is just for the logging, map trace, etc. You don't need this cable to burn chips but you need it to monitor the car/ECU. You'll also need a consult adapter and the Ostrich to use Nistune.

After swapping chips in the ECU about a dozen times you'll be ready for the real time tuning

[darkengineer]

NPEZ made me think of something: does anyone have pictures of the underbody of a 2+2 300?

I only ask because I too have plans for a VH45DE w/ FI but the rear layout is different between a 2+0 and a 2+2 due to the fuel tank. Also, I haven't been under the car in a while due to apartment complex restrictions on car repair/maintenance and now have forgotten what the layout is, exactly. I was considering a single turbo because of underbody space and knowing the amount of low-end torque the VH45 already has.