panasport fitment: 16X7 +6 ?
panasport fitment: 16X7 +6 ?
These were fitted for a 240z, but share the 4lug pattern with my S13. would a 16x7 +6 offset fit my car? would it clear 30mm z32 brakes?im pondering selling my z brakes (not on the car yet, wont fit under current 16's) and getting some nicer wheels and just some better pads.-Enzo
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BuudWeizErr
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i wouldn't really worry about it. it's not ridiculously low. Me and Chet had a big long conversation about offsets and wheel sizing in a thread a few weeks ago. search for it.
just so you know, brake clearance is based on wheel backspacing, not offset. post a picture of the wheel spoke design, and we may be able to say.
just so you know, brake clearance is based on wheel backspacing, not offset. post a picture of the wheel spoke design, and we may be able to say.
ChunkiDori wrote:i wouldn't really worry about it. it's not ridiculously low. Me and Chet had a big long conversation about offsets and wheel sizing in a thread a few weeks ago. search for it.
just so you know, brake clearance is based on wheel backspacing, not offset. post a picture of the wheel spoke design, and we may be able to say.
*Cough cough* BS *cough*
To the thread starter...Number uno, that is a very low offset. Will you have problems? Who knows. But don't think you aren't putting more stress on the hub/bearing than necessary. If you sheer off a stud or trash your wheel bearings, you'll know why.
Number 2, brake clearance is NOT only due to wheel backspacing. Offset also plays a key role. They go hand and hand. This pic gives you a good idea of how (it's from Exar's faq FYI).
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BuudWeizErr
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Dori Dori wrote:*Cough cough* BS *cough*
To the thread starter...Number uno, that is a very low offset. Will you have problems? Who knows. But don't think you aren't putting more stress on the hub/bearing than necessary. If you sheer off a stud or trash your wheel bearings, you'll know why.
Number 2, brake clearance is NOT only due to wheel backspacing. Offset also plays a key role. They go hand and hand. This pic gives you a good idea of how (it's from Exar's faq FYI).[ig]http://z31.com/images/offset.gif[/img]
You want to call BS on me? READ THE THREAD:http://www.nissaninfiniticlub....69582
BRAKE CLEARANCE IS DEPENDENT ON WHEEL BACKSPACING.I have a +40 wheel that clears Z32 brakes, and I have friends who have +20 wheels that don't clear. So don't tell me that it's all one or the other. The lower the offset, the better the chance it will clear bigger brake calipers, but it's not the end all defining characteristic. There are so many different backspacing designs that you're better off looking for one with good backspacing than trying to make a wheel that doesn't have adequate backspacing in the correct offset, so you have to go lower to achieve the correct amount of backspacing fit.
EnzoRWD wrote:im real glad we;re all having this online pissing contest, but im still interested in the fitment of some panasport rims. can anyone give an offset estimate from that photo? i have others too-Enzo
what they are doing is not a pissing match..
you CAN be thankfull for people helping you kno...
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BuudWeizErr
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EnzoRWD wrote:im real glad we;re all having this online pissing contest, but im still interested in the fitment of some panasport rims. can anyone give an offset estimate from that photo? i have others too-Enzo
OK fine.
No, it will probably not fit with z32 brakes ok?
the spoke design is not conducive to the amounts of backspacing you need. You would need spacers.
ok sorry my post came off sounding very rude. i thought the question was answered in the beginning of the thread, that +6 offset is too low, causes stress, and either way probably wont clear z brakes. i thought there was excessive agrument about whether offset or spoke design allows for caliper fitment. In my opinion it was off topic but it isnt my place and i guess i wont comment on it again.sorry all, my badthank you for the advice tho, i wont be going with those original wheels...-Enzo
people need to quit *****ing about omfg hub stressi ran16x8.5 -10 and 16x9.5 -19 panasport c8-r wheels for 3 years no problems
quit complaining about extrapolation of hub stress and shearing bolts...just make sure your lug nuts are good and tight and thats that..
yes they will fitthey should look decent
will they clear z brake
maybe -- most panasport spokes curve inward, but on wheels like the one you're getting...they're flat backed not rounded, which will make it a little harder to clearit should be within 1-2mm
just throw a 5mm ring type spacer on there if it doesnt clear
quit complaining about extrapolation of hub stress and shearing bolts...just make sure your lug nuts are good and tight and thats that..
yes they will fitthey should look decent
will they clear z brake
maybe -- most panasport spokes curve inward, but on wheels like the one you're getting...they're flat backed not rounded, which will make it a little harder to clearit should be within 1-2mm
just throw a 5mm ring type spacer on there if it doesnt clear
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BuudWeizErr
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I was going to say something about the hub stress too. 16x7 +6 isn't that horribly bad... when you're getting up to like 16x8 -30 is when I would worry. But besides that, it looks terrible without widebody / flares.
ask exar-kun, we talked about the bearing stress issue a little bit, and S chassis cars don't really have big problems with bearing wear. If we all drove FC's on the other hand, then yeah, those of us running low offsets would be in a huge pile of crap.
ask exar-kun, we talked about the bearing stress issue a little bit, and S chassis cars don't really have big problems with bearing wear. If we all drove FC's on the other hand, then yeah, those of us running low offsets would be in a huge pile of crap.
*deep breath*I sup[pose its time for me to throw my take into this, here we go:
Backspacing is the distance from the innermost part of a wheel to the mounting plane. backspacing=offset + wheelwidth / 2
thusly, offset and backspacing are just two different ways of stating the same thing. Both refer to the mointing plane on the wheel, but reference it wither to the rear of the wheel(backspacing) or the centerline of the wheel(offset).
you hear nbackspacing on more 'murican car wheels(mustangs, camaro, etc) than imports, where the numbers are all in offset and mm usually.
as far as clearance, the thing you have to check for clearance, number one, is the inner lip of the wheel, right behind the spokes, if thats too close it will hit the "top" of the caliper, which is why you need certain 15" or usually 16" wheels to clear Z brakes(26mm can be cleared with some 15" wheels..30mm brakes require 16" or larger)...
after that, the lower the offset(and backspacing) the better you are for clearing larger brakes, usually. This is because the spokes will usually be 'spaced' out a bit from the mounting plane(the peice that presses against the brake rotor/hub assembly of the car) sometimes this is not the case though, and there is minimal spacing, and the inside of the spokes rub the caliper...but thats wheel specific problems and where this quote came from"you'll never know for sure until you test fit it"
now then, onto larger issues.
enzo was right about:"beginning of the thread, that +6 offset is too low, causes stress, and either way probably wont clear z brakes."
it was answered. but in the ensuing complications lets clear some things up.
"people need to quit *****ing about omfg hub stressi ran16x8.5 -10 and 16x9.5 -19 panasport c8-r wheels for 3 years no problems"thats great you managed to run an improper (i assume this is on a 240)offset wheel, making your hubs and suspension overwork because of the additional leverage you palced on them(not to mention weight), but lets not tell people to do it KNOWING it can cause problems.
"quit complaining about extrapolation of hub stress and shearing bolts...just make sure your lug nuts are good and tight and thats that.."
extrapolations? it's physics! you're incearsing the length of a arm on a lever, it makes MORE FORCE. I;ve said it many times, if people want to run things lkike this on their cars, I will inform them of the problems they'll face, and I am glad you ran that with no problems. tight lug nuts will not save your hubs or your studs.
next up! as chunki said, I havent seen problems running lower offsets than waht I consider "ideal" on Z chassis cars to ruin bearings or studs, or anything like I've seen on other cars...this may be due to the nice suspension, strong bearsings, I really dont care...but I dont see many problems with it...other than those discussed before(weight, tracking issues, leverage on the suspension arms/springs, etc, and causing the stress on the tire to be weighted almost exclusively on the inner edge) you can negates some of the additional stress by running a lighter wheel and tire assembly, but it wont solve the root problem.
on dori's point"Number uno, that is a very low offset. Will you have problems? Who knows. But don't think you aren't putting more stress on the hub/bearing than necessary. If you sheer off a stud or trash your wheel bearings, you'll know why."
he's completey correct, and like myself isnt saying you WILL encounter a problem, but merely informing you WHY something may happen, and that you're setting yourself up for it to happen. this is simmilar to me telling people not to run large heavy tire on a truck without beefier steering stabilizers..you may not ruin the stock one, but if you do..I warned you(told you why it would).
there's a lot of informed people on this board, with massively differeing opinions on what constititues what should or shouldnt be done to an S chassis(or other chassic car), and I thoroughly enjoy reading all the opinions, facts, etc brought up..
one thing I think we've all forgoten about the boards is TO HELP THE PERSON WHO POSTED THE QUESTION WITH THEIR APPLICATION PROBLEM, not debate what we think is the best looking/handing wheel package or whatever, or whether spacers will blow up a car...
Aslo, thee seems to be a serious lack of reading my "attention" sticky about questions...asking for advice without dropping in a "I want to do X with the car, have X budget" specific info will be seen as botha nnoying to me, and I may find myself inclided to start deleteing things.
if you read all that, I hope you've learned something(other than that I have poor spelling), and take my advice with a small grain of salt, since I still have a bunch to learn, but I'll do what I can.
ease up! have fun! I am on vacation for 4 days. play nice.-chet
Backspacing is the distance from the innermost part of a wheel to the mounting plane. backspacing=offset + wheelwidth / 2
thusly, offset and backspacing are just two different ways of stating the same thing. Both refer to the mointing plane on the wheel, but reference it wither to the rear of the wheel(backspacing) or the centerline of the wheel(offset).
you hear nbackspacing on more 'murican car wheels(mustangs, camaro, etc) than imports, where the numbers are all in offset and mm usually.
as far as clearance, the thing you have to check for clearance, number one, is the inner lip of the wheel, right behind the spokes, if thats too close it will hit the "top" of the caliper, which is why you need certain 15" or usually 16" wheels to clear Z brakes(26mm can be cleared with some 15" wheels..30mm brakes require 16" or larger)...
after that, the lower the offset(and backspacing) the better you are for clearing larger brakes, usually. This is because the spokes will usually be 'spaced' out a bit from the mounting plane(the peice that presses against the brake rotor/hub assembly of the car) sometimes this is not the case though, and there is minimal spacing, and the inside of the spokes rub the caliper...but thats wheel specific problems and where this quote came from"you'll never know for sure until you test fit it"
now then, onto larger issues.
enzo was right about:"beginning of the thread, that +6 offset is too low, causes stress, and either way probably wont clear z brakes."
it was answered. but in the ensuing complications lets clear some things up.
"people need to quit *****ing about omfg hub stressi ran16x8.5 -10 and 16x9.5 -19 panasport c8-r wheels for 3 years no problems"thats great you managed to run an improper (i assume this is on a 240)offset wheel, making your hubs and suspension overwork because of the additional leverage you palced on them(not to mention weight), but lets not tell people to do it KNOWING it can cause problems.
"quit complaining about extrapolation of hub stress and shearing bolts...just make sure your lug nuts are good and tight and thats that.."
extrapolations? it's physics! you're incearsing the length of a arm on a lever, it makes MORE FORCE. I;ve said it many times, if people want to run things lkike this on their cars, I will inform them of the problems they'll face, and I am glad you ran that with no problems. tight lug nuts will not save your hubs or your studs.
next up! as chunki said, I havent seen problems running lower offsets than waht I consider "ideal" on Z chassis cars to ruin bearings or studs, or anything like I've seen on other cars...this may be due to the nice suspension, strong bearsings, I really dont care...but I dont see many problems with it...other than those discussed before(weight, tracking issues, leverage on the suspension arms/springs, etc, and causing the stress on the tire to be weighted almost exclusively on the inner edge) you can negates some of the additional stress by running a lighter wheel and tire assembly, but it wont solve the root problem.
on dori's point"Number uno, that is a very low offset. Will you have problems? Who knows. But don't think you aren't putting more stress on the hub/bearing than necessary. If you sheer off a stud or trash your wheel bearings, you'll know why."
he's completey correct, and like myself isnt saying you WILL encounter a problem, but merely informing you WHY something may happen, and that you're setting yourself up for it to happen. this is simmilar to me telling people not to run large heavy tire on a truck without beefier steering stabilizers..you may not ruin the stock one, but if you do..I warned you(told you why it would).
there's a lot of informed people on this board, with massively differeing opinions on what constititues what should or shouldnt be done to an S chassis(or other chassic car), and I thoroughly enjoy reading all the opinions, facts, etc brought up..
one thing I think we've all forgoten about the boards is TO HELP THE PERSON WHO POSTED THE QUESTION WITH THEIR APPLICATION PROBLEM, not debate what we think is the best looking/handing wheel package or whatever, or whether spacers will blow up a car...
Aslo, thee seems to be a serious lack of reading my "attention" sticky about questions...asking for advice without dropping in a "I want to do X with the car, have X budget" specific info will be seen as botha nnoying to me, and I may find myself inclided to start deleteing things.
if you read all that, I hope you've learned something(other than that I have poor spelling), and take my advice with a small grain of salt, since I still have a bunch to learn, but I'll do what I can.
ease up! have fun! I am on vacation for 4 days. play nice.-chet
ChunkiDori wrote:just so you know, brake clearance is based on wheel backspacing, not offset
ChunkiDori wrote:The lower the offset, the better the chance it will clear bigger brake calipers, but it's not the end all defining characteristic.
con·tra·dic·tion
Direct opposition or repugnancy; inconsistency; incongruity or contrariety; one who, or that which, is inconsistent.
I never said that. To save you the trouble of having to go back and read, I'll quote myself.ChunkiDori wrote:I have a +40 wheel that clears Z32 brakes, and I have friends who have +20 wheels that don't clear. So don't tell me that it's all one or the other.
Oh, and since you like old threads, here's one that proves you wrong (well, before you contradicted yourself).http://www.nissaninfiniticlub....ffset Take note to c-kwik's reply.Dori Dori wrote:Number 2, brake clearance is NOT only due to wheel backspacing. Offset also plays a key role. They go hand and hand.
ps- Enzo, sorry for pissing in your Cheerios, but I was trying to help clear up some dirty rumors.
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BuudWeizErr
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You quoted my whole post and said BS.
then you went back and reinforced what i said.
figure out what you want to say before you go calling BS.
so tell me something. whats more likely to clear z brakes, and still fit under a stock fender... a wheel with a lower offset, or a wheel with a grip of backspacing. A combination of the two is best, but more backspacing will clear a z caliper and a stock fender easier than a super low offset.
if you hadn't called bs on everything i said, which was clearly not BS, then we wouldn't be having this argument. BS calling was unnecessary.
edit: and c kwik only said the exact same thing i said earlier.
then you went back and reinforced what i said.
figure out what you want to say before you go calling BS.
so tell me something. whats more likely to clear z brakes, and still fit under a stock fender... a wheel with a lower offset, or a wheel with a grip of backspacing. A combination of the two is best, but more backspacing will clear a z caliper and a stock fender easier than a super low offset.
if you hadn't called bs on everything i said, which was clearly not BS, then we wouldn't be having this argument. BS calling was unnecessary.
edit: and c kwik only said the exact same thing i said earlier.
WTH are you talking about. Can you even read what you wrote? You clearly stated that offset does not affect brake clearance. Do I need to quote you again? You then contradicted yourself and said EXACTLY what I said (that spoke design and offset both contribute to brake clearance). Seriously buddy, go back and read...slowly...carefully.
And ckwik did NOT say what you said earlier. Again...go back and read your first reply...in this thread...the one that I quoted...twice.
And everything you did say...the first time...was clearly BS; like it or not.
And ckwik did NOT say what you said earlier. Again...go back and read your first reply...in this thread...the one that I quoted...twice.
And everything you did say...the first time...was clearly BS; like it or not.
daniel, thats an old 240z chassis, from what I can see, and the wheels HAD lower offsets to begin with. jeesus....Thats just assinine, comparing a car that came with a low offset wheel to ours, with +40 offset wheels and different suspension systems. If you cant tell the difference, please cease any type of psoting on this subject until you learn a bit more. a old cahssis designed with more stress on the outside of the bearing can run those wheels, our suspension were designed with most of the stress on the inner portion of the bearing......
baka.
I'm only going to say this one last time, then this is locked.
OFFSET AND BACKSPACING ARE TWO WAYS OF STATING THE SAME THING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
christ. I'm sick of people debating "haivng both" or that one is better than the other///THEY'RE THE SAME THING.
this is locked, I'm going to boston.
I suggest everyone take a step back, and think about what they;re posting before throwing things up there, this thread has managed to anger me to a level before unheard of in my 2 years messing with these boards.
everyone needs a healthy does of restraint and respect in this thread, and if I dont take a step back, I'll probably do something I'll regret. please play nice, and have fun while I'm gone.
-chet
baka.
I'm only going to say this one last time, then this is locked.
OFFSET AND BACKSPACING ARE TWO WAYS OF STATING THE SAME THING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
christ. I'm sick of people debating "haivng both" or that one is better than the other///THEY'RE THE SAME THING.
this is locked, I'm going to boston.
I suggest everyone take a step back, and think about what they;re posting before throwing things up there, this thread has managed to anger me to a level before unheard of in my 2 years messing with these boards.
everyone needs a healthy does of restraint and respect in this thread, and if I dont take a step back, I'll probably do something I'll regret. please play nice, and have fun while I'm gone.
-chet