Poor Navigation System. Few points of interest. Anyone else agree?

[jkellynewyork]

I feel that the infiniti navigation is very poor when it comes to finding a point of interest. I think 75% of the time I enter a store, for example like Staples, which I know is a couple of miles away, it does not come up. My Garmin handheld, which is about 3-4 years older than the infiniti, is much more reliable. I find myself having to bring my handheld with me to punch in the name of the store, get the exact address to punch into the Infiniti navigation.

It seems like whoever created the points of interest did a very poor job, leaving out about 75% of the yellow pages.

I send in a complaint to infiniti. I took a look online and saw that there was an update DVD for something like $200. It said it updated points of interest by 14% and deleted (i guess closed shops and locations) of about 12%. I dont think this looks promising based on how many times points of interest have not showed up on the infiniti navigation.

Is this how many navigations points of interest are, only adding a few points of interest, but not covering a vast amount of other locations?

Maybe I was spoiled with my Garmin points of interest.


Modified by jkellynewyork at 2:41 PM 1/3/2007

[CRG]

Not only do I agree on the POI but also the routing is inferior to Garmin. I sent Zenrin three different examples of how their routing was longer (in time and miles) than Garmin but they gave no explanation or fix.

Overall, the system is okay but I always have a backup, either a Yahoo map or my Garmin 2620.

[jkellynewyork]

Unbelievable. Pay an arm and leg for inferior navigation. Makes me think twice about going Nissan again, or at least I will have to do some research on Nav systems before next lease.

It seems like it would be a good move for Nissan (or other car manufacturers) to partner with Garmin (or other reputable Nav company) for its Navigations instead of using some no name company. You get the quality Garmin name plus a great nav product. I guess they are paying this company pennies for this crappy Nav and massively marking up the price for a sweet profit. But I think this is short term thinking - Navs are becoming essentials for many people in my IMO and if your NAV is not reliable, it is like not having a NAV at all - you have to go through the motions - yahoo directions, or what not, that the Nav is supposed to replace.

[tkeskic]

If you think the Nav in your Infiniti is bad, try out the one from Benz...i have both systems, and the infiniti is by far, much better...

tk

[tkeskic]

How are you accessing the POIs?are you just looking for the icons on the map? or are you using the catagory search tool (is resturants, malls, that sort of thing)?

I find that with the voice command, you can only preselect what 5 appear in the vocie select menu, and to get the other groups you have to pull over and manualy do it.

I didnt think the POI was that bad... but I guess it depends on where you are, and what your looking for.tk
Modified by tkeskic at 4:27 PM 1/2/2007

[wva3081]

I have used the nav system for six months while traveling about 8K miles on about eight trips from New England to South Carolina and have not had a failure yet in finding POIs (stores, restaurants, gas stations, locations by phone number, etc). I also own a Garmin (2720), and I found them to be about equal. But, there is not $1,000 difference between them!

[jkellynewyork]

I have used the nav system for six months while traveling about 8K miles on about eight trips from New England to South Carolina and have not had a failure yet in finding POIs (stores, restaurants, gas stations, locations by phone number, etc). I also own a Garmin (2720), and I found them to be about equal. But, there is not $1,000 difference between them!

I travel between New York and New Jersey. I dont limit by category but do a broad search by name and then sort by distance. I am not saying no points of interest come up, but a point of interest, lets say for example Cheescake Factory (on Old Country Road, Westbury, NY) which I know is 1 mile away from where my car is, will not come up but give me a cheesecake factory 50 miles away. It comes up on my Garmin.

I entered Nordstroms, which is in Paramus Park mall in NJ the other day, it did not come up. I enter Nordstroms in the Garmin handheld and its comes up.

I entered Syms discount department store in Paramus NJ the other day, it did not come up. I enter it in the Garmin it comes up right away.

The examples could go on.

Go punch those stores in and see if they come up, they should not.

It makes no sense that you find every POI and I cannot find most of the ones I enter. Could it be that you do not enter in POI that you are specifically looking for but search generally, or you have been getting lucky and do not search to many POI'S?

[jkellynewyork]

Update: I complained to the map maker Zenrin (see below) and below the complaint is their response. Note:Why should there be a limit on the points of interest, you have a million gig dvd -- I think the real reason for the poor Nav is that it is labor intensive to enter in all of the retail establishments and other POIs out there, and Zenrin does not have the man power, and is taking its sweet *** time to add these - hence its new 7.2 version for $190 dollars with "More than 5.7 million updated points of interest in 54 categories -- A 24% increase"-Hopefully in August 2008 when I lease my next car, these no name mapping companies will be up to speed.

***Comments***

Almost 75% of the time, the points of interest does not find a store that I know exists. Like Staples at a mall or Office Max a few miles away. My Garmin handheld which is much older that the [2006] Infiniti is much more reliable, and I have to bring my handheld all the time now to punch in the store and get the actual address to punch into the Infiniti Nav. This is very frustrating. Why are there so many points of interest missing? It makes me not want to stick with Infinti on my next lease even though I like the car otherwise.

Subject:RE: Zenrin.com Infiniti Help Desk Contact Request

Dear Customer,

With careful researching, our results show that consumers would most likely search for a hotel, restaurant, atm or a gas station. Since space is limited in the updates, we have concentrated on the most common searches customers would search for. Other searches would give limited results then search for popular interests. However, we still do appreciate your comments on the point of interest field. I will forward your email to our production and development department.

Thank you

Neeraj Chand

Zenrin USA

Modified by jkellynewyork at 2:38 PM 1/3/2007

[jkellynewyork]

This is some info I found on Zenrin

from the Zenrin web site:Founded as a paper map company in southern Japan in 1948, Zenrin currently commands about 90% of the map market throughout Japan...

In Japan, Zenrin's mapping software powers over 70% of in-vehicle navigation systems...

Zenrin customizes its mapping software for companies that make navigation devices. Customers in Japan include:

Alpine, Casio, Kenwood, Sanyo, Xanavi, Citizen, Sharp, Sony, NEC, Toshiba, Panasonic, JVC, Hitachi, Fujitsu Ten, Honda, Maspro, Mitsubishi

--No wonder why their maps are poor, it is primarily a Japanese mapping company. They are probably buying maps from a cheap US Supplier.

[jkellynewyork]

This is a real bummer. I loved the reliability of my Garmin. After I leased my m35, I loved having an in dash GPS without the hassle of setting up the Garmin -- but I guess it is back to the good old Garmin handheld

[rizzoroba]

I can't resist adding my 2 cents here. I received a Garmin Nuvi for Christmas, and I am stunned at how many POIs are actually in that thing! Even one off little shops come up in the listings. It's amazing.

Fast forward to just after New Years, and I'm sitting in my friends brand new Acura TL Type-S, and he's showing my the Nav. He looks for a borders, and it comes up with something about 100 miles away, but still in the same state. We try a Starbucks, and the same thing, with about three hits for the whole state. He became very angry, as the Garmin in my hand was listing everything imaginable, so he vowed to contact the dealer the next day to see what was up, as neither of us believed the system could actually be that poor (the Garmin only cost about 650.00 and seemed superior.) Well, the next day, he tells me that the dealer said he could update the brand new system on his brand new car for a cool 190.00!!! What a joke. It seems like a guaranteed waste of money to me.

My friend declared that it didn't matter because any time he used his nav, he'd probably know the address anyway. Yeah, right. Just last week I was in the next state over and we wanted to find some food. I punched in a McDonalds and we were at the closest one in about 3 minutes. To me, looking up destinations using a POI directory is absolutely essential.

Sounds to me like Zenrin has a stranglehold monopoly on the DVD/nav software, and there is no real incentive to make it good. That's absolute crap that the company claims there's not enough room to put all the POIs, so they just include the ones people are more likely to use!!! WTF????!!! How does my little Garmin manage it so well. Not only does that statement serve as a poor excuse for their inferior directory, but it pretty much guarantees that future updates will be inadequate as well. What a disappointing company. I wonder if the domestic car nav systems are the same way?

Go to the Zenrin website, and down the bottom in small print, you'll seem them spouting proudly about how their the sole source for the DVD software. Congratulations Zenrin... you suck.

[jkellynewyork]

rizzoroba - very well said. The Garmin is like heaven. When I want to hit a restaurant or go to a store, I punch it in the Garmin and everything imaginable comes up. Zenrin's GPS will have you driving 60 miles to go to a location (if you are lucky for it to bring up the location at all) when the same or similar location was probably 10 minutes from you.

We have to flood complaints to the car manufacturers to get them to change. POIs are very important and are essential in my opinion.

FYI - I contacted Garmin because I wanted to know my options for my next lease. This is their response.

Hello,

Thank you for contacting Garmin International. Glad to help as there are some maker out w/the GPS unit as an option BMW, Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep & Hyundai.

Should you have further questions please contact Garmin Product Support by replying to this email or contact our Consumer Support Line at 800-800-1020 Monday-Friday 8am-5pm CST.

Best Regards,

Thomas R. Garmin Automotive Specialist 2nd Shift Support 1200 E. 151st Street Olathe, Ks 66062 Phone 800-800-1020 Fax 913-440-5488 http://www.garmin.com

[jase1125]

The problem is the handheld units hold more data as it is stored on a hard drive. The infiniti Nav system is on a dual layer DVD so it maxes out a little over 8GB.

[cpt276]

I've been a longtime member, but always observing, rarely participating.

Anyway, I've read everyone's concern over Infiniti's nav system. My assumptions are that these reactions are for the current M series (05 - ). Does anybody have any opinions on the nav systems with the older M45 (03-04)?

Thanks,Brian

[Silvia2b]

Many other american based map DVD's use Navteq mapping, I've never heard of Zenrin in the aftermarket systems being sold and marketed, even though the same companies make OEM gear too.

[jkellynewyork]

The problem is the handheld units hold more data as it is stored on a hard drive. The infiniti Nav system is on a dual layer DVD so it maxes out a little over 8GB.

I completely disagree with your statement and it is just plainly incorrect.

First, Nissan (Zenrin) could easily put in a mass storage harddrive for the in dash units, but they do not and instead provide a direct link to a DVD drive (which is probably one of the reasons for higher cost - it is like having your own computer in the car).

The direct link allows you to use updated DVD maps easily.

My Garmin Ique handheld unit only holds 288mb of info. I could only upload a few states at a time. I upload it from a DVD through my home computer which seems to hold all of North America Maps with no problem.

In addition, there is no reason to be limited to one dvd. If all of the maps cannot fit on one dvd, put one half of the country on one, the other half on another.

Finally, and what I think makes your statement flat out incorrect, is that one of Garmins best portable units, the 2720 only has a 2gb hardrive which is able to hold all of North America AND Canada. So, I think a DVD with 8gb, almost four times the space of this hard drive is enough space.

(see this link at end of review - http://www.gpsnews.org/gps-sys...eview/)

So the lack of space is clearly not the resaon for Zenrin's inferior maps.

[jkellynewyork]

I've been a longtime member, but always observing, rarely participating.

Anyway, I've read everyone's concern over Infiniti's nav system. My assumptions are that these reactions are for the current M series (05 - ). Does anybody have any opinions on the nav systems with the older M45 (03-04)?

Thanks,Brian

Per Zenrin's website, they are the provider of all of the maps for Nissan and Infiniti - see website for some Infiniti models, which includes older m45 03-04. - http://www.zenrin.com/infinitiSystem.asp

Because they are older models, the points of information information is likely to be worse than the current models, unless you have the update DVD - which if the car does not already have it, will cost $190 plus shipping handling. But careful, because as discussed above, there is reason to believe that the new updated maps will still have a lack of points and interests problem.

[sr79labrat]

I have an 03 M45 and think the nav is awesome! That is coming from not having any though....

I did notice new areas of developement are not updates via sat...if that is possible? Is there an active service available or just the disk upgrade?

So far the nav is far better than me looking at a map to figure things out!KTW

[deanm]

I have an '07 M35x with Nav (database version 7.1) and I've found that the system is not consistent in the way displays POIs, that it's missing what should be obvious POIs, and shows some really old defunct POIs.

Sometimes it won't show a nearby POI if you punch in the name, but shows it when you search for "Nearby POI". I punched in "Target" when I knew there was an established (>4 years old) Target store about a mile from me. It didn't show up in the list, but when I asked for nearby POIs it did show up.

The POI database is missing some well-established POIs. Example: when asked for"Nordstrom", it showed a fairly new Nordstrom store about 20 miles away, but didn't show a 10-year-old store about two miles away--no matter how it was requested, by name or as a nearby POI.

The POI database showed a water park in town that hasn't been there for at least seven years.

There also seem to be a number of misspellings and different spellings for different locations for the same business. Maybe this is why the listings are so confusing.

This is the first Nav system I've ever owned and I'm not sure I can trust it.I suppose it's possible that the 7.2 version of the database will have fixed some of these issues, but it'll be a $190 gamble to find out.

Let's hope Zenrin has an ISO-9000 process in place to address and fix these issues quickly.

[Popsickle]

So far I think the '03 Acura has the best GPS system on the market. But Chevy's '07 GPS looks pretty nice, just haven't had a chance to drive one yet. And for BMW, well I've been lost in an (I think '03) X5! lol POI always seemed to be a 1/4-2/4 mile away.

[jkellynewyork]

Interesting observations deanm.