so I got a disturbing email tonight from one of the guys who was in on the ETD manifold group buy. He didnt give me his real name so if you're on here, sorry Im not crediting you or whatever..
Quote »I just received my ETD KA turbo manifold and compared mine with Fiznat's pictures on NICO and Freshalloy. Outwardly, they are similar, but mine has some considerable uneveness on the interior; there is a gaping unwelded hole in runner #4 that opens into runner #3, and part of the #4 pipe intrudes on the #3 pipe exhaust path as it enters the collector. This would appear to cause quite a bit of uneveness of flow in #3 runner. Are all the manifolds similar? Also, the flange for the wastegate is too small for a Tial 38mm and will need some machining to fit.[/quote]Now, I am certanly not an expert on manifold design, so I thought maybe I could show you guys a pic of what he's talking about and maybe we can decide if it's a real problem or not.
Here's a pic of the collector. Sorry the pic is kinda crappy, I'll get a better one tomorrow in better light.
You can sorta see how the 2 runners to the left join together earlier than the rest of the collector..
Also about the wastegate, I REALLY hope that's not true. I dont know if anyone on here has either bought this manifold and has a WG to get a 2nd opinion on the fit, or maybe someone is from the Boston area and I can borrow your WG real quick, but that would be a huge problem if the flange was the wrong size.
Anyways like I said, I am hardly an expert on this- so I would really help if you guys could help me figure out if this is a real problem that I should worry about, or perhaps it's nothing at all...
potential problems with the ETD mani?
yea my manifold looks like that too...
but as for the WG flange.. it works find.. I tried putting my 38mm tial wastegate earlier into the manifold and it fits alright..
edit: If you are talking about the hole size on the WG flange, then yes, the WG inlet flange has a smaller hole diameter than my 38mm tial...
edit: ^^^ disregard what I said, read my post below.
but as for the WG flange.. it works find.. I tried putting my 38mm tial wastegate earlier into the manifold and it fits alright..
edit: If you are talking about the hole size on the WG flange, then yes, the WG inlet flange has a smaller hole diameter than my 38mm tial...
edit: ^^^ disregard what I said, read my post below.
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TrunkMonkey
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TrunkMonkey
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demcj wrote:i'm no expert on welding, but those gaps between each runner worry me. shouldn't they be welded? over time wouldn't they open up even more after constantly expanding and cooling?
-demetrius
Yes, I thought about that too...That was the first thing I noticed about this manifold.But I kept saying to myself that I got it for quite cheap so Im not really complaining.I'm not sure how this manifold will hold up but we will soon find out since I am going to install everything in the middle of next week.Thats why I mentioned somewhere in this forum that Im planning to weld all of those stuff.. good thing my friend has a TIG welder.
I will keep you all updated as I go along.Hopefully everything will go smooth as planned.
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TrunkMonkey
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WDRacing
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They aren't holes in the runners Nate, they are gaps in the weld material right there in the first pic, I think thye though it was welded enough, but after grinding to remove excess bead they left the gaps. It could be rewelded easy enough to fill any gaps and then grinded to remove the weld material again.
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EazyBreazy
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when you put as much time money and effort into planning a full on turbo kit you want the best stuff you can get....some people are like that and i dont blame them. when i get back from japan and finish my kit up ill be like that too..
also that post is completely out of place why dont you do us a favor and stop that..we are trying to asses and possibly prevent any problems someone may have with this particular mani so that someday in the future it may be solved...so that in the future should you want to get rid of that log mani and go to.....oh say the edt mani.....you would have alll the resources to know if your mani was affected and if you dont know how to fix it, how to fix it.
generaly in short keep your garbage post out of a meaningful thread..wanna talk **** go somewhere else please because other people are interested in what these have to say
also that post is completely out of place why dont you do us a favor and stop that..we are trying to asses and possibly prevent any problems someone may have with this particular mani so that someday in the future it may be solved...so that in the future should you want to get rid of that log mani and go to.....oh say the edt mani.....you would have alll the resources to know if your mani was affected and if you dont know how to fix it, how to fix it.
generaly in short keep your garbage post out of a meaningful thread..wanna talk **** go somewhere else please because other people are interested in what these have to say
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bruinbear714
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I FINALLY GOT MY MANIFOLD.. and after initial inspection, the whole manifold looks ceramic coated, including the flange side... what do you guys think about sanding down that surface a little so it can mate with the head a little better?
The bigger issues are that internally, there are cracks, or intersections that have cracks to them...
Not only that, but the exhaust flow from the runner to the turbo is PARTIALLY BLOCKED in #3, as you can see in the pictures.
Looks like I'mma have to break out the dremel.
The bigger issues are that internally, there are cracks, or intersections that have cracks to them...
Not only that, but the exhaust flow from the runner to the turbo is PARTIALLY BLOCKED in #3, as you can see in the pictures.
Looks like I'mma have to break out the dremel.
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TrunkMonkey
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Great pics!!! Much easier to see the defects now. I hate talking badly about another company, but that mani didn't have any attetion paid to the little details after it was fabbed. The runner tubing entering the collector is awful...lol. I'm going to have to fab up my own tubular mani. I have never attempted anything that complicated yet. But I want to see just how difficult it is. Who knows maybe I'll be good at it.
On a plus side, those collector and gate flanges can be filled real easily. Not that you should have to, but it can be done.
Has anyone contacted ETD about the defects so they can atleast correct them on any future manifolds, and possibly move to correct the ones already purchased. I know I would if my work turned out to unsatisfy my customers. Perhaps a link to this thread as well, so we can all give posotive suggestions on how to fix said problems, not to bash them.
Brian
On a plus side, those collector and gate flanges can be filled real easily. Not that you should have to, but it can be done.
Has anyone contacted ETD about the defects so they can atleast correct them on any future manifolds, and possibly move to correct the ones already purchased. I know I would if my work turned out to unsatisfy my customers. Perhaps a link to this thread as well, so we can all give posotive suggestions on how to fix said problems, not to bash them.
Brian
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C-Kwik
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To be honest, I can see why it's hard to weld. Each of the tubes enters the collectors at different angles. Ideally, you want them to enter the collector evenly and at an angle that promotes flow through the turbo flange. While it's acceptable for funtional purposes for this type of collector, the cuts made to the pipes have become much more complex as a result and created hard to reach areas for welding.
It's not terribly difficult to put a little foresight into making a manifold well. This manifold (http://www.executivecleancar.c...x.htm) appears much nicer by comparison. And it was designed to replace the Rev-hard mani so the locations of the flanges were limited. While an equal length might be preferable, this manifold never fails to impress me from an attention to detail standpoint. Everything from good solid welds, to individual head flanges to progressively larger head bolt holes.
It's not terribly difficult to put a little foresight into making a manifold well. This manifold (http://www.executivecleancar.c...x.htm) appears much nicer by comparison. And it was designed to replace the Rev-hard mani so the locations of the flanges were limited. While an equal length might be preferable, this manifold never fails to impress me from an attention to detail standpoint. Everything from good solid welds, to individual head flanges to progressively larger head bolt holes.
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bruinbear714
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I spent a few hours today cleaning up the internals with a dremel at collector #2 and #3... Didn't get it quite as clean as I would like for fear of making the walls too thin or eating into the welds.
My main concerns now are:
1) Is it okay to leave some of that steel exposed to the exhaust gas?
2) With all those uneven rough edges at the collector, I'm afraid that overtime a small piece will flake off and end up in the engine, or grind it's way through the turbine blades.
My main concerns now are:
1) Is it okay to leave some of that steel exposed to the exhaust gas?
2) With all those uneven rough edges at the collector, I'm afraid that overtime a small piece will flake off and end up in the engine, or grind it's way through the turbine blades.
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C-Kwik
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What concerns me more are the crevices where it wasn't welded all the way through. You just can't be sure how it lookes like in these crevices. With the heat the manifold will be exposed to these crevices become an ideal spot for cracks to form. Cracks like to form at sharp edges. Think of it like a fault line(earthquakes).
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bruinbear714
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Well, my smog was coming up so before I threw in the stock manifold and catalytic converter, I test fitted the manifold and turbo I got from cheapturbo. A couple more issues cropped up.
1) The turbo doesn't clear the power steering resevoir and I had to unbolt it to test fit the thing.
2) Its awfully close to the master cylinder and the line. There is about half an inch of clearance there.
Anyone else test fit their manifold? This was on a 97 S14.
1) The turbo doesn't clear the power steering resevoir and I had to unbolt it to test fit the thing.
2) Its awfully close to the master cylinder and the line. There is about half an inch of clearance there.
Anyone else test fit their manifold? This was on a 97 S14.