port and polishing prices?

[ShionS14]

since my last thread (a few questions) didnt get any responses i guess i will ask directly this time. how much would you guys pay for a good port and polish job done on a flow bench? the company i am going to probably use is port pros, they charge about 900 he has done a couple of ka24de heads before and has gotten good results. plus i like the idea that he actually uses a flow bench to determine how much porting and what not, and the fact that he works with comp cams to make custom cams for your particular head is even better. so how much have you guys payed and has anyone else had their head flowed and a custom cam made for it and if so how do you like it?

[ShionS14]

have not that many people paid to get a port and polish job done?

[:: orion ::]

Not enough HP gain to warrant the $1000 price tag.

Most guys either do a simple bolt-on N/A setup (I/H/E, ECU, pulley, etc...) or save for a turbo'd KA.

Since the low revs of the KA will limit it's N/A potential, there's not that much reason to dump $4000 into it to get ~180rwhp at the most (N/A). I have that much in my turbo setup and ~300rwhp...money well spent.

...so to answer your question directly...no, not that many people have had this done.

- Brian

[ShionS14]

but i am staying N/A and a good port and polish job coupled with a custom cam ground to my heads flow characteristics will gain more horsepower then joe mechanic grinding away his head in his garage with a dremel and slapping a cam made for the masses.

then to add ITB with a standalone put it on a dyno and tune it, you would have a very potent naturally aspirated ka engine, that might, just might be crowning the 200 mark.

you have your turbo, thats good for you, but i want a challange, i want to go after something that hasnt been proven time and time again

[Ajax]

I'm having quite a bit done, and I know that the machinist doing the port/polish is very expensive (the reason he's not doing the block). I'll try to get a break-down of where the money is going, maybe not until I get the car back in late May, though.

[PandaS14]

Shion: you don't need custom ground cams. Crower recently introduced a line for ka24de's. all the way up to 294 duration and god knows what lift. Enjuku is the only place that sells them as of now.

I say that's a good price for a P&P. A GOOD* P&P alone can net 15-25hp with absolutely no loss in low end. Paired with cams, you can get some big numbers.

ITB's + Standalone + high comp + P&P + Crazy Cams and supporting mods will definately get you where you want. These are my plans anyways.

[neagan]

Good for you for being willing to eek out every last potential horsepower gain out of this engine. I bet you'll notice a really smoooooth power band afterwards! Nitro

[sanioll]

I bet you'll notice a really smoooooth power band afterwards!

well, he can always add a heavy flywheel to smooth it out.

[ShionS14]

i say custom cam, not necessarily having one made but using his flow bench and comp cams to find out what cam will work best, by the way panda, are you putting your itb on a DE or E? I was looking at my intake mani this afternoon and noticed the spider web of fuel lines and was wondering how you took care of securing all of them?

[PandaS14]

Yea, that's a cool way to go. Have him tell you the specs he recommends, then see which cams fit best.

My TB's are going on the DE in my S14. The fuel lines are really simple actually. There is the one coming from the fuel filter that goes to and intermediary metal piece that bolts to the intake mani, then another piece of hose that goes from that into the rail. I just picked up some extra 5/16" fuel hose and am running a line from the fuel filter outlet to the fuel rail inlet. Then there is the same type of setup for the fuel return to the tank, with an intermediary metal piece. I'm getting rid of that and running a line from the fuel rail outlet down to the metal part of the fuel return line on the passenger side frame rail (just below the fuel filter). Securing them is cake, just use zipties where necessary. As long as they (fuel lines) are not gonna chafe on anything or near anything sharp, you're fine. But make sure to leave a little slack to allow for engine movements.

Here's a good link Devious shared with me about porting and other head mods. Give it a read! Only difference is that if you're gonna be using a standalone, you can go crazier than they did, cause you don't have to worry about it messing up OBDII.

http://www.se-r.net/about/200s....html

[ShionS14]

thanks for the link! i love reading tech stuff like that so if you or devious have any others in requards to cams, piston speed, port and polishing, and especially harmonics( always fascinated about how harmonics play a huge role in the exhaust manifold and intake runners) i would love it.

i am starting to not want to do itb anymore, i would want something more like a toda kit not to say yours' isnt nice but i dont like the idea of having the fuel injectors on the head seperated by a runner from the throttle body, it takes away some from the ITB setup. i did find that TWM Induction can make a custom kit for you but it is about $4500. oh well we will see after i get this done

[PandaS14]

Here's another link where Devious and another guy explain about crank mods for our engines:

http://www.club240.com/forums/...ber=8

About half way down the page.

As for the TB's, what do you mean having one injector per port defeats point of ITB's? The purpose of ITB's is to let each cylinder suck as much air as it needs, in a nutshell. Injector placement is important too, and there are many different theories as to how it should be done. Best is to have 2 sets of injectors, one haging over the inlets of the velocity stacks, and the second set right after the throttle plates.

Oh yea, I don't take anything personally, so it's all good.

[ShionS14]

no i meant having the injectors seperated from the throttle body by the runner, i dont like that setup, if i can figure out a way to place an injector closer to the throttle body or fashion some other throttle body setup than ya i will go with itb but i havent come up with anything yet

[PandaS14]

To do that, you need to make a new rail and find a way to mount it to the throttle bodies. There isn't just a way to do a bolt-in setup, but nothing with ITB's for our cars is, so that's just how it goes.

[ShionS14]

i think it would be nice if i had the money to get TWM to make a custom throttle body kit though maybe in time, have you read my post about the high compression pistons yet?

[PandaS14]

you would really pay $4500 for a set of throttle bodies? damn. Honestly the differences in atomization of fuel at the tb's versus 6" later down the manifold aren't that much. Maybe a couple hp difference at max. Ideally my manifold would be much shorter, so if you did a custom mani, the differences would be even less. Not that big of a deal imo.

I don't believe any aftermarket forged piston manufacturers make pistons that are flycut. And with a large lift cam and high comp, you will more likely than not need the pistons flycut. You check by assembling the motor with a thin layer of putty on top of the pistons. Then turn the engine through a couple full rotations, dissasemble, and see how close the valves got to the pistons. If the valves are getting pushed into the pistons, you won't even be able to turn the engine over by hand. You then have a machinist flycut the pistons too the desired depth.

Hope that helps.

[ShionS14]

i was hoping there was a way of figuring it out with out having to assemble the motor oh well, can you tell me if there any after market pistons out there that raise comp with out having to bore

[PandaS14]

I'm sure there is some kind of equation you could use to figure it out, but it'd be different for every engine.

I'm not aware of any aftermarket pistons that come in stock bore. This is because it's a bad idea to throw new pistons into a block that could be and most likely is out of spec. A fresh bore is strongly recommended for rebuilds because you know what you're working with is perfectly circular and will ensure good ring seal. Without boring, just slapping new pistons in, you run a pretty good risk of not getting a good ring seal, and having to do it all over again. you don't need to bore very much, just like .020" over.

[neagan]

Panda, a question about boring out the block. (I'm not anywhere near your mechanical aptitude, so please bear with me) In the past, I've always had the cylinders bored over for tight ring seal. However, on the engines I've had done they were always carberated, not FI. I found that going to much larger in the piston resizing called for rejetting the carb. Does the FI in these engines compensate for .30 over or more? Thanks, Nitro

[PandaS14]

haha I don't know near as much as you think I do.

Basically, no, EFI systems such as our stock one will not correct for that. the oxygen sensors are not accurate enough to tell the difference, so nothing would happen. The motor would be leaned out a tiny bit, but not much.

[neagan]

Thanks; appreciate the response. Nitro