Power Steering Problem 1999 Q45T - 180,000 miles

[GThreat]

I no longer have any power steering, after bleeding the system and refilling the reservoir (12 fl oz of Lucas stop leak power steering fluid). Big puddles of fluid under the steering gear, but I have yet to actually confirm where the leak is. Not sure about the pump either, as it was making a whining/humming sound that increased with engine speed and when the steering wheel was moved off dead center. This is my wife's car that I am now driving until I figure out how to fix it and then I can have my car back (2003 I30T). I have the FM and am looking at the steering gear exploded diagram and see there are quite a few oil seals and connections that may be the culprit.

Any advice to streamline the trouble shooting and decision making process would be much appreciated!

Thanks

[maxnix]

Stop leak is not PS fluid, no matter what Lucas may say.

Check hoses. If no leaks there, then time to get a Meridian rebuilt rack and new hoses from

http://www.infinitipartsusa.com

while their additional 10% sale is still on until 11/29.

When was the last time you changed the PS fluid? What did the old fluid look like (white paper towel test)?

[GThreat]

Thanks for your prompt reply. I have only owned this car since about 160,000 miles or 3 years and I did not ever change the PS fluid.

The old fluid is still in there but somewhat diluted by the Lucas "snake oil" (LSO).

Could a deterioration of the vanes in the pump got into the fluid and destroyed the seals (assuming no hose leaks)? The hydraulic diagram in the FSM shows no filter in the design, unless the reservoir is acting as a course one.

The problem was sudden, and caused the reservoir to overflow with very aerated fluid. The priming method of supporting the front and rotating the steering wheel back and forth sucked up a bottle of LSO.

How big of a job for the weekend mechanic would the replacement be?

[GThreat]

Update:

This afternoon I wanted to determine what exactly was leaking. Before starting the engine I did the bleed procedure and added about 6 oz or so of Dexron III to top the system up.

I then started the engine and had my wife begin rotating the wheel from lock to lock position. Within a few turns the reservoir started spewing out fluid and i could see no other visible leaks at the steering rack. The only puddle of fluid was right under the reservoir so I do not think the PS pump was leaking.

The fluid was very aerated and now I am thinking the problem is at the pump itself, although I am not 100% sure that this explains all the symptoms I have noticed. My theory is that the pimp is sucking in air, mixing it with the PS fluid and adding to the systems volume causing an overflow condition.

Do you think I am on the right track?

Thanks in advance.

[cbence]

I am having the same problem with my '97 Q45. I have no power assist at low speeds. This is a variable speed ps system, in which as you increase your speed, there is less power assist. According to my manual, if the ps system does not get a proper signal w/in 10 seconds of starting the engine, the system goes into a "fail safe mode" in which the system operates as if the car is traveling at high speeds. Hence, no low speed assist. I was also having the air problem you referred to and not knowing any better, I replaced the ps pump, but it did not help the lack of low speed assist. After I replaced the ps pump, I spent approx 30 minutes in making sure I got all the air out. I would start the car and turn the steering wheel left and right 8 or 10 times, stop the engine and check the fluid. After doing this approx 10 times, I finally got most if not all the air out. I can drive the car and at high speeds, I can't tell any difference between now and before, but still no low speed assist. The manual says to check the ps solenoid, which is on top of the steering gear. I have no idea what is involved in checking the solenoid, because I can barely touch it with one finger! The manual further states that if the solenoid is ok, then it is probably the ps module. The module is under the dash and is easier to get to, but costs upwards of $700 new. I haven't tried to find a used one, but will.Tomorrow, I am going to start a telephone campaign of shops tha work on Infiniti and see what it will cost me to trouble shoot and repair mine. I'll post the results, if you are interested.Meanwhile, I would welcome any other comments from you or anyone else that has solved this problem or knows someone that has. I especially would like to know how to test the ps solenoid valve.

[GThreat]

Thanks for your post and I am wondering if your Q had 2 problems; 1 you fixed with the pump replacement and the other the yet to be resolved variable control issue?

My manual described the solenoid valve as a twin orifice I just assumed it could be in one of 2 states, and nothing variable in between. In the slow speed mode the larger orifice is placed as a restriction in the hydraulic system, and at higher speed the smaller orifice takes over. This could allow a lot of simplification if the solenoid was spring return to one position and energized for the other. In fail safe the spring holds the smaller orifice in place and only when the solenoid is energized would the larger orifice be in place. I am not sure if this is correct but only my best guess at how it works.

If this was true, then if you put 12V (or whatever the solenoid needs) directly to it and your low speed did not improve, I would have to conclude the solenoid was faulty. If the opposite - probably the fault is in the control circuitry or wiring.

With my current conundrum I cannot see how just a faulty solenoid would allow all that air into the system, but I am sure the more informed who post on this forum could add some insightful comments here.

[maxnix]

Thanks for your prompt reply. I have only owned this car since about 160,000 miles or 3 years and I did not ever change the PS fluid.

Really need to perform and simultaneous extraction refill (a mechnially assissted process) every 2 years as theere is no cooler and little fluid. Heat is the enemy, and exclusively urban driving would call for even a more rigorous maintenance schedule.

The aeriation is a fluid replacement technique problem. In both your cases, I would recommend the mechanical fluid replacement where the Sun (SnapOn) machine is hooked up to the low pressure line for a complete PS fluid exchange. For the Lucas guy or anyone with dark red to brown fluid, I would run the system with a can of BG Quick Clean for AT for 15 -30 minutes of driving with frequent 90° turns immediately before the exchange. The simultaneous mechanical extraction and refill is only effective for realtively fresh fluid and will not extract gunk and detritus from the nether reaches of the steering rack.

[cbence]

Maxnix,Do you know how I might test the ps solenoid?

[maxnix]

Beyond applying 12 volts to it, not really.

Does the FSM prescribe any procedures?

There may be a post in IOM (where all posts regarding mechanical functions and malfunctions are meant to be) concerning the PS solenoid. If the belts and pulleys are correctly functioning, most problems are form the dahbaord unit failing to pass the correct voltage it receives from the speed sensor.

[GThreat]

Problem has been solved!

I am still in a state of amazement over what was causing my problem. Here is what I did:

1. Replaced the power steering pump (thanks for the used one Andy)2. New bearing in the idler pulley3. New belt

Along the way I noticed the main cooling fan had a number of large cracks (topic of previous post) so I replaced that as well.

Hoping for the best, and after refilling with Dexron III, I started the car up yesterday to hear a horrific sound coming from the front. Then the ps fluid started oozing out of the reservoir again, all aerated. I decided I needed to check for leaks using my Mightyvac vacuum kit that I had bought several months ago at Harbor Freight but had never used. I removed the reservoir, plugged the pump supply line and drew a vacuum on the return line. I pumped it down to about 25" of vacuum and left it overnight. This morning it was at 20" vacuum so I had to conclude there was probably no leak in the system, unless of course it only showed up under pressure, but that would still not explain all the air in the system. What to do now?

As I had previous explained, this is my wife's Q45, and my I30 was hers until I had this problem fixed. Could my wife help fix the problem? I took her down to her car and over 5 minutes I explained all I knew about the problem and showed her were all the system components were located. Using her mystical powers she thought for a moment and then said the problem was with the reservoir. Take it off and clean it she instructed me to do. She supervised the cleaning in the laundry room tub, and all this gel like substance was mightyvac'd out. It was then soaked in mineral spirits.

Not sure you have ever studied the design of the reservoir but it is a 2 chamber system with an internal filter media. Then the light went off, and I realized the whole problem was due to the internal filter being blocked and not allowing sufficient fluid into the supply chamber that feeds the pump. The pump was sucking air and cavitating making that horrific sound.

Needless to say with the cleaned reservoir back on, the system flushed and refilled with Dexron III, the problem has been solved. Thank you wife! Also many thanks to all the forum members who chimed in with their advice.

[maxnix]

I no longer have any power steering, after bleeding the system and refilling the reservoir (12 fl oz of Lucas stop leak power steering fluid).

I took her down to her car and over 5 minutes I explained all I knew about the problem and showed her were all the system components were located. Using her mystical powers she thought for a moment and then said the problem was with the reservoir. Take it off and clean it she instructed me to do. She supervised the cleaning in the laundry room tub, and all this gel like substance was mightyvac'd out. It was then soaked in mineral spirits.

Not sure you have ever studied the design of the reservoir but it is a 2 chamber system with an internal filter media. Then the light went off, and I realized the whole problem was due to the internal filter being blocked and not allowing sufficient fluid into the supply chamber that feeds the pump. The pump was sucking air and cavitating making that horrific sound.

Needless to say with the cleaned reservoir back on, the system flushed and refilled with Dexron III, the problem has been solved. Thank you wife! Also many thanks to all the forum members who chimed in with their advice.

Goop in a hydraulic system has never helped said system.

Take you wife out to any dinner she wants.

[NightRiderQ45]

Problem has been solved!

I am still in a state of amazement over what was causing my problem. Here is what I did:

1. Replaced the power steering pump (thanks for the used one Andy)2. New bearing in the idler pulley3. New belt

How did you replace the bearings in the idler pulley? I thought that you had to purchase the whole unit. Where did you purchase your bearings from? One of my idle pulleys is starting to rattle on start up now.

[GThreat]

I used my vice (and a suitably sized socket) to push out the old 6301 DULX bearing. It was in there very tight and I had to add a cheater bar to the handle on my vice to get enough torque on it. This is a very common size and available in many different seal configurations. I found a replacement at the local bearing distributor but it was a 6301 RS2 or something similar. As long as it has seals on both sides I think it will make for a fine replacement. Supposedly the seal configuration can be driven by temperature while in application so metal seals get used when the rubber versions get to their max design temp. I also understand that the rubber seals do a better job of sealing out contaminants.

I used the old bearing to push in the new bearings with the help of my vice again. Be very careful that is goes in straight, so be patient and go slowly checking to make sure it does not skew on you. Never push on the inner race during installation, push on the outer race only. However during removal you have no choice but to push it out using the inner race, so once it is out do not use again.

I saw the 6301's on Ebay as well for as low as $3.00, but these are probably China versions, could be good, but price was not the main consideration for me. I ended up paying $15 which is very high for this, but they had it in stock and it was an NSK.

Good luck

[maxnix]

Note that Nissan uses top quality rated bearings.

Retail on them is about 20 and 6 are required.

[qship96]

Considering how long the original pullys/bearing last {I replaced my original factory installed pullys at 203,000 miles/11 years as preventative maintenance} it seems silly to search for like quality bearings and go thru the hassle of pressing them in....just purchase new OEM pully asemblies from Nissan and be done with it.

[GThreat]

If I wasn't so cheap and had time on my hands I would have gone this route. I am not sure what the eventual failure mode of the pulley would be if it was not a bearing failure. It looked to me like these could almost last forever! I also re-used the pulley off my ps pump as it looked in very good shape as well.

[chipahoy]

Just change the steering rack and quit messing around. if you want to get industrious, you can buy a seal rebuild kit for around $60, but my advice is to just buy a re-manufactured unit for about $300. and, while you have the rack out, put in a new starter. you dont ever want to have to change one of those on a Q45.....

[chipahoy]

This is one of the most ridiculously complex jobs on this car. infiniti engineers must have come into work on a Friday with a hangover when designing the starter placement. first, you have to deal with the insanely difficult and dirty job of completely removing the steering rack and all its associated fluid lines and electrics - meanwhile power steering fluid is running everywhere, all over you, your tools, the ground - even when you try to capture it, its like a dike with a hundred holes. then you have to disconnect the steering wheel rack interface/knuckle to get it out. Now that you have fluid all over the place and the rack is out, the starter is a project into itself. who in the *&%^ placed it like that where you can't take it out? the two bolts come out easily enough - a miracle - but the starter has an extremely long snout that will not allow it to be taken out easily, you have to snake, shift, turn, snake, shift, turn, cuss, take a brake, snake, shift, turn shake cuss. Infiniti must have hired an engineer from Yugo. in my 20+ years working on cars, i have never, ever, had a more difficult time changing a starter.....leave yourself a long weekend and lots of patience.

[HansCC]

Problem has been solved!

I am still in a state of amazement over what was causing my problem. Here is what I did:

1. Replaced the power steering pump (thanks for the used one Andy)2. New bearing in the idler pulley3. New belt

Along the way I noticed the main cooling fan had a number of large cracks (topic of previous post) so I replaced that as well.

Hoping for the best, and after refilling with Dexron III, I started the car up yesterday to hear a horrific sound coming from the front. Then the ps fluid started oozing out of the reservoir again, all aerated. I decided I needed to check for leaks using my Mightyvac vacuum kit that I had bought several months ago at Harbor Freight but had never used. I removed the reservoir, plugged the pump supply line and drew a vacuum on the return line. I pumped it down to about 25" of vacuum and left it overnight. This morning it was at 20" vacuum so I had to conclude there was probably no leak in the system, unless of course it only showed up under pressure, but that would still not explain all the air in the system. What to do now?

As I had previous explained, this is my wife's Q45, and my I30 was hers until I had this problem fixed. Could my wife help fix the problem? I took her down to her car and over 5 minutes I explained all I knew about the problem and showed her were all the system components were located. Using her mystical powers she thought for a moment and then said the problem was with the reservoir. Take it off and clean it she instructed me to do. She supervised the cleaning in the laundry room tub, and all this gel like substance was mightyvac'd out. It was then soaked in mineral spirits.

Not sure you have ever studied the design of the reservoir but it is a 2 chamber system with an internal filter media. Then the light went off, and I realized the whole problem was due to the internal filter being blocked and not allowing sufficient fluid into the supply chamber that feeds the pump. The pump was sucking air and cavitating making that horrific sound.

Needless to say with the cleaned reservoir back on, the system flushed and refilled with Dexron III, the problem has been solved. Thank you wife! Also many thanks to all the forum members who chimed in with their advice.

How much does she charge for by the hour and when is she available -

[chipahoy]

changing the steering rack is a pain in the a**, especially with the fluid all over the place. takes some patience but not that hard of a job. make sure you check out the rack good. some come with the solenoid on the front of the gear housing and some on the back. i got one on the front when my oem had one on the back. so, i had to reconfigure the banjo fitting line to mount on the right side instead of the left. but its nice having a leak free power steering system. oh, my recommendation is wherever there is a rubber hose to use two clamps, just like in an airplane, to have a redundant clamp so you dont have to go back under there after are done. i also recommend replacing the hoses from the reservoir to the pump. use fuel line.