problems, problems, problems...wheels

[paranoidjack]

Man, this SUCKS.

I lost my key to my lugs on my q. For some godforsaken reason the previous owner who put these wheels on put every lug a keyed lug. They are all the same.

This is not really my problem. I've had my car aligned 3 times, all wheels, but I still have the same issues. At 75 mph my car begins to shake like hell. 90 is unsafe. What's worse is that I'm sure all my mileage (I drive alot...4k/month) with this shaky rear end is going to destroy all of my suspension components. I wanted to get them balanced (praying this was the solution...does this sound feasible), but since I lost my lug no one can do it.

So, two questions.

1) Is it possible that a balancing is going to remedy this situation, and if it is not the alignment/balancing, WHAT would make the rear end so unstable at such speeds? Please note my camber is not great and for some reason I have a couple degrees negative camber (the car is not lowered).

2) What can I do to get these bastards off? I have no idea who manufactured the locks, and those threaded tapered sockets won't work because they don't fit into the lug recess in the wheel.

I have a big trip coming up in 3 days and need to get this resolved, does anyone have any ideas?

I am running 225/35/19 on nankang tires, with rpm-505 wheels. Thanks guys in advance for any ideas.

http://www.lakeshorewheelandti...shtml
Modified by paranoidjack at 6:52 PM 8/5/2006

[PIONEER]

For the vibration, make sure rims are not bent or tires are not out of round. also make sure tie rod ends or ball joints are not worn down.

can you post a Link to your locks? More then likely its Mcguard.

Take your car to a local nissan dealer (NISSAN, Not Infiniti). Go to the parts Dept and tell the guy you want to use the Master key set b/c you've lost the wheel lock key. The kit has about 50 different keys on it so you'll be there a while testing to see which one fits. When you find the one you need, write down the # on the key. call McGuard and $15 +ship you'll get the key that fits

I only know this b/c the shop used a Gun on my wheels and broke the Wheel lock key. so I had to go to the Nissan dealer and find the correct key. Infiniti dealers don't have the master key set.

[szh]

I lost my key to my lugs on my q. For some godforsaken reason the previous owner who put these wheels on put every lug a keyed lug. They are all the same.

Every lug!! That is extreme ...

This is not really my problem. I've had my car aligned 3 times, all wheels, but I still have the same issues. At 75 mph my car begins to shake like hell. 90 is unsafe. What's worse is that I'm sure all my mileage (I drive alot...4k/month) with this shaky rear end is going to destroy all of my suspension components. I wanted to get them balanced (praying this was the solution...does this sound feasible), but since I lost my lug no one can do it.

You should do a search on this topic, but I am pretty sure that this is an indication of a bad drive-shaft (although my old memory may be failing me here). This sounds like the common symptom for that problem and your drive-shaft may require replacement.

Z

[elwesso]

Your gonna have to tell me where this is coming from.. Can you feel it more in your seat, or through the steering wheel???

How is the frequency of the vibration..... Say a low frequency vibration would be like __-----__----__---__--- and a high frequency would be _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

[szh]

I am running 225/35/19 on nankang tires, with rpm-505 wheels.

Whoa! I overlooked this earlier! Every tire I know in that size range (but not the Nanking per se) has a load index between 84 and 88.

These are unsafe for the weight of a Q45 - the static load index of these tire is only 1100 to 1235 pounds each. With dynamic highway conditions, you are easily exceeding the load index of the tire and it is dangerous!

It may be that the tire is simply getting stressed with use and deforming internally - the belts may be fraying. At speed, this shows up as vibration and imbalance. Does the car stay vibration-free (or less vibration anyway) right after the balance and then get bad over a short period? This is an indication of a tire about to fail on you catastrophically! I would certainly not drive on such tires at any speed, let alone at 75 to 90 mph!!

Z

[elwesso]

i agree..... Im pretty sure i mentioned that eariler!

hell, even used tires off ebay in a reasonable size (255-35-19) would be better than those little guys.

[AZhitman]

Definitely severe internal tire failure.

I'd be interested to know who the hell sold you those tires, as they're insufficient for an Accord, much less a Q45.

They actually bear some legal responsibility, although the consumer should know better.

Get those OFF the car ASAP and find some tires with a load rating of 95 or higher.

Also, RPM wheels are generally regarded to be pretty "cheaply" made and will NOT stand up to the abuse a Q can dish out. I'd have them balanced WITHOUT tires - I bet there's some runout (bend) in at least one wheel.

[szh]

I'd be interested to know who the hell sold you those tires, as they're insufficient for an Accord, much less a Q45.

Definitely! Accords need 89 to 91 minimum, as I recall. My wife's 1997 Acura 2.2CL (essentially an Accord EX) needed 91.

They actually bear some legal responsibility, although the consumer should know better.

Yes, indeed! There is stuff in the works to make suppliers become aware of their legal responsibilities in this matter. Check this out: http://www.tirereview.com/?type=art&id=5278

Here is a section from near the bottom of the article:

Quote »New Legislation

Finally, you should be aware of some new legislation regarding the installation of aftermarket wheels and non-OE tires on a new vehicle that hasn’t been titled yet. The new rule, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard #110, which took effect Sept. 1, 2005, states that if you “alter” a new vehicle by installing different tires or wheels, you must place a new tire inflation and load capacity placard over the original to indicate the new front/rear/spare air pressures to the buyer. [/quote]Z

[maxnix]

A lot of wasted money and heartache can be saved by reading the existing posts by Q45tech and the three posters above concerning tire and load issues.

Heck, there is even a sticky in Infiniti General.

Read more, waste less green, maybe even save your life or the lives of others.

[paranoidjack]

Thanks everyone. I'll replace them before my trip next week. Anyone have a particular favorite?

[paranoidjack]

For the vibration, make sure rims are not bent or tires are not out of round. also make sure tie rod ends or ball joints are not worn down.

can you post a Link to your locks? More then likely its Mcguard.

Take your car to a local nissan dealer (NISSAN, Not Infiniti). Go to the parts Dept and tell the guy you want to use the Master key set b/c you've lost the wheel lock key. The kit has about 50 different keys on it so you'll be there a while testing to see which one fits. When you find the one you need, write down the # on the key. call McGuard and $15 +ship you'll get the key that fits

I only know this b/c the shop used a Gun on my wheels and broke the Wheel lock key. so I had to go to the Nissan dealer and find the correct key. Infiniti dealers don't have the master key set.

Thank you. I'll do this tomorrow.

[szh]

Thanks everyone. I'll replace them before my trip next week. Anyone have a particular favorite?

I assume:

1. This is for your 2000 Q45. Correct?

2. The wheels are 19" x 8.5" in front and same or 19" x 9.5" in the rear. Both front and back are 38mm offset. Correct? If not correct, what are the wheel widths and offsets?

I will do some looking into possibilities once I know the widths and offsets you are running. Just be aware that 19" tires are not inexpensive!

Z

[szh]

Thanks everyone. I'll replace them before my trip next week.

Excellent! Best to be safe!

Anyone have a particular favorite?

You should make sure to get at least a 95 load index tire, at least an H-rated tire and nothing less than a Grand Touring tire (if you want to save some money) - preferably one of the other ones from Tire Rack. As I mentioned earlier, 19" tires are not going to be inexpensive! And they will wear a bit more quickly ... you should expect to see about 15,000 to 20,000 miles of usable wear from them.

Although you are living in New England, it is NOT important to get all-season tires (which still do not do well in snow), since you will need to get winter tires for the snow anyway - if my many years of living in MA and NH are any example!

Here are my suggestions:----------In a 245/40-19 size (since these are approx 26.5" to 27.1" diameter, there will be a nominal - albeit relatively insignificant - speedo error):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Do not get the 94 W or 94 Y load index tires - ask for the XL (extra load), they are all roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 245/45-YR19 in a 98 load index.

3. Dunlop SP Sport Maxx. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version.

4. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version. These are my personal favorite tires now, btw. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a "$40 cash card" special going on.

5. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 245/40-YR19 in a 98 load index.----------In a 255/40-19 size (diameter is average of 27.0, so the speedo error is a tiny bit worse, but still relatively insignificant .. actual speed will be about 1 to 2mph faster than an indicated speedo value of 60mph):

1. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index or the XL ZR19 in a 99 load index.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

5. Yokohama ADVAN Sport. 255/40-YR19 XL in a 100 load index.----------In a 255/35-19 size (the speedo error is least, since the average diameter is near 26.1 inches):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Do not get the 92 Y load index tires in this size - ask for the XL (extra load), they are both roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Again, do not get the 92 W load index tire in this size.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/35-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on right now.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index.

5. Avon Tech M500. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. The price on these tires is lower than the others at Tire Rack. This is not available from other sources, by the way.----------My only concern with the 255/40 or 255/35 width tires is that they may be a bit of a tighter fit in your Q45 than the 245/40-19, but it should work. Give Tire Rack a call and ask - they generally have folks who can help out with this fitment issue.

If in stock, Tire Rack can also deliver overnight (with a credit card purchase, of course) and you can get them installed locally - Tire Rack has installers listed in every area in the country.

Of course, since you are travelling soon, you may have no choice but to go with a local tire installer. Use the Tire Rack prices to negotiate with them. Typically, you should be able to get to about $10/$15/$20 per tire over the Tire Rack prices, since shipping costs about $10 to $12 per tire from Tire Rack!

Regards, and good luck!

Z

[Rex]

Now that my friends is some thorough/detailed helpful information. Great post Z .

Excellent! Best to be safe!

You should make sure to get at least a 95 load index tire, at least an H-rated tire and nothing less than a Grand Touring tire (if you want to save some money) - preferably one of the other ones from Tire Rack. As I mentioned earlier, 19" tires are not going to be inexpensive! And they will wear a bit more quickly ... you should expect to see about 15,000 to 20,000 miles of usable wear from them.

Although you are living in New England, it is NOT important to get all-season tires (which still do not do well in snow), since you will need to get winter tires for the snow anyway - if my many years of living in MA and NH are any example!

Here are my suggestions:----------In a 245/40-19 size (since these are approx 26.5" to 27.1" diameter, there will be a nominal - albeit relatively insignificant - speedo error):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Do not get the 94 W or 94 Y load index tires - ask for the XL (extra load), they are all roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 245/45-YR19 in a 98 load index.

3. Dunlop SP Sport Maxx. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version.

4. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version. These are my personal favorite tires now, btw. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a "$40 cash card" special going on.

5. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 245/40-YR19 in a 98 load index.----------In a 255/40-19 size (diameter is average of 27.0, so the speedo error is a tiny bit worse, but still relatively insignificant .. actual speed will be about 1 to 2mph faster than an indicated speedo value of 60mph):

1. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index or the XL ZR19 in a 99 load index.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

5. Yokohama ADVAN Sport. 255/40-YR19 XL in a 100 load index.----------In a 255/35-19 size (the speedo error is least, since the average diameter is near 26.1 inches):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Do not get the 92 Y load index tires in this size - ask for the XL (extra load), they are both roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Again, do not get the 92 W load index tire in this size.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/35-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on right now.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index.

5. Avon Tech M500. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. The price on these tires is lower than the others at Tire Rack. This is not available from other sources, by the way.----------My only concern with the 255/40 or 255/35 width tires is that they may be a bit of a tighter fit in your Q45 than the 245/40-19, but it should work. Give Tire Rack a call and ask - they generally have folks who can help out with this fitment issue.

If in stock, Tire Rack can also deliver overnight (with a credit card purchase, of course) and you can get them installed locally - Tire Rack has installers listed in every area in the country.

Of course, since you are travelling soon, you may have no choice but to go with a local tire installer. Use the Tire Rack prices to negotiate with them. Typically, you should be able to get to about $10/$15/$20 per tire over the Tire Rack prices, since shipping costs about $10 to $12 per tire from Tire Rack!

Regards, and good luck!

Z

[PIONEER]

I have run Pilot sports A/S, SO2 and SO3, Eagle 1, Conti sports.

Best Grip SO3Best performance in water SO2Best Overall Life Pilot Sport A/S Got about 35K miles out of these. After almost no tread left, They still grabbed the road but no water traction.

Overall for the $ if you can't afford $300 per tire would be conti sport.

Good Year is all right but didn't last long.

Greg (AZHITMAN) where have you been dude. Send me an email, we need to wrapup that transaction on the wheels.

[maxnix]

Now that my friends is some thorough/detailed helpful information. Great post Z .

A little reading and research here and at TR can educate one a lot about tires.

I guess the younger generation never learned how to use a library? It's really quite easy. Google is your friend.

[paranoidjack]

Excellent! Best to be safe!

You should make sure to get at least a 95 load index tire, at least an H-rated tire and nothing less than a Grand Touring tire (if you want to save some money) - preferably one of the other ones from Tire Rack. As I mentioned earlier, 19" tires are not going to be inexpensive! And they will wear a bit more quickly ... you should expect to see about 15,000 to 20,000 miles of usable wear from them.

Although you are living in New England, it is NOT important to get all-season tires (which still do not do well in snow), since you will need to get winter tires for the snow anyway - if my many years of living in MA and NH are any example!

Here are my suggestions:----------In a 245/40-19 size (since these are approx 26.5" to 27.1" diameter, there will be a nominal - albeit relatively insignificant - speedo error):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Do not get the 94 W or 94 Y load index tires - ask for the XL (extra load), they are all roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 245/45-YR19 in a 98 load index.

3. Dunlop SP Sport Maxx. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version.

4. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 245/40-WR19 XL in a 98 load index. Again, get the XL version. These are my personal favorite tires now, btw. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a "$40 cash card" special going on.

5. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 245/40-YR19 in a 98 load index.----------In a 255/40-19 size (diameter is average of 27.0, so the speedo error is a tiny bit worse, but still relatively insignificant .. actual speed will be about 1 to 2mph faster than an indicated speedo value of 60mph):

1. Bridgestone Potenza S-03 Pole Position. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index or the XL ZR19 in a 99 load index.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/40-YR19 in a 96 load index.

5. Yokohama ADVAN Sport. 255/40-YR19 XL in a 100 load index.----------In a 255/35-19 size (the speedo error is least, since the average diameter is near 26.1 inches):

1. Bridgestone Potenza RE050A. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Do not get the 92 Y load index tires in this size - ask for the XL (extra load), they are both roughly the same price from http://www.tirerack.com, btw.

2. Continental SportContact 2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. Again, do not get the 92 W load index tire in this size.

3. Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. 255/35-YR19 in a 96 load index. Price at Tire Rack is excellent, plus there is a $40 cash card special going on right now.

4. Michelin Pilot Sport PS2. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index.

5. Avon Tech M500. 255/35-YR19 XL in a 96 load index. The price on these tires is lower than the others at Tire Rack. This is not available from other sources, by the way.----------My only concern with the 255/40 or 255/35 width tires is that they may be a bit of a tighter fit in your Q45 than the 245/40-19, but it should work. Give Tire Rack a call and ask - they generally have folks who can help out with this fitment issue.

If in stock, Tire Rack can also deliver overnight (with a credit card purchase, of course) and you can get them installed locally - Tire Rack has installers listed in every area in the country.

Of course, since you are travelling soon, you may have no choice but to go with a local tire installer. Use the Tire Rack prices to negotiate with them. Typically, you should be able to get to about $10/$15/$20 per tire over the Tire Rack prices, since shipping costs about $10 to $12 per tire from Tire Rack!

Regards, and good luck!

Z

I couldn't thank you more for the effort that you put into that post. Rest assured it did not fall on deaf ears. My only problem is that I don't know the offset on my wheels. Need to figure that out and I'll be back here with an update.

[Solini]

A little reading and research here and at TR can educate one a lot about tires.

I guess the younger generation never learned how to use a library? It's really quite easy. Google is your friend.

Time out Brian, I work at a Library and I guess I would fall into your definition of younger generation since i'm 24. It's not that we don't know how to search but with forums like this and others, we're fixated on the quick and easy method. Hey, in all honesty it's your older genenration that made us this way

[maxnix]

Hey, in all honesty it's your older genenration that made us this way

By too much spoon feeding?

Learning to think for oneself is perhaps the most important aspect of maturing. That is why I always recommend searches so members can read previous discussions and may choose to diverge from some of the assumptions or conclusions. It is a shame the joy of discovery is not inculcated in our educational system and curiosity is regarded as an aberration.

Who said "For every question there is a short, simple answer that is wrong?" I would add "and/or incomplete" or "non-elucidative" to that list.

Get all the information, weigh it, and then decide. Pay little heed to advice that tells you inaction or shortcuts are viable, especially when the advisor has no stake in the consequences of failure.

Ultimately, we are each responsible for our decisions and actions, or lack of them.

[AZhitman]

Jack -

On the quite likely chance that the RPM's have sufficient runout to need replacing, I'd seriously consider some OEM takeoffs from a newer Infiniti.

Choices include the new Q 18's, some 19's from a G35 or n M45 (altho the M has some weird offsets), or EVEN a set of 20" FX wheels (that'd be my choice, they look HOT on a Q).

[AZhitman]

Greg (AZHITMAN) where have you been dude. Send me an email, we need to wrapup that transaction on the wheels.

Hey buddy!

I'm here - Catch me at [email protected] at your convenience. Hope all well with you!

[paranoidjack]

I

Whoa! I overlooked this earlier! Every tire I know in that size range (but not the Nanking per se) has a load index between 84 and 88.

These are unsafe for the weight of a Q45 - the static load index of these tire is only 1100 to 1235 pounds each. With dynamic highway conditions, you are easily exceeding the load index of the tire and it is dangerous!

It may be that the tire is simply getting stressed with use and deforming internally - the belts may be fraying. At speed, this shows up as vibration and imbalance. Does the car stay vibration-free (or less vibration anyway) right after the balance and then get bad over a short period? This is an indication of a tire about to fail on you catastrophically! I would certainly not drive on such tires at any speed, let alone at 75 to 90 mph!!

Z

I took a look...mine says 91Y on the tire. Is that the load index?

[paranoidjack]

I'm almost afraid to ask a question now, but I very much understand your point

Let me play devils advocate: one might argue that 99% of all issues that could ever arise already have. On that note, we may as well close new posting and use this as purely a database. The regurgitation of older topics allows for new light on old shadows...because again, 50% of the people on this forum are probably new, or rarely here, and might happen upon a regurgitated thread and have something worthwhile to add to it, or to take from it.

I am one of these people, so I can attest to this. Even after reading 20 thread on the topic, sometimes one cannot justify an investment without having some of this information "spoon fed" to them, so that they can personalize the information.

For example, I will go out and spend $1200 on new tires now. And perhaps new wheels if I get an answer to my following question. Let me tell you maxnix, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing this by reading the majority of what I dug up on a search. Perhaps that is justifiable, perhaps it isn't; my point is that it is what it is, and without personalization (what else is a forum for???), many are not inclined to act.

So,

How can I tell if my wheels have this runout you guys speak of? If I bring them to a shop and they can't BE balanced?

[paranoidjack]

Definitely severe internal tire failure.

I'd be interested to know who the hell sold you those tires, as they're insufficient for an Accord, much less a Q45.

I didn't buy them; they came on the car. Along with the DAMN locking wheel nuts.

[AZhitman]

Jack -

Most reputable tire shops will have good balancing equipment, and runout is easy to detect. They basically mount the whweel on the machine, spin it up, and a spring-loaded caliper rides along the edge of the rim. This measures runout. If it detects variations as it travels around the rim, it measures them and displays them for reading.

Next step is to have the new tires mounted and balanced on a Hunter 9700 (or comparable) machine. Again, reputable big-name tire shops, call around (Discount typically uses these).

Balancing on the 9700 will allow a test referred to as Road Force, in which the balancing is done during a simulated load condition, thereby offering a more accurate assessment of the balance... Sometimes, all that is needed is to rotate tire on the rim, meaning they rotate the "heavy" side of the tire to the "light" side of the rim to offset MOST of the imbalance (then finish off with bit of weights.

If they're out of balance, and require more than .25 oz, I'd consider replacing them.

Thank God for members who actually use the information provided here - Jack, guys like you make all this worthwhile.

[szh]

I took a look...mine says 91Y on the tire. Is that the load index?

Yes. The 91 is the load index (too low for a Q45) and the Y is the speed rating (this is good for a Q45).

For the weight of a Q45, a 95 load index minimum is needed - more is better (particularly for non-Michelin tires since Michelin is pretty conservative), but going over 100 load index is not really necessary.

In terms of speed rating, H is a good minimum (don't exceed 100-105 mph realistically, even though the speed rating is for upto 130mph) and Y,W or Z is fine. The H-rated tires do not generally have the same strength on internal construction as the Y, W or Z tires, so it is good to avoid them if you can.

Z

[szh]

If they're out of balance, and require more than .25 oz, I'd consider replacing them.

Here, note that Greg means the balance needed for the wheels alone, not with the tires on, of course!

Thank God for members who actually use the information provided here - Jack, guys like you make all this worthwhile.

Yes, indeed!

Z

[maxnix]

I I took a look...mine says 91Y on the tire. Is that the load index?

Yep, and that's way below the 94 minimum for the FY33.

[maxnix]

1.) . The regurgitation of older topics allows for new light on old shadows...because again, 50% of the people on this forum are probably new, or rarely here, and might happen upon a regurgitated thread and have something worthwhile to add to it, or to take from it.

2.) I am one of these people, so I can attest to this. Even after reading 20 thread on the topic, sometimes one cannot justify an investment without having some of this information "spoon fed" to them, so that they can personalize the information.

For example, I will go out and spend $1200 on new tires now. And perhaps new wheels if I get an answer to my following question. Let me tell you maxnix, I wouldn't feel comfortable doing this by reading the majority of what I dug up on a search. Perhaps that is justifiable, perhaps it isn't; my point is that it is what it is, and without personalization (what else is a forum for???), many are not inclined to act.

How can I tell if my wheels have this runout you guys speak of? If I bring them to a shop and they can't BE balanced?

1.) Actually, it is the same old light. Not much has changed from the FSM specifications. Regurgitation is not very tasty. Reinventing the wheel (as it were) every three months doesn't help searching either. Just makes it slower.

The original posts often contain discussions and nuances not included in later regurgitaions. Kinda of de-chunkified.

2.) Searching here is an art. That is why there is a tutotial on it. Unfortunately, it appears you haven't found the particular Q45tech posts on measuring runout and balance for the wheel.

Keep reading, you'll get there. No one here learned all that is on this board in even a year. Everyone here over 4 years came from predecessor boards.

The problems you had should have been very obvious with the simplest of seraches, or even just a cursory reading of the owner's manual, let alone the FSM or TSB. Even a perusal of the tire sticky would have been a clue.

Search and read before you buy!

[paranoidjack]

well then, I apologize.

edit: AND thank everyone for their input.